Children Who Murder

12 y/o male child shoots two 18 y/o males multiple times each. Murdering one, the other in the hospital with life threatening gunshot wounds.
https://www.ktuu.com/content/news/P...son-of-interest-after-shooting-510838541.html

A day before or a day after a 16 y/o male cold bloodedly murders a 19 y/o female. Shooting her in the back of the head, and then rolling her into the river, still twitching.
https://www.ktuu.com/content/news/1...d-teen-arrested-for-her-murder-510871251.html

I am guessing this is not very shocking for some. But I am bewildered. If this is part of the "PRE" shtf......reality, how could you trust any ten or twelve year old child, after the SHTF.....??

In a post SHTF environment, could I actually shoot an eight or ten or twelve year old child that points a gun at me......??? I understand that law enforcement officers have to deal with this, as do military personnel. Just not something I ever thought could be real for me.

A side question......is this very common in the lower 48 states.......or in other countries....???

At some point in the next few years, I will have to move to this city (Anchorage, Alaska) and I am attempting to learn about how to survive there.

 

Bump to activate......

 

Expect the unexpected, especially in a big city where you are more likely to encounter the worst of humanity simply because the scum of the earth is vastly more concentrated there than in a smaller community.

Anyone who has been isolated from humanity (or rather, INhumanity) as long as you have is in for a rough ride. I suspect that you would soon feel as if you had walked straight into deep SHTF territory.

When I lived in New Orleans for many years, I was on high alert 24/7, even in the relative safety of my home. Home invasions are much more common in cities than elsewhere, so there's that. Parking lots are definitely NOT safe territory so you especially need to be on high alert when you go to the doctor, grocery shop, etc. etc. Even in so-called "good" neighborhoods.

It is much, MUCH easier for someone to learn how to live in the wilderness than it is for the inexperienced to learn street smarts. As you know, humans can be much more dangerous than any bear you will ever encounter. Too often, you cannot "read" a human's intent the way you can an animal.

Learning street smarts is difficult enough for a young person with keen reflexes, good eyesight, and hearing. If you had started out learning street smarts as a younger man, you would have a better chance than starting out in a big city at an advanced age.

I have some practical advice coming up, but first... a few sidebar thoughts:

Personally speaking, all the best doctors and clinics in the world could not convince me to live in New Orleans, los Anchorage, or any city ever again. For any reason.

As it is, where I am now, I am almost two hours away from the nearest decent clinic. The nearest hospital is like the fabled "Roach Motel," as the old commercial jingle goes, "you check in but you won't check out."

I could move to a "better" location with better medical access, etc. but no thanks. The trade-off is not worth my peace of mind. Like you, I have gone too feral to live comfortably among a large number of people. I would be too stressed out to make it worthwhile.

Besides, being in a big city is the last place most preppers want to be in when the SHTF. Remember Katrina? Leningrad? Or any one of other citified SHTF in recent history? The fabled "die-off" never happened in most SHTF events, so what will you do during a similar event?

Every time I go into the city for a whole day, I go through a kind of "culture shock" or something. It takes a while to get back to normal once I get back home. I cannot imagine living there, not even if you paid me millions of dollars every year, lol.


I digress, but the following is an excerpt from a post that I made some time ago in response to someone who had a similar question as yours. (By the way, he lives in a country where gun ownership is not legal for most people.)

----------------------------

...I would like to share some things with you that I believe has kept me alive in some pretty bad situations. (As the saying goes, your mileage and circumstances may vary.)

I grew up in New Orleans (which bore the title of "The Murder Capital of the World" for years) and also spent 17 years in the swamps and bayou country south of there. I managed to escape my share of seriously bad situations over the years. I won't divulge the nature of them in this post because they are irrelevant to the lessons.

In some places, you can't help but think everything and everyone wants a piece of you... I learned that having a sense of relaxed awareness will serve you much better than being hypervigilant. Fear can be a gift, but improperly used, it can paralyze us to the point that we can't function well without "props" which can give us a false sense of security and lead to us being caught off-guard.

Case in point: The knock-out game. I have seen videos captured by security cameras in New Orleans a few years ago that clearly showed how even a group of armed men can be easily overcome. One incident, in particular, comes to mind: In broad daylight, and not in a horrible neighborhood, a small group of UNARMED young thugs appeared out of seemingly nowhere and quickly bashed in the armed men’s heads from behind, which knocked them unconscious, then they inflicted heavy blows to the temples and face for pure meanness. The result was horrifying and deadly. It happened so quickly that the victims never saw what hit them.

Here are some things I learned from experience and also from some of the videos I have seen:

Lesson 1: Things can happen fast and furious when you least expect it, and a gun (or whatever you are carrying) may not always save you. But a well-tuned relaxed situational awareness probably will. The thugs looked “normal” by anyone’s standards, but they were walking behind the victims, and with lightning speed, knocked their victims unconscious, robbed them as they lay on the ground dying, and fled before anyone could stop them. The whole incident happened incredibly fast, which was one of the common threads among other similar videos.

Lesson 2: There is a fine line between having a relaxed situational awareness and being paranoid. Hypervigilance is hard to hide and can mark a paranoid person as vulnerable by thugs who are quick to pick up on this. Don’t be that person. On the other hand, the victims described above may have been too relaxed, and their guard was down because they were chatting and laughing moments before the incident happened. The same thing can--and does--happen to people in parking lots as they go to a movie theater, restaurant or grocery store, which brings me to Lesson three.

Lesson 3: Thugs like to seek out places where people usually let their guard down. Tourists are especially vulnerable as special targets. Try to blend in grey-man style, especially when visiting a new-to-you area. Don’t carry all of your protection in a bag; you may not have time to fish it out when you need it. If possible, have it in your hands or on your person. Even a small canister of pepper/mace spray is better than nothing. It may buy you time to get the upper hand in a fight for your life, or else run. It has served me well on a few occasions, but I was lucky. Unfortunately, some individuals, including those who are hopped up on certain drugs or have a mental illness, are able to physically override most pepper sprays. Supposedly certain brands can be used successfully, no matter what state of mind the assailant is in. One is Sabre CS Tear Gas/Red Pepper Personal Defense spray (available from Amazon.com or www.sabrered.com), which is good for situations where other forms of self-defense are prohibited. It is not recommended for indoor use which could also put you in harm's way. For indoor use, the Sabre Red Pepper Gel is a better choice.

Here is a run-down of the pros and cons of various sprays: https://www.asecurelife.com/best-pepper-sprays/

Whatever your favored means of defense, be ready, but also be sure of your intended target. It would be a shame if hypervigilance played into a case of mistaken intentions. Especially if all the shady-looking guy wanted was directions or something...


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Thanks........nice and very helpful post.

 

I have always found that a relaxed but aware confidence works a little like thug repellant. I will say right off that being a big man helps a lot but it is more the right attitude than the size that seems to make thugs leary of you. Most thugs are predatory cowards and really don't want to take much in the way of a chance. If you look nervous that draws them. If you, on the other hand, have no fear and can project a bored don't mess with me attitude they seldom chose to mess with you. Even when outnumbered a somewhat crazy smile and a convincing "today is a GOOD day to die!!" attitude bothers them a lot. I learned this from my Dad when I was little and didn't have a big brother to keep the bullies at bay like most of my friends. It worked then and it hasn't failed me yet.

My Dad's solution for bullies was simple. You fought them and if they beat you up then next time YOU start the fight by taking them down from behind and just stomp the living hell out of them. You kicked and beat them until they quit resisting and then told them. "This is what you will get ANY time you mess with me!" I did this twice and after that, the bullies ran away from me because I was CRAZY. When the bullies are afraid of you then nobody wants to mess with you and you can be peaceful. I had lots of friends and very few enemies.

I am bothered by the massively violent games that little kids play these days. In our laziness and refusal to be bothered to raise our kids are we letting them become monsters??? There have always been violent kids that were raised in ghettos and violent neighborhoods but now the little monsters are rising up out of the upper middle class and there is no excuse for that other than a total lack of parenting...

 

IBME,

Always appreciate reading upbeat news. Above examples are not shocking at all and constitute good news. It's the multiple-victim events needing some attention.

I have no idea on how to handle some of the numerous events like Mandalay Bay shooting range matter. It is beyond my grasp how this and related can be prevented without offending anyone.

For specifics: in reply;

Re "part of the 'PRE shtf...??"; Yes, it is an indicator of the society's security apparatus and overall value system.

Re "how could you ... any ten or twelve ..child,"; You do not. It's only recent history that a 12 year old was deemed a child.

In post SHTF environments, you are prohibited from shooting a 10,12, yo child threatening you if there are non-lethal means to protect oneself. Some places require fleeing the scene. I am not making this up as hypothetical examples. Soon enough, whenever there is a "disturbance" and LE agencies notified, there will be a drone present at scene recording and photographing (still and motion) event.

In other countries, it depends on what area of world...not to generalize too much... I've lived and worked in a few Asian nations and most noticeable to me was the large security apparatus. The senior LEOs are knowledgeable as a requirement of their job position. If a report is received indicating a problem, more than 1 LEO will be assigned to the response. Police officers' lives and those of the public are assigned much value.

A major comment is required per above use of word "murder". All these events we learn of are not murders. For example, no crime was committed against President Reagan at Washington Hilton hotel by John Hickley. Defendant Hickley was not capable of committing a crime. He was insane. This was the decision of a jury of all our peers. The jury's verdict had nothing to do with the Reagan plan to vastly reform the welfare system. Hickley finally left his restricted medical care facility (St Elizabeth hosp [now FEMA HQ]) and allowed long stays with his mother in Williamsburg, Virginia.

Note that we hear less about the homicides (Don't know if they were murders. I cannot make the judgement) at West Garfield Park, Chicago because the media might not be reporting all events. Thus, lower-48 areas might not be reportable with accuracy.

From my personal perspective, I avoid enclosed shopping malls. I am not religious at all but I do remember some of my heritage and to this day I rely on an English translation of a modified 23 rd Psalm: "Yea though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil, because I am the evilest son of a bitch in the valley".

A closing thought; In 2017, a small group of Congressmen were at a baseball practice session in northern Virginia. A shooting injured 4 of them. The solution is as clear as white light passing through a prism: Ban baseball practice sessions.

That fan's been on so long even the blade guard is super-hot.

 

It’s good to be thinking about this. Everyone who carries a gun should consider if and under what circumstances they could shoot a child, kid or teenager. Even if that leads to a decision that you will not. At least the decision way made with a lot of thought and not in the moment. Count the costs for either shooting or not shooting, both have consequences.

 

My personal stance on this is that combat is move, shoot and communicate. If it’s a kid I’m more likely to select move and communicate over shooting if at all possible. I’m probably going to take bigger risks than I would with an adult.

Sometimes there are multiple paths to victory. However sometimes their isn’t. And as much as I would like to imagine every scenario where I can solve the problem without shooting, I realize a situation might unfold where I have no other reasonable choice but to shoot. I don’t have to be happy about it, but I have to accept it at some level.

 

Could some of this child violence today be directly related to the higher rates of Autism and Asperger syndrome out there? Both of these illnesses leave a lot of kids with reduced levels of sympathy and empathy.

 

A friend / "business associate" of my dad sent his son serving in Vietnam a derringer. His son came to call the derringer his "kid gun".

 

IBME: I will bore you with statistics. Not sure if you will take it as good news or bad news, but this is what the numbers say. Child murders in the U.S are 2.7/ 100,000 population. That number is up slightly from the previous year (2.3) but is has been declining steadily from its high in '94. Comparable number Adult murders are 5.3/ 100,000 population.

The good news: Alaska has one of the lowest murder rates in the nation. Alaska would be 37 out of 50 with 62 murders. California leads the nation with 1830 murders.

The bad news: Alaska leads the nation in aggravated assault with 575.4 / 100,oo and in forcible rape with 116.7/ 100,000.

I think Grizzltyette Adams offered very sound advice on how to approach moving into the city. I would take every single thing she said to heart.

Here is the link if you want to verify: https://www.statista.com/topics/1750/violent-crime-in-the-us/

 

The lack of a juvenile death penalty combined with the movement to ban life imprisonment for juveniles is a disaster for a society. I'm against a mandatory death penalty, but the death penalty should be on the table. The Jonesboro, Arkansas schools shooters? Death for mass premeditated murder. Barry Lukaitis-type cases? Mental treatment followed by decades of probation. Eric and Lyle Menendez? Death due to premeditated double murder. Little Bubba catches Momma raping his 23 month old stepsister and gets his big sister's .357 magnum or Glock 19 to end Momma?! No punishment at all. Judy gets tired of being raped by Pa Heman and blasts him dead with a .30-30 or SKS? No punishment. Ultimately, we will need a legal code to help rebuild society after it has collapsed. Think the Jewish community that hid in the forest from the Nazis, or the German Freikorps. Not Roman lining the Appian way with crosses, nor the Mongols , nor the NKVD, nor Einsatzkommandogruppen. Think the Texas Rangers or German WWII field police instead. Controlled punishment will breed communal support of a justice system, but atrocities will not do likewise.

 

A killer is a killer and unless it was a true act of passion there is now rehabilitation for someone that has no empathy of places no value on human life other than theirs.

We had an 8-year-old kid here shoot a bus driver because she told him that he HAS to sit down or she would have to ban him from the bus. They couldn't even try him and instead put him in a mental health facility where he stabbed an orderly with a broken fluorescent light tube for telling him that he had to stay in his room at night. When he turns 18 they will turn him free unless he kills again after he turns 16. Why is his right to kill and hurt people so much greater than the right of a good citizen to live?

I don't believe in the death penalty believe it or not but I do believe in lock them up and throw away the key. No parole no freedom even in the prison if they are violent there.

It isn't that I have a problem with killing a killer. My problem is that they will kill an innocent man in a flash even with irrefutable evidence that he didn't do it. The Supreme Court has ruled that proof of innocence is not anything that will overturn a sentence of death. You have to get it back in court and try to get a stay and then push for a new trial. In the meantime, they will be pushing hard trying to execute the man before this can be done. Personally, if a district attorney knowingly has an innocent man executed they should be the next body on the table in the execution chamber. Since they can't do it right they don't need to do it! Another thing that they like to do is a man kills a store clerk then runs out where someone is in the car ready to go. They get caught and the killer turns states evidence for a reduced sentence and the driver is executed.