Covid Vaccine By Patch

Discussion in 'News, Current Events, and Politics' started by Pragmatist, Apr 10, 2020.

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  1. Pragmatist

    Pragmatist Master Survivalist
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    https://homelandprepnews.com/stories/47125-potential-covid-19-vaccine-efficacy-assessed/


    Good afternoon all,

    Above tells of one of the several experimental CODID-19 vaccines "in the mill".

    This particular one is delivered via a patch attached to the skin. Article tells that skin is the best interface for the vaccine.

    The other good aspect I see to this is that many private citizens will submit to this form of vaccination whereas they sometimes just avoid the goodness of a vaccination because of the "needle".

    Hope everything turns out as "win-win".
     
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  2. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    Yeppers there are several places now claiming to have the basics of a vaccine for COVID19. That is GOOD news. the bad news is that it will take a year to a year and a half before it is ok for the public. By that time everyone will be either dead, had it and recovered or naturally immune to it for some reason. We need to let it go and return to living instead of cowering in our homes.

    With the exception of mostly Long Island, the massive out of control infection rate just isn't happening. They are taking down the MASH hospital that they had set up in Washington. China is closing its temporary hospitals. It never had a single patient. Even the big outbreaks in Detroit and Chicago are less than 12 thousand infected Houston is still under 4 thousand while Long Island has almost 130 thousand. coming up to 130 thousand. God love them, NYC is a death trap that is snaping closed on them now.
     
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  3. Pragmatist

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    Good afternoon TexDanm,

    Appreciate the info re the closing down of the temp hospitals.

    In complete agreement ! We've got to return to living instead of the house isolation decree.
     
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  4. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    I think that the problem is that the people that were "informing" the government and the people about what to expect based it on bad models. I think that what we are seeing on Long Island is what their models projected for our entire country. That isn't what happened at all and they don't seem to be able to back off of it. ??? What we have in all but on Long Island is basically a rather normal EPIDEMIC. Long Island as of today had almost 130,000 people infected and their medical abilities are overwhelmed. No other major urban area has anything like this level of infection.

    Logic would indicate that we need to shut down Long Island until it is either under control or run its course but the rest of the country needs to go back to work just as we always have when there were epidemics.
     
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  5. Pragmatist

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    Good morning TexDanm,

    Concur with the specifics.

    What I also see going on concurrently with this epidemic is a national economic restructuring.

    I believe the bad models were deliberate and many on purpose.

    The $2.2 trillion - actually $2.5 trillion emergency capital infusion into closed businesses has the US Government holding equity in some major airlines (not finalized as of today). The public schools and their too-large of payrolls (many are not educators) are in restructuring mode. The social distancing rules also govern the institutes of lower education (less the needed community colleges) and how they could be shrinking from the national scene. They're just holding tanks anyway, with the kids unemployable, less via artificial governmental jobs. Restaurants must merge for economies of scale and pay their labor force enough to remove the public sector from the restaurant equation (eg health care costs). The military is already restructuring with the battle cry now being "social distancing". The aircraft carrier USS Teddy Roosevelt stuck in Guam, tells the story about healthy crews needed on submarines or we'll all be playing mah jong.

    It's metro New York City, the city, much of Long Island, the neighboring New Jersey area, neighboring Connecticut area. Didn't forget to add the restructuring of the national health care delivery system. The symbolism of a hospital ship sailing from Norfolk, Virginia to New York City tells much.

    My guess is that "religious exemptions" for vaccinations like the annual flu shot will go away. Inadequate personal hygiene and/or bad personal health habits (at more than 1 of my area veterans' organizations are members whose breakfast is a 6-pak and 2 pop-tarts in the toaster means no health care nor public sector checks.)

    The nation is being restructured via the vehicle of the epidemic.
     
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  6. Old Geezer

    Old Geezer Legendary Survivalist
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    The coronavirus pandemic now has three variations. We're not talking a vaccine, we're talking vaccines. People will survive one variation, get kind of better yet weakened, then get another variation, might make it, be further weakened, then get another variation, ...

    So a person gets one vaccine or two, but the other strains of coronavirus are mutating like crazy.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...-strains-coronavirus-spreading-Australia.html
     
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  7. Pragmatist

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    Good morning Old Geezer,

    Just read the excellent Daily Mail article.

    The subheading clarified much.

    Quality maps in the article.
     
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  8. Blitz

    Blitz Master Survivalist
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    I personally don't think the community at large should depend on a vaccine saving them. It takes years to develop them (in the case of the Ebola virus it took around 5 years before a vaccine was used).

    https://www.scmp.com/news/china/sci...no-vaccine-sars-or-mers-will-there-be-one-new

    https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2020/02/covid-vaccine/607000/

    "Overall, if all pieces fell into place, Hatchett guesses it would be 12 to 18 months before an initial product could be deemed safe and effective. That timeline represents “a vast acceleration compared with the history of vaccine development,” he told me. But it’s also unprecedentedly ambitious. “Even to propose such a timeline at this point must be regarded as hugely aspirational,” he added."
     
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  9. lonewolf

    lonewolf Societal Collapse Survivalist. Staff Member
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    read just this morning that a UK vaccine is probably 18 months away, I think 2020 is cancelled and we should start thinking about next year for any kind of activity or event.
     
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  10. Ystranc

    Ystranc Master Survivalist
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    Some of the early posts in the thread seem to imply that Covid-19 isn't a serious threat, it is. Luckily for the rest of the US a lot of the New Yorkers afflicted with Covid-19 (or Corona virus as it is called) were not particularly affluent or mobile but you should make no mistake some will have travelled and the disease has already spread and will start to show up, first in cities with large medical facilities where they're testing for it. It has a long incubation period meaning it can be transmitted far and wide before any symptoms show, there are also quite a high percentage of people who are asymptomatic meaning they are carriers or super carriers of the disease.
    If the whole social distancing program is ended too soon it will just mean that more people will be affected at any given time and healthcare workers will be completely overwhelmed. Parts of the US have a major advantage because of a very low population density but your cities are another matter.
    Just a thought to put things in context, if the average person knows in the region of 200 people then it is likely that they will lose 4 of them.
     
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  11. Blitz

    Blitz Master Survivalist
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    I agree with your post Ystranc regarding it easily spreading throughout the country (meaning US). Just because New York is so badly affected doesn't mean the rest of the country isn't going to follow suit, if social distancing isn't strictly practised. To be honest, I think the US has missed the boat. As you pointed out regarding the incubation period and people who are asymptomatic, I suspect it's already travelling far and wide. The US figures aren't very encouraging, given US is only around 100 case from being the country with the most deaths. It's already now the country with the most cases.

    I'm not necessarily an advocate of social distancing per se, as I believe it's going to have to be dealt with sooner or later. The only thing I do agree with regarding social distancing, is that it gives the health system a breather so they aren't totally overwhelmed. As a long term strategy, it's just not practicable unless you social distance for the next 5 years or whatever. Australia is going to continue practising the current social distancing for the next 6 months - minimum. Given the state of the economy and the strict implementation of this social distancing, it's going to have a major impact on people's lives - more so than it is currently.

    Another article emphasises the importance of being realistic regarding finding a vaccine. As the scientist points out, they still haven't been able to make a vaccine for HIV.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...avirus-cure-issues-warning-NEVER-vaccine.html
     
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  12. lonewolf

    lonewolf Societal Collapse Survivalist. Staff Member
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    it has ben said that NYC now has more cases of the virus than any other country outside the US, when you see film of mass graves then you know its serious.
    as for social distancing that can go on as long as possible, I know humans are supposed to be "social" animals but it might be better if they weren't, I know a couple of families here who are in and out of each others houses all the time and they will be wiped out if the virus ever gets here.
     
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  13. Pragmatist

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    Good morning Ystranc,

    Your point is understood and accepted.

    It is the - context - of this infectious disease that is at issue.

    Health care workers are overwhelmed because of reasons preceding COVID-19. The states had restrictions on even EMTs crossing state lines. Currently the laws are relaxed on this but it was a "too late-too little". PPE inventories were a scandal prior to COVID-19 although not in the news. The Governor of NY, in the last 5 years closed down 4 hospital so the funding could go to wind farms.

    Dense urban living is caused by zoning and large segments of public housing built in these minimal areas. Poor quality living environments were present prior to COVID-19. Recall...at least the Americans will remember this...the drinking water contamination in Detroit prior to COVID-19. Michigan is not a poor state. Today it's even a "Right To Work State" limiting labor union requirements a bit. I'm just saying Detroit is still an unhealthy place to live.

    This isn't an essay against your points; just providing some of the socio-economic environment. Nursing homes, old age homes ... 2 years ago Florida started to "clean up their act" by requiring better conditions... hospice homes, prisons, all known as incubators of infectious disease unless properly staffed and maintained. New York City and environs is the textbook case.

    Many other examples, like the Veterans Health Administration, are known to some. When the cruise ships experienced an array of infections, CDC set up an program but not allowed to close down the industry - for the usual political reasons.

    The quarantines translate to people not working with the resultant term "social ills" arising. They don't go to Walmart to buy the extra needed alcohol and soap because of lack of money. Some of those quarantined must make more trips to stores because of shortages and rationing.

    I've been receiving many emails from my veterans and emergency responder groups about helping out re home repairs for those in need. I'm quarantined both because of being a Virginian and old age (73). People with the well house broken must either get nice people to deliver water or help them relocate.

    There are many more examples. COVID-19 is infectious and it's not neglected. The overall problem is poor quality government. It is bloated with sinecures.
     
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  14. Blitz

    Blitz Master Survivalist
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    Are you saying there are so many cases of Covid-19 because America has gone to the dogs?
     
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  15. Pragmatist

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    Good morning Blitz,

    Yes.

    If I may generalize just to type this out, American society and the governments accept poor hygiene practices. Poor health care by the individual is common. Alcoholic beverages and snack foods are well beyond the realm of helping one's health.

    Etc.

    and the cars are nice, late model ........
     
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  16. lonewolf

    lonewolf Societal Collapse Survivalist. Staff Member
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    I think there are a lot of people in England who because of the virus have never washed their hands so much before!!! some people have disgusting habits and are probably paying the price now.
     
  17. Ystranc

    Ystranc Master Survivalist
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    All true and valid points, for my part I believe that the British government missed a trick early on by not insisting that people wear face masks in public when it is known that they can cut person to person transmission of the virus by 98%, combined with social distancing that would have dramatically slowed the spread of the outbreak also creating less stress on the health service and restricting the viral load that has killed so many fine Doctors and nurses here in the UK.
    There was a tendency for governments in the west not to take this seriously until people (voters) started dying in huge numbers.
    This is not over, it's barely begun.
     
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  18. Pragmatist

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    Good afternoon Ystrance,

    I believe the UK and US did not initially require public use of masks because of lack of mask supplies.

    After WTC 9-11 and the anthrax terrorism scare in the US, funds and programs were allocated for bio-warfare. The US political subdivisions, such as states and cities, reallocated these funds for other budget items.

    Having a public requirement would mean school kids must have masks. This means the school district must provide the masks. Much of school district funds are for construction and payroll. It would require some invisible tax. Masks are for safety reasons and this means labor union contracts could force companies/government agencies to provide masks. Same issue again; supplies not available nor the contingency funds.

    The political subdivisions of the US are too numerous and more focused on reelections than a PPE supply.

    Of course public use of masks would help. Yet, the overall strategic problem requires addressing the overbuilt large cities, nursing homes, prisons, military organizations. The current event re the aircraft carrier USS Teddy Roosevelt, stuck in Guam, is a good example. The population is mobile and the virus follows the population.

    I can guess university dormitory living (overpriced hotel rooms) will be leaving the scene along with cruise ships.
     
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  19. Ystranc

    Ystranc Master Survivalist
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    I probably didn't make myself completely clear, I meant that the masks should have been worn outside the home during any activity that is essential such as buying groceries or essential work. (I have worn a mask, gloves and glasses each time I've been out) With the continuing lockdown in place in the UK kids would have been at home and as such they are the responsibility of the parents not schools.
    There are fairly limited opportunities for people to go out in groups of more than two (plus any kids in the household) Most stores only allow one person at a time to enter the store, their partner is asked to wait outside or in the car. Non essential shops are closed. Restaurants and bars are closed in order to try to prevent socialising.
    While we do not have the complicated political subdivision we have had the same problems caused by poor information and with the supply of PPE. (My sanitiser, safety glasses, masks and gloves are from my own stock and have not deprived anyone of the opportunity to buy them...that's prepping, something our respective governments have failed badly at.)
     
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    1. Blitz
      I think the other issue with Western countries wearing masks is that it isn't a culture they are familiar with. Here, even now, in a rural community, if you wear a mask there's a certain stigma attached. It's hard to explain. It's like if you wear a mask you're advertising the fact that you are sick. It's a whole different mindset than Asia and one that will take time to change. People in Western countries are more reluctant to wear masks. Having said that, in trendy built up areas, it's now becoming a fashion statement. Who can come up with the most fashionable, innovative mask.

      What really made me laugh when I watched Prince Harry and Meghan Markle parading around LA giving away food, was the bandanna that Harry was wearing. He didn't even have it covering his nose half the time. I thought, what a waste of time.
       
      Blitz, Apr 26, 2020
  20. Pragmatist

    Pragmatist Master Survivalist
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    Good morning Ystranc,

    Understand; appreciate clarification.

    Here in the upstart colonies it really is a different environment and situation.

    The US has large "communities" of those receiving mental health counseling, many in drug rehab programs, many just sick but can still operate a car (not necessarily safely), a noticeable group of people walking around with medical oxygen tanks for their breathing. A LARGE number of the populace who are defiant of any rules is present. Many clusters of poor people are here.

    Poor people require the public sector providing PPE or they won't have any to wear. These people cannot be prohibited from going to a store and shopping with their SNAP/food stamps. A major aspect of governmental planning is remembering the large urban riots of the 1960s and 1970s with some follow-ons.

    If some healthy youths enter a store without masks/gloves and the store management refuses them entry, the store is now a danger zone. If I was waiting in line to enter, I'd immediately leave the area.

    If some homeless shelterees decide to leave the shelter to go shopping, they cannot be stopped. They will not have masks/gloves. Many/most street people have illnesses and are infected with lice, etc. Is there a solution for this situation? These homeless cannot be arrested. A major weak link in the US is our under-funded public safety apparatus.

    ......

    Yes,; Poor information is provided by governments here also. This is less about public affairs departments and much more so about the spoils system of the civil service labor forces. The illiterate cannot properly prepare press releases nor properly reply to the public's composite questions.

    ......

    The quarantine/lockdown problems of the US are just a visible aspect of the collapsed welfare state that's insolvent.
     
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