Can Communism Be Practised Successfully In Any Country

Discussion in 'News, Current Events, and Politics' started by EarlAlexander, May 25, 2017.

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  1. EarlAlexander

    EarlAlexander New Member
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    Communism is a cum economic system whereby the state totally control all the factors of production from production to distribution of the goods and services, it is a center-planned economic system propounded by Karl Marx and Angel. Communism was said to have been practiced in Soviet Union but it was not actually communism but dictatorship,which was later change after the fall of Soviet Union. In your own view,what country can practice communism successfully in today world and still succeed, to me i think its Tanzania in Africa which practice a socialist economic system, so what your own view.
     
  2. kgord

    kgord Active Member
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    I don't necessarily think the old Russian order was a dictatorship since they changed their leaders frequently. Their economic system was defintely on the communist order, and was successful to a point. I think some of the more successful countries, Sweden and others practice Socialism, and I have no problem with that method. Communism suggests repression, which is why people don't appreciate it.
     
  3. lonewolf

    lonewolf Legendary Survivalist Staff Member
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    none.
     
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  4. EarlAlexander

    EarlAlexander New Member
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    Exactly, Russian system of dictatorship was a one party type of dictatorship, meaning that the party was dictating the country not the leader the party choose because the party was ruling in the favor of decision reached out by the party.
     
  5. EarlAlexander

    EarlAlexander New Member
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    Why none, actually a small country with a very responsible government can practice communism. If Russia can claim to practice communism considering its size then any small country can do the same.
     
  6. Old Geezer

    Old Geezer Legendary Survivalist
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    Communism would work where the average IQ of the people exceeded 130, where everyone was self-actualized (as per Maslow), where everyone was able to rein-in their emotions/lusts/wants/desires, and if there were sufficient resources for all in this wondrous place, that too would come in more than a trifle handy. Such requirements pretty much nuke any possibility that communism will ever come to the rescue of anything or anyone.

    B. F. Skinner's "Walden Two" inspired many, however when people attempted to incorporate such ideas into communities, human nature stepped in and wrecked the "utopian" experiment. One community still exists, Twin-Oaks in Virginia ... however they gave up on Skinnerian behaviorism and now attempt egalitarianism. It's not in the following article, but one thing that zapped the experiment was the concept of the community raising children as opposed to the mother. Oops! That one crashed and burned -- and rapidly so! Maternal instinct is POWERFUL beyond all knowing and will override reason any day of the week. Speaking of which, "Reason", what an interesting concept, what a shame it does not apply to humans.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twin_Oaks_Community,_Virginia

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walden_Two
     
  7. Kanagirl

    Kanagirl New Member
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    I think it looks great on paper, but just like democracy, someone will always screw it up. People are too easily dupped into supporting a greedy SOB who wants to use the system and the people to benefit themselves. Look what we have going on right now. Trump wants a huge tax cut, so he is taking billions of dollars from the poor to do it. Communism is at risk of this same thing, regardless of where they try it.

    Was "Animal Farm" about communism? All the animals on the farm worked except the pigs. All the animals went without except the pigs. There's too many damn pigs, no matter where you go.
     
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  8. CivilDefense

    CivilDefense Expert Member
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    Nope. It is, arguably, the most thoroughly discredited economic and social system in human history. It has resulted in the murder of more human beings than any other ideology. It destroys societies and enslaves those in it. The Black Book of Communism, published in 1997, puts the body count at around 94 million people. And it has never worked economically in any nation.

    Beyond that, if you want a contemporary example of the hell it unleashes upon a country, take a look at the SHTF scenario going down in Venezuela right now.
     
  9. EarlAlexander

    EarlAlexander New Member
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    Are you saying that even in a very small country with a small population the possibility of them successfully practising communism is nil. The spirit of communism can be actualized in a group of people who put their selfish desires aside and tend to assist each other and the state to actualized economic prosperity and growth.
     
  10. CivilDefense

    CivilDefense Expert Member
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    Sure. The size of the nation is irrelevant. A few examples ...

    • Cambodia is a small nation and Pol Pot's despotic communism regime resulted in around a quarter of that population dying via execution, starvation, etc.
    • Take a good look at, say, Albania; that is a tiny country and communism failed as royally there as it did elsewhere. If anything, the flavor of communism there (Hoxhaism) was worse than other states.
    • More recently, Venezuela, a nation with immense natural resources, has now descended into utter chaos.
    Human beings, all human beings, will prioritize their well-being first. It is simple survival instinct. And the history of communism isn't a "group of people who put their selfish desires aside". It has been human rights violations galore, state terror, revolutions, gulags, mass killings, endless warfare, environmental degradation, and eventually economic collapse. Those of us that lived through the Cold War remember it all to well.
     
  11. EarlAlexander

    EarlAlexander New Member
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    Well said, but the possibility of it working in a homogeneous country may be possible. Communism has been practiced in some countries in Africa due to the decentralized structure of administration, the aspect of communism is more like the Utopian type and its still in practice in some part of Tanzania, though it is tagged socialism but at a smaller unit, it is communism.
     
  12. CivilDefense

    CivilDefense Expert Member
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    Can you give some examples of successful Communist states in Africa? What do you mean by "Utopian type"? Are you meaning the Marxist-Leninist or Maoist or another ideology? I am just curious. Thanks.
     
  13. Nela Civobeg

    Nela Civobeg Member
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    Ah, that is where you are wrong. If one decided to recreate Communism in more modern manners, it would surely be a way better system than anything we have today. And that is pretty much every country slowly sinking in debts while the certain few are swimming in the pools of money. It has a solid structure, good points, and ideas to lead country to self-preservation. Democracy, capitalism (wait, no, corporatism) have destroyed many countries and their industry. Like every system, all of them have their own flaws, but if communist ideals were resurrected with more modern manners and without dictatorship ofcourse, it would probably be way better than the system we live in. Breaking our backs for the chosen few to get it all.
     
  14. CivilDefense

    CivilDefense Expert Member
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    History is usually a pretty good guide. How did Communism work out in the Soviet Union, Red China, North Korea, Cambodia, Democratic Republic of Afghanistan, Vietnam, Peoples Republic of Ethiopia, Yugoslavia, Chinese Soviet Republic, Peoples of Republic of Mozambique, Romania, Bulgaria, Cuba, Hungary, Poland, Angola, Mongolia, Albania, East Germany, Czechoslovakia, Peoples Democratic Republic of Yemen, et al.? Hint: a body count in the millions or many thousands and/or complete economic collapse. Usually both.

    @lonewolf nailed it with "none".
     
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  15. Nela Civobeg

    Nela Civobeg Member
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    I was born during the collapse of Yugoslavia. You know what most people say about it? They say the doom of Yugoslavia was largely due to outside politics. Like I have stated earlier. You people look on the wrong sides. Body counts. Ofcourse that nobody wants to even think about that. That is where a renewed Communism without such issues would do wonders. Economic collapse? It would only happen with bad leadership and outside influence. A country that can live on its own and sustain itself without need of any loans and help of outside world is what is the ultimate goal of Communism, or at least it should have been. History is history. Bad things happen. And those provide us with valuable lessons that can change the certain aspects of such system and make it better. You know where diplomacy, capitalism, corporatism and all that has led us 20+ years of being a "free & modern / western country"? Nowhere. We are sinking deeper with every day. Capitalism has destroyed our country and is doing it every day. It is equally bad. Each system has it flaws, so if you didn't live in areas that were under Communism, you can't really know what it is. Just by reading facts & stuff on internet won't ever give you the whole view on what it is and what it was.

    So, @lonewolf did not nail it at all.
     
  16. CivilDefense

    CivilDefense Expert Member
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    Interesting perspective. I lived through a good chunk of the Cold War.

    Who says and what is their proof?

    But think about it we must! Communism has murdered more human beings than any other ideology in human history. As in at, or over, 100 Million human beings killed. If that horror does not make one take pause, then, frankly, I don't know what would.

    I can't speak for the former Yugoslavia, but I know it has work magnificently here in the US. In 1776 my country was a tiny, irrelevant, backwater. Less than two centuries later, America dominated the world stage and we walked on the moon. In those two hundred years, plus another half, we invented thousands of technologies that have benefitted man in every field of human endeavor, including the vary medium we are exchanging these messages.

    Equally bad systems? Hardly. Safeguarding human rights, democratic systems, and free markets won because it works.
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2017
  17. MountainCutie

    MountainCutie New Member
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    What I find interesting about this is not so much 'can it work' but; what if one day we don't have a choice? Not through war, but because technology has advanced so far that human workers will be irrelevant. Already many of our jobs have gone to robots. Economies are already hopelessly entangled because we import everything, at this point trying to put our economy first already bites us in the butt at times because some of the economies we end up hurting effect our economy. What about when this gets worse and there is one currency?

    One day everything will end up automated if we aren't careful. And then what will we do? We won't have jobs but we'll still have needs. The governments will start paying people to do nothing maybe? Like what they've discussed doing in Europe... and then bam, we have communism overnight. Because even if we called it a Republic at that point it wouldn't be democratic. And like almost everyone has pointed out, Communism has the worlds worst track record.

    Yet at that point, what will we do? No other system will work with everything automated. What will the world look like? How will we survive?
     
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2017
  18. lonewolf

    lonewolf Legendary Survivalist Staff Member
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    it wont work because human nature would get in the way.
     
  19. Nela Civobeg

    Nela Civobeg Member
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    Ah, I like where this discussion is going now.

    Well, you see, history and numbers truly do speak for themselves. The way most Communist countries worked when it comes to human rights and such was terrible. Mass murdering, banning free speech, media control. Those were really bad, but what I was trying to point out. What if a smart individual introduced a new system, system that is based on the certain ideologies Communists had, but ofcourse, without dictatorship, murdering and such?

    And to answer why a lot people claim that they still think that Ex-YU was a better place to live in? I am gonna leave out the states problems of free speech out of this, because that is how old system used to work.

    Everyone had a home to live in, everyone had a job, nobody was forced to leave their home. In fact, country itself has helped people build their homes and gave them jobs. Doesn't that sound like a nice place to live in? It sure does. But the problem like many other countries faced was the murdering and banning free speech. Like I said, if somebody renewed Communism and leaves out all those bad things, it truly is a sustainable system, as long as you play it smart and know what you are doing. Ex-YU was actually blooming for most of its lifetime. What brought it on it's knees, I can not say. A lot of people blame outsiders.

    I am living in a free country, free speech is great, but you see, capitalism has brought many other issues, people get kicked out because they can't pay their debts which was largely influenced during the very forming of our country and it had lots of outside influence. Foreign banks, investors and such. Pretty much, big fishes preying on smaller ones. And even though our very constitution states that no citizen can be kicked out of their only house, they still can't do anything when it comes to banks.

    Our banking system was a ruin ever since we got separated. Our politics and pretty much everything.

    You see, there is no mass murdering, but there is another problem, and that is what we like to call "political mafia" in Croatia. Even now, when we live in a free country, there were many cases of reporters who were killed when they were on brink of finding out some stories behind certain individuals involved in politics, banking and so on.

    To summarize.

    No system is perfect. Each system has its flaws and its benefits.

    What my whole point on posting here was to make people think about Communism as a system itself, leaving out the mass murdering, freedom issues and such.

    If someone managed to run a country on similar ideals while respecting humans rights, free speech and such, it really would be a nice system to live in.

    Ex-YU was a really good example of this. Even presidents of USA and Russia used to come to Yugoslavia. There are some documents where USA even wanted to get involved in Yugoslavia and build secret facilities related to space programs and what not.

    My bet was that outsiders found it as a possible threat, another great power that might be rising. And the fact they played the game with both sides really does make you wonder what was really going on around here.

    Many claim Ex-YU was a "child" of Russia. Maybe by ideology, but surely, they played a really smart game by not being only their child. That might as well be one of the reasons things went upside down.

    Many people claim different things, but even those who hated it said that there were great times when everyone had a house, a job and no financial problems.

    As long as we are talking about system itself, without human rights and similar issues, it does sound like an interesting system, does it not?
     
  20. watcherchris

    watcherchris Legendary Survivalist
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    Civil Defense and others,

    The principle and practice of killing off huge numbers of your own populations..is called "Democide"

    here ...this link

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democide


    What is of interest to me is RJ Rummels statement in which he calculates how many people have been killed by Democide in the last 100 years or so..


    Communism is a form of advanced Feudalism....royalty. Absolute power...in the hands of men.

    In history ...Absolute power was also called "Divine Right of Kings."


    The dream of mamy in history seeking power...is this goal...absolute power...divine right of kings or whatever name you want to put on it.

    This took the form in Feudal nations wherein there was a connection between the religious authority and the governmental authorities. Often it was the very crowns of the leaders who's crown was ceremoniously put on their heads by the head of the state sponsored religious leaders.

    This meant that their authority was absolute ..from God...therefore the kings or leaders could not be held to any authority outside of their own...they had absolutet power. These kings and or emperors could make or break any law they desired and no one could hold them accountable.

    This was the authority of the Pharoah's...the Roman Emperors. The sun kings and or emperors in the orient..absolute power.

    It is the power desired by many over nations and people even today.


    This knowledge and history is seldom taught to Americans today so that you do not recognize where our own government is want to go by feeding us a secular history and knowledge...while they move to more and more and more absolute power over the people.

    Amendment 1 to the Constitution is a limit on government..not on the people.
    All the first ten amendments are limits on government ...not on the people or the states.

    If you were never taught this history ...you would never catch your leadership gaslighting and lying and deceiving us on juat about any point in history.


    I have caught Barrack Obama several times blaming the violence of the Crusades for much of history today in the middle east.
    Almost no one out here knows that it was the Muslims who were first on the move invading Europe in the late 600s AD and being stopped at Tours, France by Charles Martel/Charles the Hammer in 732AD. This was some 300 plus years before the first Crusade.

    But I know it and was able to recognize the lie being taught ...by our leaders in their version of the Blame game.

    Historically the nature of the lie being taught is that any progress in the world..economic progress...came from countries having a Judeo/Christian religious background wherein their governments as a whole did not interfere with the religious practices of the people.

    This is where economic progress took place and it was exported to other nations from these nations.

    The lie taught to people today ..is of the form that "All religions are the same religion and all gods are the same god"

    This is a bold faced lie and deception. Islam is just like Communism...feudal and royal in its nature and absolute power.

    Governments today want to put blame on the Judeo/Christian religion, and promote sex, sexual orientation, race and any other lie and pabulum they can manufacture so that you never think through to the Truth.

    No thinking person defines who and what they are by their sex, sexual orientation , or race...but government tries to do this all the time.

    For people who can think for themselves know that they are so much more than race, sex, sexual orientation.

    Look at Russia...their leadership was primarily Caucasian..yet no economic progress took place in Russia until well into the 20th century. Anything they got came from outside Russia.
    Once you know this ...you can catch the lie and deception in the news regularly ..by leadership....fomenting division and not unity.

    The key to knowing this is that any progress...even today in these nations came from outside these nations. Just look at the standard of living of their people and from whence it came. Wherefrom came their economic and technical progress.


    You readerss/ members now known sufficient to catch your leadership in the big lie...in dividing a people by these categories mentioned..preying on your ignorance...for political capital.

    When you understand this pattern...you can see your own leadership lying and deceiving you daily on almost anything and everything to "Herd" you into not thinking for yourself...but willingly following the herd.

    The scary thing is that a lot of people out where without this historical knowledge are voters.


    My .02,

    Watcherchris

    Not an Ishmaelite.
     
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2017
  21. watcherchris

    watcherchris Legendary Survivalist
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    In line with absolute power and communism.

    What has happened here in America...is a form of bondage...or more aptly ..involuntary servitude via government.

    No one wants to phrase or describe it in those terms in any political party but that is certainaly what it is.

    I am talking here about Health Care...or as often described...Obama Care.

    What our government has pulled off onto the backs of working people is a system of bondage to where people working have to pay twice or more for their health care.

    They must work for themselves and their families...and also work for others who cannot afford health care.

    This is how this government has gotten health care for everyone......putting people into bondage and involuntary servitude to pay twice or more.

    On top of all this ...those paying twice or more ...must meet high premiums as well as high deductables before their health care will cover for them. Those who cannot afford health care ...go to the head of the line and get care before those who are paying for all of it. But no one wants to speak of it for what it is....Bondage.

    Then on top of all this ...and in many countries ...you have such stupid governments who are opening the doors to mass immigration and putting these immigrants on the public breast and making their people pay even more......thus more bondage and involuntary servitude. Europe is in particular under assault on their citizens in this manner. These people in these countries are soon enough , if not already, going to pay and take first place risks to pay for others/immigrants, while taking second, third , fourth place and further behind in their own country.

    Astonishing to me how ignorant some governments can be. Someone has stolen/hijacked these countries away from their people.

    All of this is a fingerprint of Communism....bondage..involuntary servitude. Put another way...what you have is people being herded..like cattle and made to conform....no individual thinking or actions allowed. Herd mentality.

    Communism is one of those systems which look good on paper..but in practice it cannot possibly work unless all information and knowledge is carefully controlled and crafted for political reasons...reasons of supporting the herding techniques.

    The very sad truth is that this is exactly the direction intended to go here in America without most Americans even aware this is happening to them.

    This Communist system is being heavily and subtly promoted in public schools through colleges and the students are not even aware this is happening.

    I was told many years ago ..by a college professor that you have more communists in government and the public school system in America than you have in Moscow.

    History has proven this professor to be correct.


    My .02,
    Watcherchris.
     
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  22. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    Only if you could find a country that was populated by nothing but angels. True communism is based on each person being more interested in the good for ALL than in their own personal gratification...in other words people that aren't humans.
     
  23. Old Geezer

    Old Geezer Legendary Survivalist
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    Liberty is always lost when submitting to the collective. Without Liberty, what reason is there to live?

    To simply be alive means nothing.
     
  24. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    The question is, is bowing down to and submitting to the will of an insanely stupid majority in a Democracy much better????? We are approaching the point where I honestly believe we could elect an Adolf Hitler into power. It was NEVER the intentions of our founding fathers that idiots and criminals be allowed to vote I assure you.
     
  25. Ystranc

    Ystranc Master Survivalist
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    If we were no longer the greedy, lazy, self centred species that we are...if human nature had improved enough for communism to work...then no political system would be necessary at all.
    The problem is that there has always been and probably always will be some greedy asshole grabbing all the money and power that he/she can hold in their tiny little grasping hands.
    What is needed is a political system with enough checks and balances to prevent extreme abuses of power alongside an educated and responsible electorate.
     
  26. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    There used to be one that was as you mention but over time it was eroded to the mess that we now have. When the constitution was written you had to be a property owner to vote. That eliminated the lazy and stupid from voting for cake and circuses. Up until the 70s millionaires paid almost 90% income tax. What this did was it made the extremely rich put the money back into the AMERICAN economy instead of just into their pocket.

    When Sam Walton made 14 million he opened another store. He opened them in the United States because that made it a tax deduction. He wanted to employ AMERICANS because he needed the tax deductions. Back then if you moved your factory to another country you had better move with it because any profits you made and tried to bring into the US were taxed at 90% or so. Back then wealth was asset based rather than personal wealth.

    Now most rich pay a lower rate than the working class and they pocket it. They move the work out of the country because they can pay workers almost nothing, not have any EPA or OSHA to deal with and then happily pay a tiny tax . Have you ever noticed that when they close an American factory to a country where they can pay a dollar and hour for labor that the PRICE that they sell those products to us for!??

    Over time we have become everything that our founding fathers tried to avoid. The Rich hold an ever increasing part of the total wealth while the lazy poor live better and better to the point that they often live better than the working middle class.
     
  27. watcherchris

    watcherchris Legendary Survivalist
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    Dude....

    This is like super stupid..and extremely idealistic...it looks wonderful on paper...but it is the epitome of stupid.

    It reflects a type of "Herd Mentality."

    Communism is a type of political system. What are you thinking here???

    Observe here ....for people who can think outside the box of what passes for the moral and ethical high ground today...which amounts to Herding....political/social herding...Observe and think here outside of what passes for group think today.



    And what law is being broken here by greedy,lazy, self centered species in America???? What is the statute number...code number...

    Case number in precedent law???

    If one cannot be provided to support...this indicates that a legal fiction is taking place..a fiction of law..a counterfeit??

    See Blacks Law Dictionary ...definition...legal fiction/fiction of law.

    Do you know the name of this counterfeiter by name here please...one who would superimpose a counterfeit morality onto people in lieu of American beliefs and practices??

    This is exactly what many leftists do ...is try to superimpose a morality onto people for a trespass when no actual law has been broken or trespassed. To get away with this kind of herding...the left tries to make people feel guilty in belief that some kind of imaginary law has been broken or trespassed...when in fact ...none has. This is also called "A Shakedown...a con job." If necessary the left will even "Manufacture a bad guy" to go after when in fact no law has been broken or trespassed.

    Do you remember this 24 carat idiot manufacturing a bad guy for people to turn on when no law had actually been broken or trespassed. This type of whoredom continues today with the left.

    And this fellow used/misused this tactic over and over and over again to appeal to peoples emotions and not to thinking ...logic or reason.
    And this type of scam or shakedown continues today unless you train yourself to spot it taking place right in front of you. Knowing and remembering some history helps.





    This is a definition of more government ...not less government. This kind of thing always goes back to absolute power/divine right of kings.....more power in the hands of men to Herd the people.....not to protect their liberties by staying out of peoples business..but more "herding."

    The historical tendency of this type of thinking when turned loose by men is to do good...but in the end they always do evil.

    Communism is become , among those who know , the epitome of evil by it's very extensive fingerprint of "Democide."

    Death by ones own government....death by Democracy.

    It is not just Communism which has done this ...a early version of Democide was practiced by the French in the French Revolution and it's aftermath....the scientific revolution which took place...the killing off of so many Frenchmen by the guillotine. The idea that this was a Scientific Revolution is laughable. This is what some history books call the French Revoluton...the first scientific revolution. What a joke...if you know the history of what happened.

    But what came out of it was further studies which were to take place in the various meetings of the International...which eventually became the basis for the Communist party apparatus.

    If you know this history ...you can see the same mindset of "Herding " taking place here in America and particularly via our news media. public education, and politics financing the same. This will lead to socialism and eventually Communism...a commune type thinking ...Xerox copy machine type thinking ....follow the herd...no individualism allowed.

    These groups all seem want to substitute "Emotions and emotional outrage " for thinking. Dumbing people down...by professional herders...via the media...and public education.

    They seem to take advantage of peoples immature and undisciplined emotions ...to prevent thinking on their own ...as they tend to know little or no history by which to see this pattern repeating itself.

    Communism or the group think associated with communism...is only a method of return back to absolute power over a people and nation. A type of feudalism...royalty....absolute power.

    If you observe carefully ...you can see Europe and England turning to massive group think...herd mentality ...no independent thinking allowed. One of the first things to go is free speech and a controlled regulated media. A government authorized media. This is happening in Australia as well.

    Buckle up...it is going to happen here unless we verily wise up and learn who we are and from what we have descended as a people and nation.

    I am not an Ishmaelite.
    Communism is the epitome of Ishmael ..and is in bondage with her children.


    Thanks,
    Watcherchris.
     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2017
  28. watcherchris

    watcherchris Legendary Survivalist
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    TexDanm,

    this...

    Think this through carefully. Then read Amendment 13 of the Constitution. forcing people to put their money into the American economy on the basis of a tax code...is not freedom and liberty..it is a type of "Herding by tax code."

    Involuntary servitude....just like Obama Care.

    The idea that government can spend our hard earned money better than we...is laughable. What governments historically tended to do is spend more....and tax more...or print more money and thus cause inflation/depreciation which the publications in the Federal Reserve will tell you is nothing more than disguised taxation.

    What governments do with our moneys is tend to rig the economy to buy votes to do more rigging of the economy to keep and maintain power.

    But someone made a very very bad miscalculation back in November 2016. They could not rig the election suitably enough.
    They could not pull off enough victim dictum group think to win the election. Americans got sick and tired ...fed up with the cheap victim dictum Herding going on for so long. Enough Americans got sick and tired of coming in last place in their own country and so stated at the voting booth.

    This is a fingerprint or index for which Englishmen and Europeans are slow to catch on. That they are going to be made and forced to take second , third and fourth place or worse in their own nations.

    This....there is some truth to this.

    I have a lady friend who is an apartment manager and she gets to see a lot of these peoples paperwork as they often ask to use the fax machine in the office.

    Many of them get a lot of breast feeding off the public breast. In particular many of the middle eastern immigrants brought over on the Obama administration. She has told me that they get some benefits not known by most American welfare recipients.

    I believe much of this is to secure their leftist democrat votes. It assures how they are going to vote as these people by numbers far exceed the number of rich people in this nation.

    I think there is another type of program in effect to keep the rich people properly "herded." Particularly those who are not politically affluent.

    Nonetheless....you are describing a system for which and for some time now has been upside down...in many regards ....even backwards...like mirror image thinking and practice...MIT. A counterfeit...a lie..a deception.

    Thanks,

    Watcherchris.
     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2017
  29. GS AutoTech

    GS AutoTech Expert Member
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    Socialism & communism are essentially flawed cause it contradicts human nature. There has been & always will be differences between people. Ambition, intelligence, motivation, physical characteristics, personal beliefs, on & on.

    In a free system you have the choice to produce as little as you need to survive or enough to make a profit. If you make a profit you can choose to do with it as you please. This is an inventive & it appeals to human nature.

    The socialist model removes this incentive. Your production becomes the property of the community. If you produce more than what you need it is handed out to everyone else. If you produce less than what you need, no worries, you receive the excess of others. If there is no incentive for those that can & want to over produce, their motivation wanes until they to become takers VS givers.
    When the takers out weigh the givers the system begins a downward spiral.

    This is where socialism slides into communism. Centralised command & control. Tyranny & Despotism. Forcibly taking from those who have & giving to have nots.
    The only winners are those elite party members in command of all the resources.
    The free market is the best option. Although free markets have not been free for a long time. All governments twist & pervert the free market thru taxes, regulations, crony capitalism, etc.
    Blaming corporate greed is just another "herding tactic" that deflects your attention away from the fact that Gubment activities are at the root of many problems.
     
  30. watcherchris

    watcherchris Legendary Survivalist
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    Many years ago I dated a woman with four children...older aged children.

    Now back then I had 5 mopeds and all of them were running. I would let the children of age ride them but went along to make sure they were alright and did not get stuck. They liked it very much riding these 2 cycle mopeds.

    One day when I was fixing some food in the kitchen with their mother here at this place the oldest boy took off on one of my scooters without asking. I was stunned.

    Just because his mother and I were seeing each other was not a license for him to help himself without my permission.
    I do not know what rationale he used to justify the same.


    But when he got back...I spoke to him and told him never to do that without my permission. That his mother and I were dating is not a license to take the moped whenever he wanted.

    Also...he had no skills or understanding about what a made the moped run and if it broke ...he would not know what to do and park it ...looking at one of the others for a free ride...with no responsibilities associated with what he does.

    To me this was no different than communism.....one size fits all..without work and without RISKS.

    Some people RISK and others expect to ride for free.

    Not on my watch they won't.

    One of my recurring nightmares is to be stuck on that desert island with about 400 people who only know how to text message and expect someone else to RISK for them while they play on and with their phones.
    High Maintenance. I don't like High Maintenance people.


    My .02,
    Watcherchris.
     
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  31. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    I just loathe these so called "smart" phones. It isn't that they aren't pretty cool or that they can be very handy and useful at times for nearly anything other than being a telephone. It is that they are replacing conversation, thought and knowledge for most of the younger generation. Knowing how to look something up on your phone is NOT the same as knowing it. I see a table full of college age people sitting at a table in a restaurant and every one of them has their nose in a phone and are ignoring the people around them. What small math skills they might have ever had are gone because they will use their phone rather than add 2 plus 7 in their head. It makes me think of the old horror stories where people were being replaced by something else that looked like people but WASN'T! These kids are losing what I think of as their humanity. Take away their phone and try to talk to one of them and it is scary as hell.
     
  32. Old Geezer

    Old Geezer Legendary Survivalist
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    Smart phones are opioids. "Smart" phones kidnap people's minds. These devices are the in-between step from reality to having electronics inserted into the brains of government serfs.
     
  33. lonewolf

    lonewolf Legendary Survivalist Staff Member
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    smart phones remove the need for intelligence, how many people have you seen walking into traffic whilst their nose is glued to the screen? I have seen plenty of near misses.
    not the sort of people I want to associate with in a post SHTF environment.
     
  34. watcherchris

    watcherchris Legendary Survivalist
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    Hmmmmmmm!!

    I'm thinking this is also a definition of Television....opioids.

    Particularly these talk shows...like Oprah, Dr Phil ...et al. Programming....voyeurism.


    I do not like the idea of getting televisions for the children to put I their bedrooms so that they can withdraw and not be a part of the family. That...to me is some kind of stupid on the part of people.

    I can make the same case for what passes for public education today...."an in-between step from reality." Teaching people to run a program..not think for themselves.


    My .02,

    Watcherchris
     
  35. lonewolf

    lonewolf Legendary Survivalist Staff Member
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    many people in the UK don't even eat together any more, they work different times and the kids come in from school and just help themselves- latch key kids we call them.
    most kids have not only a TV in their bedroom but computers as well and spend most of the time there apart from the rest of the family. they aren't allowed to play outside- parents seem to have this idea there is a pervert behind every corner, i'm glad I haven't got kids.
    modern life!! you can keep it.
     
  36. watcherchris

    watcherchris Legendary Survivalist
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    LOL LOL LOL lonewolf...now this is capital...just capital!!

    Just brilliant...so they plant their children in front of a television and movie...and cant tell the difference.

    Plant them and water them in front of an Ishmaelite television pervert.

    Astonishing.!!!

    Watcherchris

    Not an Ishmaelite
     
  37. watcherchris

    watcherchris Legendary Survivalist
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    Hey Lonewolf,

    Let me ask you something from the UK perspective??

    I would like to know a sampling from that side of the Atlantic. I would like t o know if you notice this principle at work among the people for whom you know and intersect...having doings.


    This sampling or index to be identified is ...do you know a number of people for whom when asked a question requiring deep thought and consideration ...refer to a movie or television program they have watched or seen??

    In other words...they do not have clear succinct thoughts of their own,....but are obviously parroting someone else's thoughts..someone else's emotions...someone else's experiences....and do not seem to notice this is happening to them.
    They obviously have television and movie thoughts ...television and movie emotions...and do not seem to know this has been done to them. Television and movies are now controlling how they think and act...how they believe.

    Do you know many of these types of people???

    I would like a cross section of this index or phenomenon from the UK if you please.

    I thank you in advance for any such consideration.


    Watcherchris
    Not an Ishmaelite
     
  38. Morgan101

    Morgan101 Master Survivalist
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    Socialism/Communism has never worked anyplace in the world. IMHO it never will. By definition it destroys human ambition, and initiative. How hard would you work if the fruits of your labor were given to others who do not work? This has been proven countless times throughout history. In more modern day terms how does Socialism seem to be working in Venezuela or Cuba or North Korea?

    A very simple example: On a Friday afternoon a teacher announces to the class that there will be an exam on Monday. This exam will be 100% of their grade. There are two students; one a high achiever, and the other a slacker. The High Achiever takes all the books home, and studies the entire weekend. No partying. No TV. Hard-core intensive study. The Slacker never touches a book. Parties the whole weekend. School and an exam aren't even thought of. Come Monday the High Achiever gets 100% on the test. An A+. The Slacker gets a 60%. Dismal failure. In a Socialist system the teacher would take 20 points away from the High Achiever, and give them to the Slacker. Now everybody has 80%, and they all pass. Does that sound fair to you?
     
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  39. GrizzlyetteAdams

    GrizzlyetteAdams Crap Creek Survivor
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    ...and as Margaret Thatcher once said, "The trouble with Socialism is that eventually, you run out of other people's money."

    Snopes.com argues that she didn't say those exact words, but said this instead (which pretty much means the same thing): "Socialist governments traditionally do make a financial mess. They always run out of other people’s money." But I will go with the commonly held belief that the first quote is correct, especially considering Snope's reputation these days, lol.



    .
     
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  40. Morgan101

    Morgan101 Master Survivalist
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    I love this quote, and I loved Margaret Thatcher. One of my favorites is from Milton Friedman: " If you put the Federal Government in charge of the Sahara Desert in three years there would be a shortage of sand. "
     
  41. poltiregist

    poltiregist Legendary Survivalist
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    You can add Brazil to the list of failed economies . I saw yesterday where Brazil also elected a socialist president , making the usual ridicules promises to get elected . Like Venezuela Their promise all politician soon became their dictator . Also like Venezuela their economy is collapsing and people are beginning to starve . Seems like I remember something similar happening in Germany about 80 years ago , I don't think it worked out for them .
     
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  42. Morgan101

    Morgan101 Master Survivalist
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    Add Argentina as well. Thriving, successful economies that were destroyed by Socialism.
     
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  43. poltiregist

    poltiregist Legendary Survivalist
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    In November 2016 the United States almost fell to Socialism / communism with corrupt politicians , corrupt top law officials , corrupt news outlets and a rigged election . They thought they had that rigged election in the bag , and lost . That's why so many communist in the US are so angry .
     
    TMT Tactical likes this.
  44. Old Geezer

    Old Geezer Legendary Survivalist
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    Socialism is a dynamite concept, however given human nature being what it is, socialism is dynamite, the explosive ... beyond dangerous. Oh and, dynamite does NOT age well.

    There's a brain disease going around on college campuses wherein a professor will spew and the students lick up the belief that centralized power does NOT corrupt. Psych studies from the past are being discredited because they are politically incorrect.

    Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Did I even have to say that?!

    The U.S. Founding Fathers knew all too well how corrupting power is, that's why they split the government up into three competing branches. They WANTED them to fight! Only if everybody wanted something to happen, did it get done.
     
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