Fear Of Terrorism Preventing Travel

Discussion in 'Safety' started by pacmantacman, Apr 27, 2019.

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  1. pacmantacman

    pacmantacman Expert Member
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    I talk to a lot of people about travel and it’s interesting how many people refuse to travel to many places around the world do to the fear of terrorism.

    Your chances of being a victim of a terrorist incident is actually pretty low. I think statistically it’s been said you are more likely to be killed by a dog. You are definitely more likely to be killed or injured in a car wreck. Regardless it’s a low probability. Even lower if you take precautions and get some training on safe travel aboard.

    Yet I know a great many people who will not travel out of fear of terrorism. I think that’s totally up to the individual, however IT DOES SPEAK TO THE EFFECTIVENESS OF TERRORISM at least in this context.

    I know for many Americans the fact that you are without a firearms is a major demotivating factor on top of the threat of terrorism. But generally they want the firearm, for just such terrorist incidents, and of course other criminal acts.

    I’ve greatly enjoyed overseas travel. Thoughts? Personal thoughts and your thoughts on the effectiveness of terrorism on travel?
     
  2. Sonofliberty

    Sonofliberty Master Survivalist
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    My rich uncle sent me to most of the countries I was interested in. These days, I refuse to fly due to the tsa. Let them touch someone else's ass. As for taking a cruise, I refuse to do that because they won't even allow you to edc basic survival gear. I am not talking guns, I mean survival gear. If the damned boat sinks, you are screwed. No thanks. Then there is the crime and disease endemic to cruise line travel these days. IMO, it just isn't worth. JMO, YMMV.
     
  3. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    I have no need to travel abroad, my world is right here.
    have you seen the queue's at the airports these days? no thanks.
     
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  4. TMT Tactical

    TMT Tactical The Great Lizard !
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    Ex-military brat. I have seen enough of the world. I will confine my travels to the good old USA. Enough wonders and beauty for any lifetime and no 3rd. world problems to deal with.
     
  5. Ystranc

    Ystranc Master Survivalist
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    The rest of the world seems to be going to hell in a hand basket, I'm sure it can continue quite nicely without needing me to go and watch it happen.
     
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  6. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    Those types of statistics are misleading. The chances of a person being injured by a cow are higher than that they will be bitten by a shark in no way indicates that swimming in shark-infested water is safe. If you stay out of the water you pretty much have ZERO chance of getting bit by a shark.

    At this time I have little to no interest in touring Bagdad much less Tehran. Most of the Middle East and all of Mexico right now is pretty chancy to wander around in. There are a lot of beautiful places to go that really are about as safe as the city streets in the nice parts of most American cities. Unless I have business that requires me to go to places that are rather turbulent I don't go. When I was young that wasn't true but now I just don't get a thrill out of possible danger that I did then.

    There are just places that if you go and something happens you should be on your own. If you go to North Korea and the little fat man has you snatched you did it to yourself. The same is true of Americans that go touring in Iran or people that go into Juarez Mexico in small groups at night.

    Times change and the relationships with different countries change. Iran used to be a friendly place as was Mexico when I was young. Now it isn't true. Vietnam and Cuba used the be "enemy" states and now not so much. Judgment is variable as to how much threat is acceptable to an individual. There are parts of Chicago and Michigan that aren't much better after sundown.
     
  7. Morgan101

    Morgan101 Master Survivalist
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    Does a fear of Terrorism prevent me from traveling? Not really. I really have no desire to go to the Middle East or anyplace where Terrorism is more prevalent. I was a road warrior for many years. Flew hundreds of thousands of miles in the U.S. and Europe. My beef isn't with the TSA, although there is no love lost there. My beef is with the airlines. Their incompetence and arrogant attitude make me refuse to fly. I feel that giving them my business perpetuates the bad attitude and poor performance.

    If I can't drive I won't go. Agree with TMT 100%. There is enough to see in this country to last a lifetime. I really don't care about going anywhere else.
     
  8. pacmantacman

    pacmantacman Expert Member
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    There are those Americans who will not even travel to Europe out of fear of Terrorism, so I’m not completely talking about the Middle East.
     
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  9. Morgan101

    Morgan101 Master Survivalist
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    I would not rule out Europe, at least not because of Terrorism. I would also not rule out Australia or New Zealand. Outside of those places I really have to think about anyplace I would want to go. Nothing comes to mind.
     
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  10. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    When I think of terrorism Europe and Australia don't really jump to my mind. Mostly terrorism or at least chronic active violence that might be aimed at foreigners is in the Middle East, Africa, and in the Nations in Central and South America where the drug and crime lords are running things.
     
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  11. pacmantacman

    pacmantacman Expert Member
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    Paris?
     
  12. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    No ghetto is a place for the faint of heart and the French have allowed the riffraff to take over their Capital. Somehow that isn't surprising to me. France is supposed to be a lovely country filled with friendly people...as long as you AVOID Paris. I have heard that for Decades.
     
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  13. Morgan101

    Morgan101 Master Survivalist
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    Paris, London, Brussels have all been targeted. Malmo Sweden is certainly no bargain. Maybe the allure of the historical things to see, and at least a perception that there is a stronger sense of Law and Order would still make me want to travel there. Again, a perception, or an opinion, I believe if something happened I would feel more secure with the London or Paris Police in charge than I would with the Mexico City or Rio De Janiero Police.
     
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  14. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    Now THAT is a fact. Mexico is teetering on the edge of total anarchy. Sadly, justice is in short supply in most of the Central and South American nations. As long as the US refuses to put the drug lords out of business by decriminalizing drug addiction this will continue.
     
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  15. CountryGuy

    CountryGuy Master Survivalist
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    I wouldn't say thought of terrorisim worries me, more the BS of dealing with lines at security, TSA morons, crap attitude airport and airline employees, cramped planes and poor service. I'd go to Europe, Asia, parts of South America.

    I do have some worry as my daughter and her grandmother(MIL) are going on a French club trip towards the end of June. A few days in Paris and other stops in France, Switzerland, Germany and I think Holland? I have been trying to teach her situational awareness, especially in a restaurants, shops. markes and other open places. I've been trying to drill into her head what to do if she is somewhere and the shit breaks loose. Trying to make her understand to not follow the herd or her teachers instructions if it goes counter to what I'm teaching her. Trying to get her to understand the teachers first thought is to be a herd animal where as she needs to be willy like a pig. I've tried to get her to understand that an initial incident could just be a funnel into additional kill zones, trying to teach her difference between cover and concealment and how to get out of the middle and to the edges of a group or area. So though I can't be there and I can't pack her off with a 1911, I can try to give her knowledge.

    To me it's not to live in fear but it's to be prepared. To not do something or go somewhere out of fear is for those Muslim goat fuckers to succeed. So no I live my life. But that also means don't go to stupid places with stupid people and do stupid things...
     
  16. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    This isn't really about fear as I see it. It is about common sense and how much risk an individual is comfortable with. When I was young I had very little of the first and was all too comfortable with the second.
     
  17. pacmantacman

    pacmantacman Expert Member
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    Countryguy is she receptive to the training?
     
    1. CountryGuy
      She has been. I think she thought I was being a little over the top till we watched those idiots in the yellow vests in Paris rioting. Plus the terror attacks various places especially Notre Dame and the Easter Sunday massacre. Again I told her I'm not trying to scare her, I'm trying to inform her and help her to understand what could happen and what she needs to think about and what she needs to do if something goes sideways. I also told her if she goes somewhere and she gets a gut feeling like something isn't right, just leave where they are. But yes I think she is listening. Her Grandmother (my MIL), not so much, but I'd be OK if terrorists took her hostage... lol
       
      CountryGuy, Apr 30, 2019
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  18. Pragmatist

    Pragmatist Master Survivalist
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    Nomad Will: ...

    It's not a function of geography but of risk aspects.

    A rude "Here's your Turkish coffee" in a Tunisian cafe has a safer environment that large areas of the wards (districts) of Washington, D.C. Asian airports, to include the new "stan" states are as safe as North American airports.

    A major acid-test to determine safety levels overseas: Check the insurance availability and rates. If insurance is not available for a trip to the holy city of Qom, Iran, consider the place not safe. If Atlantic Alliance airlines offer routine service on a route, it indicates the route and terminals are relatively safe.

    Meanwhile, West Garfield Park, Chicago, USA is not safer than the 3 Central American republics where our new citizens are arriving from.

    How's the fatal disease rates faring within a 10 mile radius of Candlestick Park, California ?
     
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  19. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    I have NO intention of going to Chicago or DC and California is very iffy for me. Anyplace where the primary purpose of the police and the laws is to protect the criminals by making sure that the honest people can't, won't and don't defend themselves is a no go for me. The death rate for young men 18 to 25 that were living in Washington DC was worse than the death rate of the same age group fighting in Iraq during Desert Storm.
     
  20. Sonofliberty

    Sonofliberty Master Survivalist
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    QFT! Don't forget New Jersey on that list either.
     
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  21. Morgan101

    Morgan101 Master Survivalist
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    Country Guy: I would be very careful in Paris, and maybe in Germany. It would depend on the area. Switzerland and the Netherlands should be fine. I always found them to be beautiful, friendly people. I never worried about my MIL either. We always figured if she was ever taken it would only take about five minutes, and they would bring her back. :eek:

    SOL: I can't rule out Jersey. My daughter lives there. I spent a lot of time in the area; New York and New Jersey both. Have a lot of family back there. Maybe it is a familiarity; knowing where to go and where not to go. I have never felt unsafe back there, ever.
     
  22. DeanB

    DeanB Active Member
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    I have traveled extensively in the USA. Of course having spent 20 yrs in the Corps of which I was deployed a little over 10 yrs to various countries, I just don't consider terrorism a big issue to worry about. But I don't think I will be visiting Middle Eastern countries either and I have been to Israel and other countries in that area in peace time and otherwise. Last year I traveled for 17 days in Europe. This year I am going to spend a couple of weeks in the Virgin Islands, but I am waiting until September for that. I try to get the the Virgin Islands at least once a year. Hawaii is okay too. So are the Scandinavian counties, the only place I have been where I felt uncomfortable is Turkey. Bottom line, travel if you get the chance, otherwise terrorist win!
     
  23. LastOutlaw

    LastOutlaw Master Survivalist
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    I live way out in the country. I was raised traveling all over the world. That was then, this is now. TSA, people in general keep me home now. Since I have become awoken I don't really care to travel anywhere even in the US because if SHTF I know it will happen when I am off at Disney World 1800 miles from home considering my luck. While I dont stay locked in my home I do feel uncomfortable if I am more than a days drive from home. I have to say though that other than the middle east countries all of europe seems a lot safer than lets say, Mexico. I think today you can be targeted in many countries including the US for simply being American, white, Christian, anglo saxon whatever.

    Illnesses:
    Living in the country and homeschooling the kiddo has pretty much wiped out any illnesses we have in our home. There hasn't been one cold or flu in this household for over 4 years. Then the kiddo hurt her ankle and had to go to the DR. They came home and said "everyone there was either sniffling or coughing." Within one week we all had a bad cold.

    Just stay home and visit the world through the Internet. It is safer and cheaper! Make your own lei if it makes you feel better.
     
  24. Bishop

    Bishop Master Survivalist
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    I am get ready in a couple of weeks to go over seas again and if your vigilant you have a better chance of not having problems I travel all over the us in some really shady spots and don't have any problems
     
  25. duke in wales

    duke in wales Expert Member
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    The majority of Americans don't travel overseas which is a great shame, travel and you experience different cultures, languages, food, music, fashion even smells. We are very lucky in the UK in that flights to and from Europe are dirt cheap, I can fly UK to Spain return flights for about $US150 and generally speaking accommodation is cheaper than the UK. We have a place in Spain and flights are cheap enough to make weekends over there are affordable so long as you book well in advance. In fact its often cheaper to fly to Spain than get a train from here in Wales to London...crazy.

    Some places I would not go to are just because I don't want to go. Overall tourist resorts are safe enough but I've been to Egypt, Morroco, Tunisia etc and just don't want to go back. Our government update a list of countries considered unsafe to visit as a tourist you can view online. https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice
     
  26. Pragmatist

    Pragmatist Master Survivalist
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    Good afternoon Duke in Wales,

    Is it possible the Wales-London train rides subsidize the UK - Spain flights ? That's how it's done in Asia.

    I wonder if that UK government web site on foreign travel advice synchro - meshes with the insurance industry's advice and requirements of its policy holders for products such as KHI - Kidnapping and Hostage Insurance. I don't know the UK market but my second home is Hong Kong and the basic rule re the equivalent US Government foreign travel advice site is to pretend you're walking past a germ research laboratory. The basic rule is to avoid like the plague. No pun intended; just rely on the private sector and avoid the public sector like the Ebola virus.
     
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  27. Keith H.

    Keith H. Moderator Staff Member
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    I no longer travel overseas, not because the fear of terrorism, but simply because for me it is a waste of money & nothing to gain. I come home saying to myself "well that's a couple of thousand dollars down the toilet, think what you could have done to improve your survival chances & your lifestyle if you had stayed at home!".
    It would be nice to see some of my family in Wales again, but my family here are quite frankly of more importance to me.
    Keith.
     
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  28. duke in wales

    duke in wales Expert Member
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    The airline prices just reflect good old fashioned market competition, nothing to do with the government.

    No, I'm confident that the government don't sync with insurance companies and if I needed K&H insurance I'd not travel. My idea of travel is warm weather plus good food and wine :)
     
  29. Pragmatist

    Pragmatist Master Survivalist
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    Good morning Duke in Wales,

    "Good old fashioned competition" and the EU's rigged political economy involves the word "oxymoron". What I wrote above is what's going on.

    Agree with warm weather environs.
     
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  30. duke in wales

    duke in wales Expert Member
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    Are you having a bad day? Do you know anything about the UK and the EU or just spouting bollocks you read on some site run by people who need to cut down on their coffee intake and get out more?
     
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  31. Pragmatist

    Pragmatist Master Survivalist
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    Good morning Duke in Wales,

    I have a familiarity with the UK especially re the North Sea oil fields, PIK airport, Glasgow, and the London Bubble finance companies. Also know some basics about the EU.

    I know much about rail travel, economically speaking, being less costly an economic activity than air travel.

    There are correlations and causations involved in re a rail trip Wales-London and an air trip UK - Spain. I have a hunch others, especially those in the UK, also understand this.

    Don't spend much time on the web; have opth ... can't spell ... eye ailments.
     
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  32. duke in wales

    duke in wales Expert Member
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    I love airline competition, serves us well. Couple of years ago we had to go out to one of the Canary Islands, budget airline tickets were under £200, the next cheapest was Dutch Airline KLM and they wanted £475.

    The UK rail system is awful, old rolling stock, under funded. Trains get cancelled, run late, arrive late are often not that clean and charge a weeks pay for a beer and ham sandwich which is a shame as I love rail travel. If you like trains you need to try the Shuttle UK to France and the Orient Express, done the shuttle a few times, the OE only once. The Blue Train in the RSA is on my bucket list :)
     
  33. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    if i cant go somewhere in my own vehicle I don't go there.
    I don't do public transport, not anymore, too many germs and usually dirty as well.
     
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  34. Pragmatist

    Pragmatist Master Survivalist
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    Good morning Duke in Wales and Lone Wolf,

    Speaking of cleanliness, not applicable to the major US flag carriers. They use standards like in Malaysia and Bangladesh. How do you guys say "filthy" auf British English ?

    My favorite airline was UTA French Airlines. They closed in 2000, the event I also use to mark the collapse of the 5th French Republic.

    The Dutch had a cousin airline to KLM. IT was ALM working the Caribbean routes. IT was "Dutch Clean" but this is more so about the era because "the times they are achanging". Amsterdam, Rotterdam, Europoort just as filthy as nearby environs.

    US airline competition, de facto, is nonexistent. Four major carriers control 80% of domestic seats (think pricing).

    Actually, I don't like trains nor air. I like water transport - but that has changed also. This January, 2020, the new fuel rules get activated and this will price out much of water travel, both commercial and tourist. I'm retired now but the last oil company I was with before going out with my own business, we had a corporate jet aircraft. Starting with President Jimmy Carter and continuing through the other administrations - Reagan, Clinton, onward - until currently with a major review and action planned, there was a program called "Civil Asset Forfeiture". Omitting much, the additional costs to protect against Civil Asset Forfeiture was more expensive than flying the machine over north Canada. Flying north of 60 degrees north lat requires additional aviation insurance ... and this was still cheaper than dealing with Civil Asset Forfeiture. For these cold area flights, Canada required an additional special survival kit. By circumstance I was in charge of this. I finally hired a medically-retired Brit SBS guy who knew about the survival stuff.

    At one time on my list of things to do: Trans Siberian Railroad and Bay of Fundy.
    "Heaven: the place to do all the things you never found time to do." Anon
     
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  35. duke in wales

    duke in wales Expert Member
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    Filthy in more modern slang would be 'Minging' (covers a lot, 'it is minging' 'she is minging (or a minger) in Welsh slang it would be 'ach-y-fi' and in more correct Welsh 'bawlyd'
     
  36. TMT Tactical

    TMT Tactical The Great Lizard !
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    I have enough sights in the good old USA to visit. I have no desire to visit any more foreign countries.
     
  37. CountryGuy

    CountryGuy Master Survivalist
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    Well my daughter and her group had a great time. Said she wasn't to impressed with Paris or France in general. Said only sketchy vibe they got was in Paris at a few of the places they went with younger guys seeming like they were casing them. She loved Switzerland and said she'd love to go back there. Said everything about it was awesome to her. Germany she was ok with but not overly impressed with Munich. She did say she would have like to see some of the different areas in Germany.

    One of these days I'd like to hit parts of Europe.
     
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