Are Modern History Books based on a fraud?

Discussion in 'The Hangout' started by thePENofGODx0x0xz7, Jun 16, 2016.

Are Modern History Books based on a fraud? 5 5 1votes
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  1. thePENofGODx0x0xz7

    thePENofGODx0x0xz7 New Member
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    Are the history books that are held in such high regard in our schools accurate? I often hear that the civilization that overthrew another, being the victory rewrote history in a way that was partial to their customs and beliefs. That being said, can we trust popular history as told to us in modern text books?
     
  2. Arboreal

    Arboreal Active Member
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    Answering the question int the title, not really. School textbooks are often (mostly?) biased to show the history of the nation in a more positive light, and of course, every author has their personal worldview which they can't shake off completely, but their community of historians as a whole keeps this in check. "History told by the victors" is much less of a problem than people assume, since history researchers are trained to be very sceptical of their narrative sources, and besides, back then, when people were writing with a agenda, they did it in a very transparent way, making it easy for a more sceptical reader. For instance, the whole "crazy Nero" stuff from Tacitus and others, which historains today recognize as telling us more about teh views of the roman aristocrats than Nero's actual mental state. Second big thing is that history nowadays does not depend chiefly on narrative sources (chronicles, annals etc.), which are indeed highly biased and subjective, but also on stuff like official, private and commercial documents, and finally, results of archaelogical excavations. Both of them are more or less free of personal agenda.
     
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  3. Keith H.

    Keith H. Moderator Staff Member
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    I would not trust any history book as far as I could spit a rat. For instance, youth in Germany are taught that the Holocaust never happened!!! Being a Living Historian & experimental archaeologist, I am guided only by primary documentation. Tertiary & secondary information has to be backed up by further research & can not be trusted.
    Keith.
     
  4. ZoeZoundBarrier

    ZoeZoundBarrier Member
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    Jeez, that is a travesty. How is this even lawful. There should be some type of legal action that can be taken against such a heinous act. Its bad enough that most politics are full of war criminals that get away with mass murder, they shouldn't be allowed to murder history too.
     
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  5. ZoeZoundBarrier

    ZoeZoundBarrier Member
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    The books are a sham, if you want to find out what really happened then you will have to rely on other sources. There are countless historians that prove the establishment's account of what really happened, wrong everyday. Despite this fact, they still do nothing to change the defected information. I advise that you do your own research. The college professors are paid off, if they say anything that diverts from common academia they might lose their jobs so you can never rely on anything that they say.
     
  6. Endure

    Endure Expert Member
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    As far as I know, In Germany do teach almost all the truth about WWII and the holocaust. The japanese are the ones that don't teach all the truth about their heinous involvement with the axis. Anyway, there is a lot of bias and inconsistencies that generally to be a good historian or in order to be well informed you have to do some thorough research with original sources or replicas and then perform analysis to obtain your own conclusions.
     
  7. Arkane

    Arkane Master Survivalist
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    Most history books are mostly accurate and biased.
    None can be taken word for word
    History books should be read with an experienced and critical mind!
    Not a young nieve mind!
    The bible comes to mind here, not a bad history book but not to be taken literally as there is bull mixed with truth and it takes a critical intelligent experienced mind to sort it!
     
  8. DecMikashimota

    DecMikashimota New Member
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    It is imperative to have multiple sources when you are doing chronological research. Look for the book that is written closest to the time frame you are researching. Have a few lexicons and authoritative dictionaries that are legitimate and know how to utilize the appendix reference section while using the dating technique with the goal that you can question certain words and implications. The younger a term is the more unrealistic it is to think that you can trust it as a dependable source on that subject unless it is a word that demonstrates the landing of something particular that happened in history hence agrees with the day and age you are examining. Most importantly, to comprehend history you must travel. You will need to observe many of the destinations that history is describing so that you are looking into it for yourself on a personal level that will help you make more sense of the experiences described. keyword: etymology. Now that was redundant.
     
  9. DecMikashimota

    DecMikashimota New Member
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    It is imperative to have multiple sources when you are doing chronological research. Look for the book that is written closest to the time frame you are researching. Have a few lexicons and authoritative dictionaries that are legitimate and know how to utilize the appendix reference section while using the dating technique with the goal that you can question certain words and implications. The younger a term is the more unrealistic it is to think that you can trust it as a dependable source on that subject unless it is a word that demonstrates the landing of something particular that happened in history hence agrees with the day and age you are examining. Most importantly, to comprehend history you must travel. You will need to observe many of the destinations that history is describing so that you are looking into it for yourself on a personal level that will help you make more sense of the experiences described.
     
  10. hades_leae

    hades_leae Active Member
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    I met a man who told me a story about America and some other country that I can't remember, these stories were in the school books. He told me what really happened because he was there, but the things he said that happened were by contract meant to be secret, that changed my view yet again towards my country because I understand now why a nation would not tell children what really happened, and also how deceiving governments are.

    Just like you see in war movies, they show you what goes on in the war, but tell the media something else to keep the people calm, also the missions themselves are most of the time not ethical, but soldiers sign papers saying that they did the missions the way they were supposed to.

    Perfect example of this deceit, "Sicario", starring the very beautiful Emily Blunt, great movie by the way. "Green Zone", starring Matt Damon, also another movie that shows how war is handled but you don't hear about things like this in real life, you only hear that we won which is all that's supposed to matter to the public, not how we won. The federal government does not want people to know what it really does with our military, it just wants the people to know they are safe.
     
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  11. Arboreal

    Arboreal Active Member
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    Not sure how you got that idea, but that's far from truth actually. I know a numer of people from Germany, Holocaust and World War 2 in general are well covered in school history lessions there. They even travel to see Auschwitz museum when in high school. And on top of that, denying that Holocaust happened is actually illegal in Germany - there have been cases when people were prosecuted for that.
     
  12. ZoeZoundBarrier

    ZoeZoundBarrier Member
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    I am tempted to ask you exactly what information was about, but I know that you will decline. Either way, I am always appreciative to hear that at least one person heard it from the horse's mouth.

    As they say, All is fair in love and war. I can only imagine how cut throat our military must be. I have had a few friends that have come back really messed up after serving in the service. They never tell us everything, but whenever you see military personnel you have to tip your hat to them even if you don't agree with the wars or the fact that the Govt. hides the info.

    I just wish that information that is helpful to the citizens to the United States or any country would not be kept from us just because of its affiliation with events that might've taken place in war.
     
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2016
  13. glreese

    glreese Member
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    The first thing I was taught in my college history classes is that all History books are biased. It is impossible to just relay the facts without biased. Biased can found in what is written, or even what is left out of the book. American History books depict something very different between Japanese History books concerning events like World War 2. That is why it is best to review several different points of view before jumping to conclusions about history.
     
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  14. willywonka

    willywonka Member
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    I don't really think of it as fraud, I think of it as men withholding information and not writing down the accurate portrayal of what happened. It isn't totally inaccurate, but you should take it with a grain of salt because it is a story that has been passed down.
     
  15. djordjem87

    djordjem87 Member
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    I do not know for elsewhere but in Serbia it has been very misty. Example of this is partisans versus cetnics. Both fought against Hitler's Germany but both had fractions that were assimilating with Germany's side. However, after the end of the war, those people who were partisans had majority in forming the new government and they had some grudges against the cetnics unit. As a result, in school books cetnics were pointed out as Hitler's collaborators. After that tables turned and now they are both acknowledged as freedom fighters but people still have some doubts.
     
  16. GS AutoTech

    GS AutoTech Expert Member
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    In my short time in this life I have seen many parts of history altered, suppressed or generally mischaracterized. I've also become aware that many people view history with a modernist point of view. That is when we see, judge, criticize & form opinions based on how we see or "Feel " things today rather than understanding how things were "Then" factually.
    Mix that with an altered presentation, a few alternate facts and you have totally rewritten history.
    Facts are facts, Facts are nither good or evil. They are the truth. The truth can be very ugly & often is. That's a fact.
    I feel there is a corruption of real historical facts & is ultimately very Dangerous. For if you can't effectively learn from history, larger more catastrophic mistakes will be made.
    IMHO
     
  17. Ystranc

    Ystranc Expert Member
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    I would say fraud is too stronger word but certainly words like propaganda and bias would applicable.
    I've found that reading history books written from different perspectives can help. It's also better to go to the source material rather then a subsequent"interpretation" of that material.
     
  18. Old Geezer

    Old Geezer Master Survivalist
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    History's misrepresentation -- and the inaccuracies can be enormous -- has two core origins 1) The writers weren't there and have next to zero context for those times; 2) Overt bias.

    The influence of the religion of Political Correctness on university campuses of Western nations is such that the balanced reporting of any set of "facts" is jeopardized. I've seen medical research biased due to the push for nationalized medicine in the United States. Emotions dissolve Reason.

    As to the "You weren't there" effect on the creation of history books, I do not believe that this phenomenon be overstated. By definition, we weren't there. Think about your environment and how your behaviors are shaped by those things that perpetually impinge upon you. Which resources are available and non-available to you? What means of communications are available to you? What is the level of scientific knowledge in the era in which you exist ( here today, science has gotten prideful beyond measure, yet the physicists of today are going crazy as they observe a Bizarre universe that is being "perceived" into existence). On and on, you and I and our ancestors and our progeny are enabled and are disabled by whatever world it is we find ourselves. In the early 1800s, the American Navy fought sea battles thousands of miles away and knew not who the newly-elected president was. Today, communications is limited by the human nervous system and the speed of light. Tomorrow we will be exploring our galaxy and communicate beyond the speed of light via dimensions of the universe that permit transmissions of intelligence and even packets of energy that can be "slowed" back into material objects.

    Trust a history book based on how many letters are contained therein. Read the letters of the leaders, the principals, the yeomen. Give me the weather reports of those days. Tell me what they had to eat and drink -- if they had such, were they thirsty, were they hungry? What weapons were available to them? What tools did they have? Those making decisions, how went their private lives -- was their world in order, or had they just lost a loved one? Such are the bricks of history. If you are a writer of history, spare me the attitude of the person around whom your book revolves, for truly sir, you likely do not know him.

    Of history we surmise. "Knowledge" is a thin concept.
     
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2017
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  19. GS AutoTech

    GS AutoTech Expert Member
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    I was indeed fortunate to have a history teacher who had us read the names & dates & timelines presented in books, then gave the class a context thru which we could interpret that information. The facts of names, dates & events were in clear print. The context gave us a feel for the situation. If you had the where with all to place yourself within that context, the actual history made sense. You could almost become part of that history & the evolution since then.
    That inherent context has strengthened my resolve in that the events taking place today are way way out of whack.
    I do consider alot of presented information today a biased, contorted, or even flat out fraud.
     
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  20. Old Geezer

    Old Geezer Master Survivalist
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    Here in the USA, members of both the far-left and the far-right are pathetic. The Antifa make for poor communist revolutionaries. And these theoretic KKK-ers and wanne-be NAZI dweebs are simply not up to the task -- it's as if Woody Allen were to don an SS outfit with helmet. I mean, these losers are not even darkly humorous.

    And the mainstream media takes them seriously. What a reach! Sad. Do better.

    The riots in America, pathetic though they may be, are going to lead to violence. Charlottesville represents a clash event that set-off a mentally unstable young man who used his car as a crushing device (someone slammed his car with a brick and the nut went into blind rage mode).

    Racial clashes in America are going to lead to uber-violence. One one side or the other or simultaneously, gunfire is going to erupt, and street warfare is inevitable. Arson America has seen, however the scale of arson and overt shooting battles are going to start looking like war, because it WILL become war.

    These conflicts are not going to be able to be contained. Given the growth and malignancy rates seen today, one can readily extrapolate this crap into REAL trouble. Add other chaotic events such as economic collapse, natural disasters, military attacks on urban areas from terrorists or fill-in-the-blank world enemies, and we're going to see people losing what little sanity they have left. One could say that Unity could be born of this, however it would be a profoundly naive person hoping for good to come of the jostling of society at this point. Unfortunately, madness seems to have taken the field. How mind-numbingly unfortunate.
     
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2017
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  21. GS AutoTech

    GS AutoTech Expert Member
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    I'm trying really hard to "Zoom out" to see the bigger picture. How are these clashes being set into motion? Who benefits? Who is encouraging it and or doing little or nothing to stop it? Who are being blamed & who are being championed?
    I personally don't believe any of this is accidental happenstance.
    And tragically, there was loss of life.
     
  22. Keith H.

    Keith H. Moderator Staff Member
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    I strongly believe, as many others do also, that many of these situations are in fact orchestrated by the government. There are just too many grey areas & too many things that don't add up to make these situations just random events. Persons with seemingly no contacts & no money somehow acquiring firearms & body armour & shooting innocent people for no apparent reason. This has happened in America & Australia. Criminals are being released ahead of schedule or are given light sentences or no sentencing at all. Some criminal behavour such as hostage situations or the mowing down of pedestrians by vehicles have been deliberately allowed to continue for maximum damage. Multiple gun control measures aimed solely at law abiding firearms owners instead of criminals, the banning of purchasing, carrying & using of anything for the purpose of self defence, even non lethal items such as pepper spray & paint markers to identify the attacker/s.

    The government needs to control it's citizens, so it has to find a way in which it can do this by using non violent measures (except perhaps in north Korea & other dictatorship countries) to do this. One way is to slowly, one at a time, take away our rights & freedoms & introduce laws that will give the police more powers of intrusion & arrest. Another way is with a terror campaign, keep the people scared & make them believe that their only chance for safety lies in the government.

    Society is fractured, groups are separated, individuals can not instigate any anti government actions or even protest against the actions of powerful corporations without being arrested or killed. Society has brought this on itself through the shear greed for more & more of what it considers essential for living the "good life". It has signed a contract with the "Devil" & now there is no way of backing out. The government is delivering to the wealthy & the large powerful corporations. Laws are bent to suit, blind eyes are turned, taxes are avoided, environment issues are swept under the carpet, & all for money & power at the expense of the common people.
    Keith.
     
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  23. Ystranc

    Ystranc Expert Member
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    Even if governments don't actually orchestrate the violence or disorder they certainly take full advantage of any opportunity to chip away our rights and freedoms.
     
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  24. TexDanm

    TexDanm Master Survivalist
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    The history books are mostly a pack of lies that are rewritten and changed every couple of generations. Each country tries to make themselves look as good as possible and their enemies look as bad as possible and the cause of the problem. After a few generations when all those involved are gone they toss out any semblance of reality and just make it into history by legends.
     
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  25. TexDanm

    TexDanm Master Survivalist
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    The rewriting is necessitated because as a cultures morals and customs change the historical pablum has to be made palatable for the current upcoming generation by the standards of the preceding generation. As an example there is almost nothing left about the American civil war that is factual. For a single quick example "Lincoln freed the slaves with the Emancipation Proclamation. " The FACT is that this proclamation didn't free a single slave and was totally a propaganda item of no actual force. The Emancipation Proclamation ONLY freed the slaves in the Confederacy over which he had no control. It did NOT free the slaves in the 5 slave holding states that were still a part of the union over which he DID have authority. YES the Union had slave holding states in it and slavery wasn't what the civil war was about but that is another lie and story.
     
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  26. GS AutoTech

    GS AutoTech Expert Member
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    Correct. It was an early Federal over reach into states rights. Not that slavery was in any way good or justifiable. But the states had rights to make & follow their own laws to which the Union sought to override. The Constitution had & still has no provisions for any state to secede. Because it doesnt say a state cannot secede, the South believed it could leave the Union. The Union claimed secession was illegal & fought to recapture those states. The issue of slavery was just one component of the situation. Lincoln's original plan for reconstruction, peaceful & kind reintegration, was tossed aside after his death. Johnson proceeded to punish the South. And gave birth to much longstanding animosity.
     
  27. TexDanm

    TexDanm Master Survivalist
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    Lincoln was the first Republican. UNDERSTAND We live in the United States of America and NOT NEVER the Republic of America for a reason! This is a battle that is still being fought and is undecided.
     
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  28. omegaman

    omegaman Well-Known Member
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    I was told my ancestors were bloodthirsty barbarians and raiders. When Im out in the woods I often walk in to picture stones, runestones and such, telling stories about the sun and the moon and strong children and mothers being killed by church-men.
    Christianity has a way of wanting to cover their own bloodtracks.
    I read a book called Fatherland a couple of years ago where it is the 1980-ies and the nazis won WW2 and how their history was written. Interresting book.

    I remember for a fact a couple of events I know has been rewritten allready. There was a ferry disaster in the Baltic when I was a kid. The days before the news had been reporting that this new missile was to be moved to Sweden. Then something happened (blew up?) on the ferry and it sank and alot of people died in the black and cold waters that night and the missile system was never heard of again.
    The prime minister of Sweden was closing bonds with the DDR. It was on the news and everybody was talking about it. Then, the PM was murdered. And the DDR-connection just blew away and was never heard of again.
     
  29. TexDanm

    TexDanm Master Survivalist
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    The thing that people now refuse to understand is that you can't truly judge people that are not a part of your culture. Morals and right and wrong change according to the culture that you live in. In order to understand a person you must first have a reality based understanding of their culture and the world that they live in. This applies not only to people from other places but also to people from different times. Young people today have almost nothing in common with their grandparents much less their Great Grand parents. They don't understand most of history and it has to be rewritten because if it is not they would be as horrified by the actions of their ancestors as they are of the enemies that they may have fought.

    By today's standards my Grandfathers were cruel and unforgiving men. Their ideas of honor included many things that today are considered criminal. It was legal in Texas until relatively recently to kill a man if you caught him in bed with your wife. There was NO acceptable excuse for killing someone that was not actively trying to harm you...then it was manslaughter. If you were crazy and didn't know what you were doing that was just too bad.

    Many of our ancestors owned slaves and just because you are black doesn't preclude you from that possibility. Where my family came from there were several black families that were wealthy and owns lots of slaves. These people were not monsters they were just people of their time. The people that fought with the native Americans and those same Native Americans themselves we a savage people but not evil or bad. They were one and all living as people of their time lived. Now days it is vogue to make the European people that came to the Americas sound like monsters but the native Americans that they replaced were far from the peaceful pastoral people that they are portrayed as today.

    Even in today's world people have no understanding of others. We will be at war with the people of the middle east as long as we try to force the various Islamic countries to have a Christian Democracy that they don't understand the concept of. History will be written by the winners or at least by each country as they see it. I assure you that the part that Americans have played in it will not look like the good guys in their history books.
     
  30. watcherchris

    watcherchris Member
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    I don't know if I buy into this one TexDanm...

    Talk about history being rewritten or ignored....counting on peoples ignorance of history ....I've seen this one happen a lot and even by one of our Presidents in the Blame Game......so often used by his administration to divide and conquer Americans by the Guilt Manipulation political technique so popular today.

    What President Obama did in several speeches was to place blame on the Crusades and Christianity for much of todays Middle East troubles.

    What most people do not know and will never be taught to them via public school and history ...is that the Muslims were on the move and invading Europe in the late 600s AD and into the 700s AD where they were stopped way up in France at a city ...still there today..called Tours. The Battle of Tours it is called in the history books and they were stopped by a Frankish leader named Charles Martel..or Charles the Hammer as he is sometimes called.

    This event took place some 300 years before the first Crusade. But you have to know this to follow the lie.

    Battle of Tours...https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Tours


    There are other events for which the history has been ignored or altered for government / political reasons of "Herding " the public conscience and understanding.

    I have two interesting books never championed by the controlled school curriculum which tell a very different story about the American Civil War and it's after math.


    This One Mad Act ...by Izolla Forrester...the grand daughter of John Wilkes Booth.

    https://www.radcliffe.harvard.edu/s...d-act-unknown-story-john-wilkes-booth-and-his

    https://www.amazon.com/This-Story-Wilkes-Booth-Family/dp/B0000D5IYZ

    Now this book was 150 dollars when I bought it for my private collection. I was astonished at how much it has gone up in price today. I believe the supply and also the demand for this book as more people become aware of it's existence are driving up the price.

    What Izolla Forrester researched, as a news reporter, is that her grandfather did not die in the barn after the assassination of Abraham Lincoln as is in the official repots/books.

    He escaped and certain people in government knew this ...and a reward had already been paid out for Booth's death.

    She reports, via her investigative skills as a reporter, that John Wilkes Booth, her grandfather, dies in Ceylon, India in 1879. Her grandmother then returned back to America to live out here life in silence. As she grew up...almost no one in her family ever spoke of her grandfather. Only later in her life when she had acquired reporters investigative skills...did she note this absence of speaking on her Grandfather ..John Wilkes Booth and decide to investigate for herself.


    Mr.. Secretary by Ben Ames Williams.

    Mr. Secretary is the auto biography of Edwin Stanton the Secretary of War for Abraham Lincoln during and after the American Civil War written under the pen name of Ben Ames Williams.

    This book was released to the public in 1940...some 70 years after the death of Edwin Stanton.

    In this book Edwin Stanton describes the treason he did to cause many of the Civil War's battles to go to the South in the early days of the war. How he schemed against Lincoln....on the Peninsula Campaign..even after Gettysburg to allow Lee and his army to get back across the Potomac River without pursuit by General Mede.

    Also how he knew there was going to be an attempt on Lincoln's life and safety and how he did noting on that night...in April of 1865. How he was invited to sit in the Presidents box in Ford's theater and declined. He also told US Grant who was also invited that he declined the invitation....and suggested US Grant do the same. Grant went to New Jersey instead.

    How he watched Lincoln give up the ghost in that bed to where he was taken across the street..knowing what he had done to manipulate the war.

    This is the kind of stuff you will never get through the curriculum of most history classes.


    I have also read a book years ago which was not PC as one of the other members here spoke.

    This book is titled

    Black Confederates and Afro Yankees in Civil War Virginia by Ervin L. Jordan.

    https://www.goodreads.com/book/show...erates_and_Afro_Yankees_in_Civil_War_Virginia


    This book was an eye opener verses the blame game so prevalent today in news and history . It was written by a black professor at a prominent Virginia College. And the black groups were up in arms about it for not conforming to the PC political racism narrative they are pushing on an uneducated untutored public.

    What Ervin Jordan does is to insert information in his book which expands on the truth of what happened and that a lot of this historical trivia is politically missing from our understanding and knowledge in order to more easily control or herd public thinking for political capital. "Political/Social Herding."

    With this book Ervin Jordan stepped out of the Herd.

    Well I hope some of you get the picture...there are numerous other books which are an eye-opener and many of them are not promoted or authorized by main stream education or media.

    This only further raised my suspicions and mistrust of our media and also public education systems....and with this...also politics financing public education...and heavily in bed with the media...incestuously so.


    Thanks,
    Watcherchris.

    Not an Ishmaelite.
     
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  31. TexDanm

    TexDanm Master Survivalist
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    History is written by the winners. That is just the way it works. Also history is written to the point of view of the potential audience and readers. The point of view of the losers is never a part of the history books printed for the winners to read.

    Schools, especially the history part is mostly propaganda and indoctrination rather than a factual statement of facts. Most of what they teach is of little use and American history at least is mostly made up of lies. I don't know what they teach else where but I will bet ya that the British view of the American revolutionary war and the War of 1812 is drastically different.

    It is funny that you mentioned John Wilkes Booth. He and Lincoln are two people that are viewed in very different ways depending on where you live and how much history that you have truly looked into. Nearly everything that you read about Lincoln is a lie made up after his death much like Kennedy. In many places Booth is seen as a hero that saved the Union by killing the monster that wanted to tear it asunder. Very few people understand what the Republican party of that time was about. We don't live in the Republic of America we live in the United STATES of America. He was a part of a group that wanted to take away state rights and move us to a totally central government where Washington would tell everyone what to do. Lincoln's Vice President was a Virginian Democrat. Lincoln planned on destroying the South and making them second class citizens without any power. Once he was dead Johnson started the process of reuniting the Union and bringing the Southern states back into the union. They tried to impeach him for this but were unsuccessful.

    Lincoln is most famous for freeing the slaves and the thing most often pointed to as proof of this was his Emancipation Proclamation. What is never taught or mentioned is that the Emancipation Proclamation didn't free one single slave. Not ONE!! It only "freed" the slaves in the Confederate states over which he had no say while leaving the slave in the 5 slaveholding states that had stayed in the union enslaved and specifically NOT freed.
     
  32. GS AutoTech

    GS AutoTech Expert Member
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    So we can all agree that most of history as we know it, or how it's been pounded into our brains, has been altered, skewed or flat lied about.
    In this age of information overload it's difficult to even discover all of the information needed to form solid opinion. It could take a lifetime of gathering, absorbing & disseminating information. Sifting & sorting all the lies. Dealing with the knowledge of betrayal contained in those lies.
    If,if,if you could get all those lies out into the public it would at a minimum upset our perception of history. From there and onward those lies exposed would tear at the very fabric of society.
     
  33. watcherchris

    watcherchris Member
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    Agree with what TexDanm states..in that history is written by the winners.

    I have in my private collection a number of books written by a Harvard Professor....who was later blacklisted for so obviously getting to close to the truth.

    This professors name is Anthony Sutton.

    What Professor Sutton did was to further study and build on the work of John Stormer in "None dare call it Treason" and also Gary Allen in "None Dare Call it Conspiracy."

    His titles...and research is very very good...
    Here.

    National Suicide.....Military Aid to the Soviet Union

    The War on Gold

    Wall Street and the Bolshevik Revolution

    Wall Street and the Rise of Adolph Hitler

    Wall Street and FDR.

    He has numerous other titles since these came out...but these in particularl I have in hard cover version.

    The pattern I noted from these books which I did not get from None Dare Call it Treason and None Dare Call it Conspiracy ...is that the US State Department tends to run as an Independent Agency ....within the Executive Branch of government and that the CIA is the military arm of the State Department.
    Also that the US State Department is a very very important arm of the DEEP STATE government and there to support the DEEP STATE...their power and profits.....not Americans or America.

    This message comes out clearly in Professor Suttons books.

    Over the years Professor Sutton became persona non grata in American Publishing Houses...he had to get his materials published in Australia.

    This is what happens when one gets to close to the truth.


    I was not at all surprised at what happened in the Obama Administration and with Hillary in the State Department having read Anthony Suttons books as well as John Stormer and Gary Allen.


    I have also read Major George Racy Jordan"s book "From Major Racy's Diary." In his book he describes the amount and type of material goods which were flown from Major Jordans post in Great Falls, Montana during the second world war.

    What Major Jordan tells is that so much technology was transferred to the Soviets during the war..including printing presses ink and the special paper to print US Paper money....

    Also what was clearly shipped was nuclear materials to Russia at a time when we ourselves only had so much of this material for our research. It is we who gave the Soviets their technology for their Nuclear Bomb and still they could not get it together until 1949.

    I was not at all surprised at the transfer of technology to Communist China during the Clinton Administration ...ICBM technology and know how. Professor Anthony Sutton had very well covered this pattern in my mind and soul.

    None of this could have happened without the knowledge of the White House and the US State Department...both in WW2 and with the Clinton Administration.

    These books connected a lot of dots for me over time in the strange conduct of our government ...some things became predictable in the political process if you know this concealed history.

    That is my main point....know the concealed history that no one wants you to know...while they keep you distracted with such stuff a sports gods/idols and or the Kardashians...et al.


    Hope this helps some of you,

    Watcherchris

    Not an Ishmaelite.
     
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  34. TexDanm

    TexDanm Master Survivalist
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    History is basically the public view of what happened. What really happened is usually well hidden to protect the survivors from looking bad. Just as a quick example. The USS Indianapolis was sunk with great loss of life near the end of the war. That's the one where the sharks ate so many of the sailors as mentioned in the Movie Jaws.

    The Captain was courtmartialed and punished for losing his ship even though he had been assured that he was going to be in safe water. The FACT is that they KNEW that the subs were there and KNEW that his ship would be taken by Japanese subs. It destroyed him. He died in shame never knowing the truth. In 2000 he was posthumously exonerated and his record cleared of any responsibility for the disaster.

    We had broken the Japs codes and knew basically EVERYTHING. They were afraid that if they had warned the Indianapolis off that the Japs might figure it out so they let them go and die and THEN to keep up the lie they had to court martial that poor Capitan...And THEN they kept it secret until all involved were basically dead. THAT IS HISTORY.

    Just for Ha Ha over the next few years it is going to come out that Lee Harvey Oswald was a CIA operative in the 50s. Get ready for a rewrite of that history. More forbidden history, The Japanese had detonated an Atomic Bomb before we bombed them. We just beat them to the punch by a few months. The history about FDR, Pearl Harbor and the US getting into the war is slowly coming out. The truth is we were already at war it was just covert. FDR needed something big to get the declaration of war past a mostly isolationist congress.
     
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  35. tominwash

    tominwash Member
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    Can you believe historical works? IMO prior to about 1970 yes. Political correctness has completely taken them over. It is all about how the book makes little Johnny "feel" now.

    My formal background was in history. I have several books out on my area, Mesoamerican pre-columbian.

    I published works using no reference material post about 1980 and put in the forward why. I still get hate mail.

    For example, during the great famine of the 1300s in what is today Mexico, the starving was so bad people were selling themselves into slavery for the going rate of seven ears of corn. Human teeth marks are found on great piles of bones unearthed from the ruins upon which Mexico City today is built upon.

    Try writing about it here in the US see how far you get.

    History today is sanitized, you can't believe a thing in a formal text book. Seriously.

    Speaking of the seven ears of corn. It is a surprising measurement of the value of a human life when starvation sets in. If you look to similar circumstances throughout history crossing oceans and ears, it is the standard value. Extrapolate into todays terms, taking into account a basic measurement of inflation......no, forget it. It will still be about seven ears of corn if things get bad enough.
     
    1. watcherchris
      You know tominwash...I was surprised to read in an article on Ancient Egyptian tomb finds...that in one of the jars in a tomb which was opened that a powdery substance was found. When analyzed it turned out to be cocaine.

      The problem as I understand it...is that the plant from which cocaine is produced does not grow in Africa and in particular.....back in those days. It only grew in South America.

      This puts an unusual twist on the history of how it got to ancient Egypt. Someone got it transported to Egypt for it to be found in a tomb.

      It appears that someone knew how to ship and trans ship cargo across the Atlantic Ocean....before the middle ages. Mostly I have heard only silence on this awareness.

      Thanks,
      WatcherChris.
       
      watcherchris, Nov 24, 2017
  36. watcherchris

    watcherchris Member
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    There is a very interesting military book out of which most people know nothing...

    It is titled "Boyd" by Robert Coram

    In this book Robert Coram describes the coming of age in thinking of John Boyd within the military establishment and his being assigned to various air force bases...often to get rid of him...as he was definitely not PC in those days.

    He became a very accomplilshed Instructor in fighters at Nellis AFB where he became known as "Forth Second Boyd" for being able to get on someone elses six within 40 seconds and gunning them down.

    As John Boyd went to college to further his degree...he began to theorize that the design of an aircraft related to maneuverability could be broken down to mathematics/physics for the best maneuvering aircraft in a dogfight.
    This had never before been done to this extent for which he was envisioning.

    He began covertly stealing Air Force computer time to run his data parameters in the days of punch cards ..when computer time was a very valuable commodity. John Boyd ran the data parameters for all US fighter designs as well as Soviet designs.

    What the data was to tell him...was that the Soviet fighters on the average were more maneuverable in a dogfight than were our American designed and built fighters. Boyd designed a briefing by which he was to brief the top Air Force Generals....much to their ire..and the ire of the air craft building companies in bed with the Air Force....and the Pentagon.

    Vietnam was to prove this out as a fact.
    Also Vietnam was to prove that our dependence on missiles was wrong...our missiles back then were very unreliable and most of our fighters had no gun. Some PC political hack guru had decided that in the day of the missile .. a gun was obsolete and no longer needed in our fighter aircraft.

    The tell tale of this truth is that the gun is back on the F 15, F16, The F 22 and the F 35.


    Robert Coram goes on to say that the Israelis did not miss out on this lesson and continued to train their fighter pilots on their aerial gunnery. To an Israeli pilot ...a gun kill is a higher honor than a missile kill. The Israelis knew that our missile technology in those days was unreliable. But the Israelis were careful about not insulting us with this knowledge as they were heavily dependent on us for aircraft designs. This knowledge was carefully kept from the average American by our own government and military.


    But one of Boyd's most famous achievements ...was his discovery that aircraft maneuvering by design....losing and regaining energy quickly and going back on the move...applies not only to dogfighting aircraft but to ground troops as well.
    Boyd studied all the great land generals to note the difference in their strategies. This Chinese fellow...Sun Tsu was one of his favorites for military thinking.
    Boyd realized that ground troops should not get bogged down trying to take heavily fortified lines.....and such areas..but bypass them quickly and go for the main objective. These heavily fortified places were to be taken by aircraft and artillery bombardment...and for the most part...bypassed. The main objective is what counts...not these side battles.

    This knowledge and practice/training was heavily taken up by the US Marine Corps and it showed up in the First Gulf War. Norman Schwarzkopf's first plan was t o go right up the middle and take on Saddam's heaviest fortified places.

    According to Robert Coram ....by this time Dick Cheny had gotten the ear of certain strategists and has been briefed personally by John Boyd and liked his approach to fewer casualties. For Boyd's strategy had been proven in miniature in the invasion of the island of Grenada.

    Schwarzkopf's Hail Mary plan is a variation of what John Boyd taught. The first Gulf War went down so quickly because it was a technological adaptation of John Boyd's energy maneuvering strategy applied to ground troops.

    This pattern of energy maneuvering was repeated again in the Second Gulf War.


    What came out of Boyd's Energy Maneuvering Studies.....in the Aircraft field was the design of the F 15 and also the F 16.

    The F 16 came about because Boyd and his associates "The Fighter Mafia " realized that the F 15 was too expensive and the Air Force was messing with the design trying to make it a do all airplane...like the failed F 111 fighter bomber.

    Another of John Boyd's accolites...Pierre Sprey was to go on to the design team which was to produce one of the most liked and successful ground attack aircraft of today...the A 10 Thunderbolt.

    To illustrate how backwards the military bureaucracy can operate in their purchasing habits....the Air Force top brass where heavily against the F16 and the A 10 programs and tried to kill both of them off.

    To this day the military is trying to go back to very expensive and overly complex aircraft such as the F 22 and the F 35 aircraft.

    Pierre Sprey speaks of this in his U tube videos on the F 35 design.


    Here is Robert Coram"s book on John Boyd.

    https://www.amazon.com/Boyd-Fighter...1?ie=UTF8&qid=1511531896&sr=8-1&keywords=Boyd


    Nonetheless...Boyd by Robert Coram describes how we have gotten where we are militarily in spite of the PC politics of the day and continuing right now....today.

    What Robert Coram's book also does is give a look at the perverted backwards view of politics often carefully cultivated and promoted for the purpose of profiting certain businesses/industries because of their political connections...not the quality of their products. Politically connected businesses with the ear of Washington DC and the Pentagon....and this so obviously and still going on today.

    I found it to be an interesting historical read....with applications today.

    My .02 again

    Watcherchris

    Not an Ishmaelite.
     
  37. Ystranc

    Ystranc Expert Member
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    "Boyd realized that ground troops should not get bogged down trying to take heavily fortified lines.....and such areas..but bypass them quickly and go for the main objective. These heavily fortified places were to be taken by aircraft and artillery bombardment...and for the most part...bypassed. The main objective is what counts...not these side battles."

    I think you should give a little more credit to Napoleon who was one of the earliest to use this tactic in modern warfare.

    While some who make great advances do so by standing on the shoulders of giants, Boyd did so by standing on the shoulders of a very short Frenchmano_O
     
  38. watcherchris

    watcherchris Member
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    LOL LOL LOL...Ystranc,

    Of course you cannot study military plans and strategy without studying Napoleon Bonaparte. Another name is Carl Von Clausewitz. Another name of a eastern warrior king is also mentioned in Boyds book...but escapes me at the moment.
    Heinz Guderian the German Blitzkrieg tank commander and his strategies is another studied.

    What was a surprise for me to learn and for which until reading Robert Coram's book....is that the order or march...the ability to feed a Army on the move ...many of these records exist going back to horse drawn days and the difficulties of moving such an Army...what they went through to so do in those days as compared to today.

    All of this is studied in it's very small details and then re examined under the auspices of any new technology and it's applications.
    And so too it was with John Boyd and his Theory of Energy Maneuverability....not just for aircraft but ground troops as well.

    Boyd was to realize that he needed to study these great historical commanders....why they were successful and why at times they were not.

    I only mention that John Boyd tended to favor Sun Tsu more than most of the western commanders. But he did read of their accounts and works...definitely.


    I may have this wrong...but I believe it was Napolean Bonaparte who made extensive use and development of what today is called the Commissary system of keeping an Army clothed and fed...rather than turning his army loose at times to forage and loot the country side as was so often done by armys back then. This was a new development in those days.

    Thanks,
    Watchercris
     
  39. TexDanm

    TexDanm Master Survivalist
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    Basically "History" is rewritten every 25 years or so as far as what is taught in schools. Part of the reason is that people see things differently as a culture changes. An example of what I'm talking about. When my daughter was a little kiddo in elementary school she came home one day sad. When I pressed her about what was bothering her she started to cry 1and told me that she wished that she could be a great American someday but she couldn't because she was white. The Black History month that never seemed to end was just mostly about white bashing rather than actually talking about the real contributions made by Black Americans in the past. We bugged out in 1988 in part because of this sort of cultural change. The Black Kids were basically being taught in the schools that they were being mistreated because they were black and it was all because white people were holding them down.

    The fact that many of them were from one parent families that were made up of 6 or 7 kids from 4 or 5 fathers none of whom supported their kids couldn't have anything to do with it. My Mom bought her some cute special pencils once. They were taken from her by the black teacher because it wasn't fair for her to have nice things that her classmates couldn't afford. Every day she came home with little nubs of pencils even though we bought a new box of them every couple of weeks. We even got notes from the teacher telling us that we needed to provide our daughter with more pencils. Basically because she was white we were required to provide school supplies for the entire class.

    That culture of entitlement and blaming all the problems on white people led to today's racial problems. I was actually raised to be mostly color blind as far as race goes. Unfortunately that is just not allowed any more. If you try to treat a black person like you would a white person they will be offended and feel like you are discriminating against them. You are SUPPOSED to treat them a LOT better than you would a white person!!
     
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  40. watcherchris

    watcherchris Member
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    TexDanm,

    I am what is called a Heinz 57...a mutt. None of that stuff means anything to me. I don't owe anyone anything by race, sex., sexual orientation or any other nonsense someone wants to put on my back as a guilt maneuver to control or herd me.

    That is what they are trying to do to your daughter and any other child in school today. They have gone from teaching against racism to promoting open racism by race.

    I do not approve of people doing such ..because I happen to think that people are more than race, sex, sexual orientation, and anything else someone wants to "Manufacture " to burden onto our backs for political capital. I realized during the early parts of the Obama Administration that it was open season for racism and it would be promoted by the White House. Open racism was going to be the very best they would ever have....while people were out of work...and they did nothing.

    I don't have any use or respect for a racist no matter who it is. I try to treat people as I want to be treated..which is mostly to be left alone. I have no problem with disagreement or speech as long as it is kept civil. People can disagree but disagreement is not cause for violence or bullying as is want to be done today to squelch free speech. I am a big time believer in Amendment 1....as well as the other 9 Amendments making up the Bill of Rights.

    I happen to think that a person who defines themselves by their sexual orientation is a dumb schmuck because I happen to think that a properly educated and a rounded/civilized/disciplined person realizes that a human being is more than sex and sexuality.,...much much more.
    If you understand this line of thought you will realize what is wrong with government and government sponsored education in this arena. To these "Educated people" in government and the school systems ...it is all about sex or race. I don't think so. There is much much more going on out here than sex and sexuality and race.

    I do not have to approve of a heterosexual marriage much less anyone else's marriage. Once you understand that concept you immediately realize the nature of the scam being pulled off on All of America.

    You have to pull this off on young people and drama queens...it is not as easy to pull it off on people who can think outside the box of todays propaganda machine.


    Someone told me awhile back that if you break the back of the White Male ...you break the back of Western Civilization by breaking the White family....you thusly break the back of the Judeo/Christian Morality and thus break the back of the system of Capitalism. It took me awhile to digest but I think they were correct.

    Someone is trying to break the back of western civilization ...by doing a constant stream of 180 degree flip flops...to breakdown the West and Capitalism. A constant bombardment of these 180 degree flip flops.

    But once you know ..you can see it over and over.

    After Ferguson, Mo...every white person became suspect...all whites were somehow guilty
    Same with Travon Martin ...someone tried to project this guilt onto all white people
    That Charleston , SC church shooting...someone again tried to project this onto all white people by race.

    I note what I tend to call the same olde "Usual Suspects" in the background unseen and unknown by most Americans pushing this kind of concealed racism and onto the backs of all white Americans. They are pushing racism...a 180 degee flip flop.
    They are misusing public education and a phony scamming medial to put white America on trial by press...trial by public eduction....not a trial by judicial process. Americans have not been formally charged with any crime...except by a phony school system and a phony media.

    Fake News.....got it??

    Now that we have a new and disapproved of President ...these same olde "Usual Suspects:" are once again trying the same olde tactics onto this President and for the same reasons.

    It just gets wolfie.

    To me ...;the Republican Party has become a useless bunch of pimps privily and secretly working with the Democrats to Help in "Herding " America and Americans into the toilet. I know this because rather than teach Americans to think for themselves and spot the scam going on ...;the Republicans are silent....the whole lot of them. This is why I call the Republican party ......."Democrat Lite."

    This phony maneuvering by both Democrats and Republicans on almost any issue you care to speak about ...is called a Hegelian Dialectic. After GFW Hegel....Thesis, Antithesis, Synthesis. Another version of this known to more people...is"Good Cop/Bad Cop."

    Well...anyways ..I am rambling now...but I think you able to follow the idea.

    They are preying on children who are not olde enough or educated sufficient to follow the scam going on.. Predators!!

    They lament all the violence in public schools...etc etc....and they are promoting the background propaganda for violence all across this land with their "Victimization Politics/Education." Guilt maneuvering while promoting open racism.

    By the way TexDanm.....for anyone versed in this kind of thinking about such an 180 degree flip flop in one arena after another, after another and after another.. for laying the groundwork for social chaos....after social chaos after social chaos....this is called "Demonic" in it's basic nature..a 180 degree flip flop.

    This is what is passing for leadership today.

    Perhaps now you understand more about why they do not like this current President.

    I think he is on to them at some level. And I also think he was never supposed to win.


    Well enough of that.

    Thanks for your post,
    WatcherChris.
     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2017
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  41. watcherchris

    watcherchris Member
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    TexDanm,

    Here is the historical proof all this anti whiteness they are pushing on our uneducated and unknowing children, not being able to defend against the manufactured chaos and bad guys they are manufacturing....is a demonic lie and that is this.....

    If economic social progress historically among men and civilizations was caused by race....why then was there no economic/social change going on in Caucasian/white Russia under the Soviets???

    No progress took place and even today...if you know where and how to look and think....some things have not changed.

    I can tell this because there is little of any real social and economic value exported from Russia today ..into America or other countries.

    Remember what these phonies today are trying to do...they are trying to manufacture a bad guy by race onto whom to vent their lies and deceit. They have even deceived themselves. and the proof is Russia...Caucasian Russia. Their race profited them nothing ...even today ...nothing. No real economic progress took place in Russia...sufficient to benefit the ordinary peon and their standard of living.

    This is further proof of the demonism taking place right in front of us...through the very Department of Education.

    One has to be educated into professional stupid not to be able to think their way around this stuff ...and only exercise and teach the "Blame Game."

    But once you know...you will catch them every time.

    The thing which made America different is the religion of a people which would not tolerate absolute power in the hands of government...a belief system which would not go there and was codified into the 1st Amendment.
    Once this groundwork was laid down as a chain on government through the first 10 Amendments...progress was invetable...unstoppable.
    Today they are trying to reverse the first Ten Amendments...via court decisions/precedent. They are trying an end run around these Amendments.

    The people here did not believe the government was the absolute decider of everything in their lives.

    But now ...today ...this is being reversed through public education into guilt manipulation and guilt maneuvering. This took off big time under the Obama Administration and today remnants of it still exist and you see these remnants turning on Trump and company...."He is a racist, a sexist, a homophobe.....and against all the shakedown programs instituted at public expenses onto the backs of the American Wallet.

    This is all part of the swamp needing cleaning out from our lives.

    The worst thing to me is that they are lying about the Truth of the history and at the same time preying on our children and grandchildren.
    This is one reason you often see me quoting from history. I have learned that few people know any history outside of movies and television thinking. This is one reason it is so easy to "herd" people...they just don't know.


    Thanks,
    Watcherchris.
     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2017
  42. watcherchris

    watcherchris Member
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    Second proof of the 180 degree demonic flip flop for social change via the guilt manipulation technique...so often used/misused on our children from kindergarten to college levels.

    Here about race and racism....and how it has flip flopped.

    When I came up as a teen, the words of Dr. Martin Luther King were quoted across this land....from public schools...to politicians...from the pulpits...colleges and universities...etc etc.

    "That a person should be judged by the content of their character ...not by the color of their skin."


    Now today this line of thought and decency has ...in our very educational institutions ...taken a 180 degree demonic flip flop into open racism...the very antithesis of what Dr. Martin Luther King taught.

    Our school system has so clearly detiorated in demonic fashion into....

    "By the their skin color ..not the content of their character"

    Again one of the keys is a knowledge and remembrance of history.

    I have suspected for some time now that this remembrance is one of the reasons history is so poorly taught today. We are not supposed to remember and thus will be more easily "Herded" as necessary for the new social change...the NWO.

    Some would disapprove of my word describing this as "Demonic" but that is exactly what it is...and is being repeated in other arenas and venues for the purposes of accommodating the "Herding." A 180 degee flip flop....in everything and anything of value to us as Americans.

    After awhile you can see them coming...they get predictable.


    This...Texdanm...is why eventually I believe that "Democide " will take place in this country....through a civil war.

    You must get rid of the older people who remember ....and you must get rid of any younger people who have been taught by the older people.

    This demonic system of 180 degree flip flops will not tolerate any competing ideas...or thoughts...any disapproval.

    You can see it already in the bullying techniques of the LGBT groups as well as the professional racists...BLM and others...even to public school and colleges...demanding tolerance and diversity but giving none to dissenting ideas/thoughts...while they continue with the "Herding."


    Nonetheless...Dr. Martin Luther King's speech on the content of their character and not the color of their skin is the other proof of how they are trying today to turn this world upside down....a 180 degree demonic flip flop.

    And they will be willing to put people into Ishmaelite bondage to reach their goals...and eventually to death for the same.


    Thanks,
    Watcherchris


    Not an Ishmaelite.
     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2017
  43. TexDanm

    TexDanm Master Survivalist
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    The race thing is especially troublesome to me in part because of my history and various family members. First off I was raised old south old school. That means that I had a Mammy that took care of me when I was little. She actually was my Mama's wet nurse for a while until her milk production perked up. This woman loved me unequivocally and I loved her as a third grandmother except she was BETTER. All of my life there was a black woman in my home helping take care of me and my brother. I played with their kids and they were every bit as close as my other "cousins".

    I have black family members and in that statement is part of the problem. They are not members of my family that are black, they are black members of my family. That means that to them, the being black is more important than being family. It is even in the small things just like it is in the large things. If you think that blacks are treated equal you are wrong. A white kid had to have a 1300 SAT to be accepted to Texas A&M. A black only had to have a 900 SAT score. I've had companies that apologised and told me that they couldn't even let me fill out an application because they had to hire minority only until the feds backed off them. I went and talked to my next door neighbor and friend and they hired him the next day. He was black and not even an American but he WAS a very good man and almost as qualified for the job as me.

    We are told that we can't discriminate due to race, age, sex, national origins etc... And yet every day our nose is rubbed in the reality that we are NOT treated equally under the law. In doing this we have crippled so many good young black kids. For example, there is a very good reason that Texas A&M has such high entry requirements. Their curriculum is tough and top shelf. A friends son graduates there in the Spring with an engineering degree. He already has a half dozen fantastic job offers. The going was tough but the graduated from there are the best of the best. What happened to the young black that they gave the scholarship to that only had a 1000 SAT score? He failed out or dropped out before he finished his sophomore year. His chance for an education was stolen by allowing him into a place where there was no hope that he could excel. Not because of his skin color, rather because as a student he was not up to that level. The young men and women that enter with the right stuff do well and their skin color, national origin, sex or sexual inclination is all beside the point.

    The idea that white people keep them down is just plain stupid and used as an excuse for covering up laziness. White people GAVE them their freedom. White people GAVE them the right to vote. White people even today give them most anything that they want but won't work for. That is the problem. If you EARN something you can have pride in it. Things that are given to you because you couldn't earn it for yourself it is always going to be a sore spot.

    Things are changing and I REALLY feel sorry for the many excellent, hardworking and honest Americans that just happen to have dark skin. Can you imagine what it felt like to hear Jessie Jackson telling people that AIDS was a disease made by white folks to specifically target and kill black people? At that time AIDS was mostly hitting Gays, Whores, IV Drug users and the just plain Sexually promiscuous!

    I came to a realization many years ago. Nearly all of the problems with race in the US can be tracked back to the Government and their yellow dog controled media. You will NEVER get people to get along by discriminating against them. The Government makes white people feel angry when they can't get a promotion because the company has to promote based on minority status. There is something wrong when the government and media CREATE the impression that stupid people like Jessie Jackson are speaking for all black people or really any.

    I used to live near a large project housing center before I bugged out. Let me tell you, it was disheartening to drive though my neighborhood and then drive through the projects or shop in the same supermarket as they did. My wife and I both worked and I was making pretty good money as a journeyman Machinist in a big shipyard. Nonetheless, the people living in the projects drove newer cars, their kids wore 100 dollar air Jordens shoes while mine wore shoes from payless and then when you went to the store with a box full of coupons and bought mostly store brands you watched them buying steaks and top prices name brands. I actually watched one buy ground chuck for her dog since they made her made and wouldn't let her pay for dog food with food stamps. And yet to them I WAS holding them down?????? I was working as hard as I could and the government was taking my money and giving it to them as fast as they could!!

    One day I realized that my problem was that my government was no longer on my side and that they rather than the blacks were the problem. It is human nature to take if something is offered. The government pays blacks not to work and to have as many kids that they won't support as possible. Once I identified the enemy I had to make a move. I joined a militia and then a few years later bugged out of that big city hell hole. Today even more than them the government is the enemy of the American people and they intentionally keep the race tensions alive and well.

    GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!
     
  44. watcherchris

    watcherchris Member
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    Wow TexDanm.,

    What yard was it in which you worked?? On the ships running portable machines or in the shop??

    Curious about this...because this is what I do in a shipyard...up here in Virginia.


    Yes...that is exactly what pisses me off...that kind of stuff you describe on the public purse.

    But now the government is bringing in many from Central America and Mexico...and onto the give away rolls. And then also those from the Middle East for the rest of us to finance.

    By and by this government , no matter what party is in office...will be predictably putting Americans in second, third, and fourth place in our own country ....as they are clearly doing in England and Europe....and by design. The groundwork is already well laid for this to happen.

    What I have also been quietly told is to watch for these various groups to be fighting with each other over the pieces of this give away pie while the media and leadership cover this up.

    To me ...Al and Jesse are about used up and run their course...even many Black folks are tired of them. What is taking their place is BLM....and soon to be even more vitriolic and violent groups.

    Do not be surprised if in the future......many of these groups who identify themselves by the fingerprint of "Victimization " join together in the coming civil war and against most of the American people...by race, by sex, by sexual orientation...and other such man made indexes. You can see them maneuvering for more "Victimization " coverage among the media and public education...and they will more than willingly carry the water for them against the rest of America.

    It is my belief that many of these groups are being polarized at some key level by government/deep state influence for this very purpose.
    By the media, by education, by government front agencies/NGO's and by certain churches as well.

    I happen to think that we have been scammed big time by many of the churches in this country on key issues and lines of thinking. LIke the phony Republicans , the churches have been totally silent when they should be teaching their flocks to think for themselves and from the Word..but remain silent..thus ceding the field to these other "Herding" groups..the media, public education , and varioius NGO's operating secretly behind the scenes.

    One of the biggest mistakes the churches in this country have made...is taking out a tax number. This tax number makes the church a corporation created by the state and now you have no separation of church and state.
    This is an investment in the ignorance of Americans about the truth of this. IF a church peaches something the state does not like they can be audited or brought/intimidated back into line by threatening their tax status.
    The churches and government both are preying on the public ignorance on this ..it ought not to be this way.

    This is what that woman mayor of Houston was counting on when she demanded the sermons of that local church. What a stupid stupid woman.

    Fortunately the public outcry nationwide was so huge they backed down. But this is the basis for the state to run roughshod over the churches and the churches were stupid enough to walk right into it.
    I know of a handful of chuches who have not taken out a tax number and never will.
    Some of them are in Texas.


    Well enough of that for now,

    Thanks
    Watcherchris,


    Not an Ishmaelite.
     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2017
  45. TexDanm

    TexDanm Master Survivalist
      315/345

    Blog Posts:
    1
    I worked at the Bethlehem Steel Shipyard in Beaumont Texas for about 13 years. I was an inside Machinist but often ended up aboard ship getting measurements and fitting things at times. Along with ship repair we also built offshore drilling rigs that were jack up, telescoping and semisubmersible.

    We also built drillships and several really strange adaptations Like the Glomar Explorer for Hughes Corp that was supposed to suck up nodules off the Pacific seafloor but actually was for the CIA and they salvages a russian subs Nuclear bombs with it.

    We also modified a bunch of Likes Line ships by cutting them in half and adding a section in the middle that was filled with military armor and artillery. In the event of war a Navy crew would take over the ship and head to the port nearest the problem. It was part of a sort of covert rapid deployment system.

    I spent a lot of time doing work on huge lathes and horizontal milling machines Cutting the bushings on wheel shaft off some of those giant diesel powered ships was quite an experience. The lathe was over a hundred feet long, had two carriages and the center line was about 7' off the floor. You actually rode the carriage. After you cut the old bushings off you made the new ones and then heated them and stuck them on in a hurry. Then once they were all in place you put it back in the lather and cut the bearing surface of the bushings.

    It was always interesting work. Met people from all over the world and learned a lot of odd things.

    Party politics have taken over our government. They are Republicans and Democrats first and foremost. If we don't figure out how to force them out and find a way to elect Americans again we are going to eventually lose everything. Unfortunately the churches these days have become big business with very little interest in their Gods. A business has no soul, it has no conscience. How else can you explain the Catholic Church for example protecting and allowing pedifiles to violate their kids for decades without trying to stop them? Instead they covered for them and let them just go on and on. The other various churches have done things as bad so don't get all down on the Catholic Church. It isn't about the faith or the people of that faith. It is just about people and what we basically are. People all too easily seem to be willing to give up our humanity for organizations. I don't understand it...
     
  46. watcherchris

    watcherchris Member
      23/29

    Blog Posts:
    0
    Wow..ok.

    I've heard of Bethlehem steel shipyards but did not know where many of them were located. Yes, I've also heard of drill ships and drilling platforms. That would be big business down on the gulf.

    I am thinking a rig like that would have a sophisticated ballast system to get it out from construction ...shallow water....or on barges....and then floated or towed to location and then precisely sunk to do it's job...or at least partially submerged and anchored out.

    Hmmmm....does that mean you sometimes had to go out and do some warranty work or repairs out at the drilling locations??

    I've worked on tankers, container ships , ocean liners and the like...basically ship repair. I'll tell you what Tex....working on ocean liners cured me of any desire I had on taking a trip on one of those ships...even if they are brand newly built ships.

    I saw when working on them that in the engine rooms...the engineers would take these Orientals and show them to take apart a certain valve....and bring it to them at a table.....when they were here in dry-dock. The engineers would inspect it and give these guys a package of gaskets and such parts to put it back together in it's location. When I watched enough of this I realized these people had no clue how these valves worked in the systems...what they did...they just followed orders of the engineers. The engineers were the only ones who knew how the systems as a whole worked and what certain valves and controllers did to keep the ship working.

    So how about the guy detailed to work the boat davits??? Did they really know what they were doing ???

    That kind of thing told me not to go out on an Ocean Liner. I did not want to be there if the SHTF.

    A couple of accidents over the years on ocean liners the the follow up reports convinced me I was correct.

    I have repeated this story to people with whom I come into contact...A warning to help break them out of that Television and Movie thinking...The Love Boat and all that kind of nonsense.
    They have ben warned.

    I've also seen a CIA ship in this yard in drydock...and it had an unusual underside...including the propeller design/propellers plural.

    The Golmar Explorer I am familiar with that ship and it's story. Fascinating reading. That is an unusual deisgn for such an ship to keep station over a object that far down and while on the high sees. Quite a feat of engineering.

    Those Lykes lines ships which were extended for carrying military cargo...these are called Pre Positioning ships. This was something which came to be big time after the first gulf war. The Military suddenly found themselves with a severe lack of significant cargo hauling capacity and tried to make as much of this up as they could via cargo aircraft. It just did not work and they flew the C141 cargo planes to death..they wore them out and severely cut into their lifespan. These C141 aircraft were all taken to the boneyards and scrapped. They are today replaced with the C17 aircraft.

    But there was a sudden nationwide call for this type of ship to be built and put on the ready line....because of the shortcoming they suddenly discovered in the first Gulf War in the early 1990s.


    But these ships as you describe are often called roll on roll offs..or ROROs...and built from the frames of other existing ships. Often a hydraulic cable operated ramp is built into them and a helicopter pad.
    When they are completed and certified ..they are taken to certain locations on the east and west coasts....and parked . Standby crews are put on them to run the pumps and other gear on a schedule...and keep them in operating status..ready to go. Sometimes they are removed from these locations ...and military gear and munitions loaded onto them and they are again prepositioned in places around the globe...ready to go on a moments notice.
    Oh..and this also means that special pier facilities have been built all across this country ...on the east and west coast where these ships are parked and maintained until ready to be called up and into service. They are taken from here and to a secure location where they are loaded up with gear and munitions.
    There is such a pier here a the end of Newport News and over in Norfolk at Lamberts Point. At least two such ships there at all times....if not more.

    You will find a whole host of them in the lagoon at a place in the Indian Ocean called Diego Garcia....loaded and ready to go...filled with gear..trucks ...munitions and other stuff necessary to keep an Army on the go....around the world.

    These prepositioning ships are occasionally unloaded and brought here to this shipyard and dry-docked for repairs and updates....

    Oh..this yard is called Newport News Shipbuilding and Dry-Dock Company.

    I do not work in the shops per se..but out on the ships with portable machines and such. My trade is often referred to as an outside Machinist.

    I know of what you speak in those long lathes as I have seen them and the "carriages" of which you speak.

    The line shafts are often put in them and machined as needed.

    The primary work being done here is building aircraft carriers and submarines..but they are also repaired here as well as refueled in their reactors.

    Over the years commercial shipping has taken a second seat to this Navy work...though I go back sufficient in years to have done a lot of this commercial work. Most commercial work today is of an Emergency nature...as this yard has a lot of drydock space...even a large floating dry-dock....plus very heavy lift crane capacity.

    I have a special qualification in doing nuclear work ..handling radiated and contaminated materials ...including working with the fuel cells. A bit different from what I did in years past..but you get used to it.

    Thanks for sharing your story. Reading your posts before your last ...sort of told me that you had been around the block a few times...so to speak. And when you said you worked in a shipyard...that verily perked up my radar.


    Oh...and the Catholic Church is not the only "Fallen" Church out there. They just have a head start on many of the others.
    They are all in good company....

    One of the things to come out of my conversion to Christianity is a study of other religions and systems...even the Occult religions. It was at first quite a shock to discover how many Occult/Pagan traditions and customs have been infiltrated into Christian practices and Churches without the members having a clue. The Catholics have no monopoly on this.
    This pattern of infiltration was going on with the Hebrews in olde testament times and continues to this very day in many Christian Churches.
    Among those of us schooled into it ...this is called ..."The Ever War."

    The Other facet of this awakening into the awareness of occult /paganism was the ability to see this religion operating in politics in this country...in past historical events and even up to today. Again the average American and church goer does not have a clue. And their ministers don't want them to awaken.

    But how about those Cowboys??? How about those Kardashians!!??

    I suspect you can follow that line of thinking and or reasoning rather quickly.

    Watcherchris,

    Not an Ishmaelite.
     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2017
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