Bitcoin As Future Savings

Discussion in 'Financial Planning' started by overcast, Jul 20, 2017.

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  1. overcast

    overcast Member
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    These days many people are investing into the bitcoin. And for this reason the price of the bitcoin is also increasing. And there are some ups and down. Though 1 BTC = 1100 USD was possible in past. So I am just thinking if anyone is considering bitcoin as future currency. Do you think it's possible to invest into this for old age insurance? What's your opinion in that case?
     
  2. ToTang45

    ToTang45 Expert Member
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    Insecure as all get out, I don't care what people say.

    The grid does down, the internet is lost. Buh-bye $$$

    I tried investing a while ago. It was dumb.
    Deal in cash.
     
  3. CivilDefense

    CivilDefense Expert Member
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    Honestly, I wouldn't touch it with a ten foot pole. In the early days, I suppose one could have made out well. But now, no way. Far to much risk and it manages to be based upon even less than fiat currency issued by governments.
     
  4. C.J.

    C.J. New Member
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    We mine several variations of crypto-currency and run a hub. Remember Bitcoin isn't the only one out there. It just has the highest value right now and buying and trading isn't the only way to make money off them.

    You could make a lot of money trading them. But unlike stocks you can't simply buy low sell high. Because crypto-currency is still in its infancy there aren't a ton of people buying when they're high. You have to actually find a buyer which means there is competition in selling. So just because the market says 1 Bitcoin is worth 1100 USD does not mean you will find someone who will buy it for 1100 USD. (It's actually around 5k per coin I believe)

    Also remember that a lot of people have lost a lot of money. Exchanges are often ran by LLCS that have no way of recouping your losses if they are hacked. Crypto-currency's biggest appeal is also it's greatest downfall. It is untraceable and the government has no control over it. So the exchanges can't receive any type of insurance to cover losses due to theft, ect.

    As an aside. In 2007 a guy tried auctioning ten thousand Bitcoin with a starting bid of fifty dollars and never received a single bid.

    Bet ya wish ya would have made a bid.
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2017
  5. TexDanm

    TexDanm Master Survivalist
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    Like a lot of things the bitcoin thing needs to be around for a lot longer than it has been before IO would risk much on them. They are a gamble with both a high possible payoff and a high chance of a big loss. If you go in too far you could end up with a bunch of shiny buttons worth nothing. To me they might be worth a small investment if you have the money to lose on the chance of a big payoff.

    It is kind of like betting the numbers on a roulette wheel. Small chance of winning but bigger pay off if you do. I knew some people that hit it big on the dot com things. They got in made a bunch of money an d then got out fast. I also knew a couple that got in made a fortune and then lost it ALL because they were still hip deep in it when it crashed.

    Over and over in my life I have seen this happen. Basically that is just the way it goes when you talk about high gain financial investments. High gain will ALWAYS be tied closely to high risk. If there was no risk EVERYONE would want to buy them and in the end THAT would cause the fall.

    I remember when the Emu thing hit and where I live everyone wanted into it. You could by a pair of young birds for about 10 THOUSAND dollars and then when they started laying and hatching babies you could recoup your investment in no time at all!! There was a market for the feathers, the meat, the blood and veins and their fat was rendered and used in some HIGH dollar skin creams. I knew personally dozens of people that got into them on various levels. You couldn't produce new chicks fast enough to keep up with the demand!! People were literally making hundreds of thousands of dollars a month selling, boarding and hatching these ugly critters. One older couple that I knew invested a quarter million on a huge automated incubator that would care for and hatch the eggs. It was many times more productive than letting the birds do it. The eggs have to be turns over and over and are very sensitive to temperatures...Then almost over night, everyone that wanted to buy and raise emus had all they wanted. It turned out that nearly the entire market was made up of people that were selling to other people that wanted to sell the birds to other people that wanted to sell the birds. Once everyone that wanted them had them they discovered that the market for the emu products was actually rather small and there were thousands of time more emus than there were people that wanted to buy them just for their products. Suddenly people had hundreds of these things that NOBODY wanted!! You couldn't even sell them for enough to pay for the feed! People lost EVERYTHING in about 30 to 60 days!! They literally cut the fences and let the ugly critters escape. We had emus everywhere!! For a little while hunting emus was pretty sporting but they were extremely dumb birds and it was like hunting chickens and eventually we killed them all. The entire thing probably only lasted for a couple of years but some people made a fortune and a lot of people lost their life savings.

    Old people get a lot of credit for being "wise". It isn't really wisdom so much as it is just that they have seen the various cycles that people seem to go through over and over. This sort of thing is a reoccurring thing. Every few years a "NEW" get rich quick thing comes along and the cycle is repeated. After you have seen this a half dozen or so times you become skeptical of things that look like this.
     
  6. Tom Williams

    Tom Williams Moderator Staff Member
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    Cash or trade no checks after shtf DO NOT COME HERE YOU ARE NOT WELCOME HERE
     
  7. TexDanm

    TexDanm Master Survivalist
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    A lot of things other than bitcoins can seem like a good idea but then bite you in the butt. I am personally afraid that gold is going to do that. The price is high and may go up. It also could plummet and then I have the question of "How much will a coin a little bigger than a quarter going to be worth to someone that is hungry and you want to buy food from him?" Today an ounce of gold is worth about $1300.00. The day after doomsday what will it buy you??? I would rather have a bag full of silver dollars. At today's price that one ounce of gold will buy you about 75 silver dollars at spot on each. I suspect that those silver dollars will be a better survival tool than gold of the same worth. If nothing else who has cash to make change for a 13oo dollar coin even if you are buying something that costs a few hundred dollars. For the short immediate use I have a bucket full of dollar coins and change. I have some paper too but the coins hide better.
     
  8. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    not even cash thank you, that will be useless post SHTF.
     
  9. TexDanm

    TexDanm Master Survivalist
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    There will be a short period just as things start to go down when money will have some value and may allow you to make purchases in the period after checks and credit cards are worthless. The money that you have "in theory" in banks will be just GONE so the only opportunity that you will have to convert some of your money to something of real value will be the cash on hand. With interest rates being so low I prefer to keep a lot of cash on hand.

    After things settle there may again be a period when money may have value. Money is used by REAL people to represent goods and labor to better allow trade. Who wants to haul chickens around to use to negotiate for services or other goods? People in nearly every level of civilization use some sort of money. People may well return to the familiar when things settle to whatever extent will become the new reality. I feel like coins will be more likely to have value than paper. Once you don't have the government printing money to pay their bills the value of money may return.
     
  10. Old Geezer

    Old Geezer Master Survivalist
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    And yes, silver will be the better survival item when compared to gold.

    Silver has many industrial uses in electronics, chemical manufacturing, water purification, medical, electronics. Silver must be continuously mined and the ore quality has been going down for some time now. Many countries do have reserves, however. There is no panic. Copper mining & silver mining are linked. This is a complex topic, but silver is going to always possess intrinsic value were it only for its chemical properties.

    That silver is much cheaper than gold (that ratio could radically change in future) speaks to its day to day usefulness in coinage. Numismatic values on silver coins are actually not known, truth be told. During WWII tons and tons of silver coins were melted for industrial purposes. To make centrifuge wiring for the purpose of concentrating heavy uranium, that alone ate some serious amounts of silver.

    When it hits the fan, out will come the gold and silver. Silver will not draw undo attention; everybody has some. As for gold coins, they WILL draw attention and of the dangerous variety. Trade gold ONLY with those you have known forever or who are known allies post SHTF. Gold could get you robbed and killed.
     
  11. TexDanm

    TexDanm Master Survivalist
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    I have also bought a bunch of copper bullion coins too. Originally coinage was based on the true value of the metal in the coin. The value of copper has gone wild over the years as has lead a few times. If nothing else the copper coins are pretty and interesting. They are about the size of quarters (1/4 OZ) and have the Walking Liberty front.
     
  12. Ystranc

    Ystranc Master Survivalist
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    If TSHTF then any electronic unit of exchange would probably become unusable, I am not interested in either investing in or using Bitcoin.
     
  13. TexDanm

    TexDanm Master Survivalist
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    From what I've read the Bitcoins, after just devastating drop in value, have sort of settled down and are making a little rebound. Maybe they won't just be buttons.

    I don't even have a lot of faith in banks. When the power goes down the only money that you will have is what you will have on hand in CASH. The banks will be closed and a check won't even be good toilet paper. Credit and debit cards are worth even less and can more easily be rendered useless. If something takes down the internet system all these electronic cash registers won't be able to process the cards even if the power is still up.

    This is one of the nightmare scenarios out there. most people, at least here, don't carry much in the way of cash and now with the advent of debit cards most people don't carry and many don't even have checks. Imagine if you walked up to the check out with a load of groceries and you just had no way to pay! You need gasoline for your car and the pumps won't accept a card. Honestly I even pay most of my bills online these days. ALL commerce will come to a sudden and violent HALT. Then everyone will head to the banks wanting their money in cash. Banks don't keep but a very tiny amount of their deposits on hand in cash so the banks can't give even a few people their life savings!

    When the banks close their doors the riots will start. The stores will all close because they won't be any better off than the people. They don't use cash to pay for things either!. People that can't pay for food are going to TAKE it. It is going to happen so fast that there just won't be much the governments can do to settle things other than declare martial law and that is not going to fly in places like Texas or most of the South. For one thing we are about as well armed as the military and for the other part in an all volunteer army, where do you think those volunteers come from.

    Let me give you a hint. Liberals don't volunteer to go to war. The truth is the military is mostly made up of people from poor areas except when we are responding to an attack like 911. The poor will be the people most hurt by this in the short term. I don't see the military as working well inside the states. People just don't like attacking their own people especially when ordered to do so by unpopular government officials. The very few times that the national guard has been called out for riot control they have been mostly ineffectual.
     
  14. AlexanderPain

    AlexanderPain Member
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    Bitcoin and other crypto currencies are here to stay. However, currencies other than Bitcoin may ultimately be used more by big business. They can save a lot of money and cut a lot of back office jobs by using the blockchain technologies used for bitcoin. I would NOT put money you really need into crypto-currencies. As other posters have noted, if the grid goes down, so does your fortune. There may also be security vulnerabilities with bitcoin wallets, etc. It would be fun to dabble in bitcoin, but as soon as you make any money, get those profits out an invested in something more secure.
     
  15. Old Geezer

    Old Geezer Master Survivalist
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    All paper and electronic "currencies" are going to be annihilated in the not-so-distant future. I mean, holy crap, the grid is going to go bye-byes. The internet is going to go away. The military or FEMA or whoever is going to take these servers for their own use. Some uniforms are going to be telling you what to do, or at least attempting to do so.

    Don't mean to sound hard-core, but crazy or not, the hard-core crew are correct. Unfortunately, things are going to COLLAPSE in the Western World. We are talking hell, boys and girls. We are talking people having to have wood stoves if they live in cold climates. We are talking people having to defend their homes with firearms if they live near urban areas. This isn't speculation, this is history repeating itself. I can relate stories of people putting together survival resources before World War One. Yes, there were lots of folk who knew full good and well that WWI was utterly totally profoundly inevitable. The world was an armed camp and only needed some teeny-tiny flicked match to set things into motion, into hell.

    Bitcoin is silly talk. Buy durable goods. Identify what you need and get prepared. Maybe when that is done, you can play games. However, this isn't serious talk given what is on the horizon. Wake up, people!!!
     
  16. Ripkor

    Ripkor Member
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    The only way bitcoin can become a viable currency is if a large scale company such as Google decides to back it. Without that security its not worth the risk. So I am going to stick to my potato harvest for trade goods.
     
  17. omegaman

    omegaman Expert Member
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    Well, Im on this forum because I don't think anything elecronical will last. So no.
     
  18. blade_foxhollow

    blade_foxhollow Active Member
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    I personally think bitcoin is a good thing for some people. Just not me. I will have more money with certain supplies than you could ever get out of bit coin or any other currency. Supplies that people dont ever think about.
     
  19. JohnnieZombie

    JohnnieZombie New Member
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    Crypto is very very high risk. This isn't an intelligent method of financial prepping. Instead focus on getting out of debt, investing in businesses or properties that create passive cashflow. Convert your life away from "trading your time for money".
     
    Ystranc likes this.
  20. TexDanm

    TexDanm Master Survivalist
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    It might be a good investment for good times but if the power goes down or we get hit by a massive EMP it is GONE and of no real worth to a prepper. It is just like the money in the bank. It is only real when people believe that your checks have value... That ends the day the banks close and don't reopen.
     
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