Gold Or Silver

Discussion in 'Financial Planning' started by Lee CT NE, Feb 9, 2017.

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  1. Lee CT NE

    Lee CT NE Expert Member

    Blog Posts:
    Investing In Gold – The Basics

    Investing in gold can mean coins, bullion (bars and rounds), jewelry, dental, and scrap. Let’s start by discussing some basics.

    Purity is measured in Ratio (Karats) and Purity (European Marking Fitness – EMF = Parts Per 1,000).
    - 24K/999 = 100%
    - 18K/750 = 75%
    - 14K/583 or 585 = 58%
    - 10K/420 = 42%

    Let’s take a look at abbreviations that can be found on gold and what they mean.

    Gold Plated (GP)

    - Thin Layer Of Gold Bonded Over Base Metal
    - Minimum Thickness Of Seven-Millions Of An Inch

    Gold Filled (GF) – includes K of 14K = 14 GF

    - Layer Of Gold Over A Base Metal
    - Layer Thicker Than The Base Metal Core Itself
    - Must Equal A Minimum Of 5% (1/20) Of Total Weight

    Vermeil - AKA Heavy Gold Electroplate (HE, HGE)

    - Core Of Sterling Silver (.925 Silver Purity)
    - Coated Or Plated With A Minimum 10K Gold To A Thickness Of At Least 2½ Microns (About 100/1,000,000 Of An Inch

    Finally, let’s consider the colors of gold and what they represent.

    - Natural Color
    - Combined With Copper & Silver

    Bright Yellow
    - Combined With Copper, Nickel & Zinc

    - Combined With A Large Percentage Of Silver, Together With Nickel & Zinc
    - Sometimes Plated With Rhodium

    Pink Or Rose
    - Large Percentage Of Copper Together With Zinc & Silver

    Deep Green
    - Combined With Fine Copper, Zinc, & Silver
    - Large Portion Of Copper

    Bright Red
    - Large Portion Of Copper√

    Black Hills Gold
    - Pure 24 Karat Gold Bars, & Stocks Of Pure Silver & Copper
    - Alloyed With Copper To Achieve The Traditional 14 Karat Pink (Or Red)
    - Combined With Silver To Create The 14 Karat Green
    - Manufactured In The Black Hills Of South Dakota

    Remember that Gold weight is according to Troy Pounds, Ounces, and Grams. The Daily Spot/Melt Value of Gold can be found at

    One last tip: Always remember to buy only what you know is true gold. If there is any doubt, then don’t.
  2. Lee CT NE

    Lee CT NE Expert Member

    Blog Posts:

    In addition to Silver Coins, there are two basic types of silver to collect: bullion and coins. Additionally, bullion has an attractive category of Silver Art Bars. So, let’s consider this first.

    Silver Art Bars are commonly found in two types – solid silver and silver-clad. Solid silver is listed as .999 Fine Silver, which means that it is 99.9 % pure silver. These bars come in a various weights with many expressed in grams. However, dollar-for-dollar the most attractive and valuable are the 1 Troy Ounce bars of .999 Fine Silver. A Troy Ounce is equal to 31.1034768 Grams. To me silver-clad bars are just not worth the cost, since the amount of silver used in a silver-clad can vary.

    The artwork on Silver Art Bars is spectacular in most cases. Plus, there are a huge number of art categories from which to choose. Prices vary according to the rarity and total number produced (aka minted). That rarity value can be added to the spot-value of silver to determine a base-value. The rarity value is based on what is listed in the Guide Book of Silver Art Bars, which is in its 6th Edition.

    Fine Silver Art Bars are common on eBay and in Pawn Shops and Coin Stores. Just check them to be sure you’re bidding on or buying 1 Troy Ounce bars of .999 Fine Silver.

    Sterling Silver is 92.5 percent silver, as opposed to the 99.9 percent purity of Fine Silver. There are Art Bars made of Sterling Silver, but by purity alone are not as valuable, nor are they as well collected.

    Silver Rounds are another way to invest in Silver. As with Art Bars, they also come in solid silver and silver-clad. Many are true art forms and beautiful to behold.

    Spot-value is what primarily drives the value of Silver Rounds. A number of mints, U.S. and foreign, produce this type of collectible Silver. Some very collectible and valuable series exist. Do some research and you’ll find more then you might expect.

    Common errors investors and collectors both make are as follows.
    - Not Investing Time In Study/Research
    - No Plan/Not Sticking To It
    - Greed
    - No Goals
    - “Too-Good-To-Be-True” Factor

    Collecting silver is easy enough for kids to do. Plus, it makes an excellent family activity. Just put everyone’s change in a jar and go through it once a month. I do! For Silver Art Bars and Rounds, check out what’s available and affordable, and have your family vote on which Bar(s) and/or Rounds you will to purchase.

    Additionally, having silver in your nest egg is a good hedge on inflation and a weak economy. Plus, if “paper money” bombs, you have an easily spendable commodity!
    WarHorse52 likes this.
  3. Lee CT NE

    Lee CT NE Expert Member

    Blog Posts:
    Understanding Melt Value

    Melt Value is how much actual gold, silver, etc. is in the coin. To understand it, you first need to know about the weight system used to measure precious metals such as gold and silver.

    Troy Weights: Ounce = 31.10 grams & Pound = 12 Troy Ounces

    The Daily Spot (aka value) is the current Melt Value and is for one (1) Troy Ounce. A good source for the current Daily Spot is

    The value of gold and silver coins includes the actual Melt Value, which is based on the percentage of gold or silver in the coin. For our purposes, I’ll only discuss U.S. Silver Coins, which come in four (4) percentages of silver content.
    - 99% only include American Silver Eagle Dollars (1986-present)
    - 90% includes dimes, quarters, and half-dollars that are dated on or before 1964; dollars before 1936; and commemorative dollars 1983-2011
    - 40% includes 1965-69 half-dollars; 1971-74 Proof “Ike” dollars; and more scarce are the collector (Proof) versions of the Bicentennial quarters, half-dollars, and dollars
    - 35% only include wartime nickels 1942-1945, however there also exists a non-silver 1942 nickel

    A nice source to find the current Melt Value of particular U.S. Gold and Silver coins, as well as Canadian Silver coins, Mexican Silver and Gold coins, and Gold Coins from France, England, and Switzerland is

    Another point to consider when determining a coin’s price is the collectability and/or rarity of a gold or silver coin, as well as its condition. Remember, the Melt Value is only the starting point in determining a coin’s value.
  4. Lee CT NE

    Lee CT NE Expert Member

    Blog Posts:
    I have accumulated both a variety of silver and gold coins, as well as bullion (rounds or bars not part of the United States Coinage). Both are a hedge against the collapse of the US Dollar. They are also useful in emergencies/disasters when banks are not able to function.

    I always think "What if?" when setting up for survival in less than ideal situations.
    Old Geezer likes this.
  5. Old Geezer

    Old Geezer Legendary Survivalist

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    U.S. silver currency, 1964 and before, will be used for barter after the U.S. dollar tanks. Everyone has some of these coins. Put back some rolls of this coinage. Bullion could be made illegal, however it would be more difficult to make illegal the coins the government itself struck and put into circulation as currency. At worst, you'd only get face value. Flash gold coins and you may get lead in return -- too much concentration of wealth. Common man can't afford gold. I can't.

    Again, these "junk" coins are omnipresent and their value is published, i.e. known by all. If you weigh the coins, the silver content is 90% -- you instantly know how much silver is sitting in front of you. During a monetary collapse, these coins will again be currency, just like ammo, and tools, and canned food, and nails, and matches, and cigarettes, and whiskey, and ..............

    Barter = "It is what it is."
    Lee CT NE likes this.
  6. jeager

    jeager Master Survivalist

    Blog Posts:
    SILVER, SILVER, SILVER, SILVER, SILVER,..................

    Silver is all I'd care about. Gold is hard to break up into usable currency but silver comes in fractional
    sizes and need not be broken down.
    Starting at 1/10th ounce so no need to cut up silver ounce coins.
    I have some silver ounce bars and rounds that I often use for gifts, b-days, X-mass, etc.
    No one was ever disappointed to get a gift of silver.
    See the link below. There are other sites on the web .
    Consider also less than precious metals like copper rounds or bar.
    Cheaper than silver by far and probably negotiable.
    Just a suggestion.
    Last edited: May 5, 2017
    Lee CT NE likes this.
  7. WarHorse52

    WarHorse52 Expert Member

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    There is a Gold Combo Bar now available! I have a few of them, but I still like silver better!
  8. watcherchris

    watcherchris Legendary Survivalist

    Blog Posts:

    I would think that one should have a diversified portfolio.

    Gold, silver, and along with that ...a generous supply of Copper, lead , and brass.

    Wondering what some are thinking here????



    Not an Ishmaelite
  9. watcherchris

    watcherchris Legendary Survivalist

    Blog Posts:

    What Olde Geezer has posted here is quite correct .

    What most people do not know and will never be taught in our phony education that with the Coinage Act of 2 April 1792....a system of weights and measures in Gold, Silver, and copper was established ....

    Cash means coin....not numbers printed on a piece of paper or on Computer digits.

    If you ever get silver coins of .9 silver content ..conforming to the Coinage Act and line them becomes clear that there is a rationale to them...a logic and them as a system of weights and measures.

    When you buy pure is weighed in a system of measures called Troy Ounces.

    In America when you convert this silver to money...coinage switch to a system of measures called Dollars and Cents.

    This is the dirty little secret which our phoney/fake education system and our phony leadership do not want our up and coming generations to know or even recognize.

    When first I learned it ....I was stunned to find out that before Nickles there was in circulation a coin called "A Half Dime."

    It was a five cent weight of silver ...half the size and weight of a silver dime and .9 fine in silver. I have three of them in my historical collection to remind me how phony and fake is our leadership and has been for many many years now.

    When you line up the silver coins.....including a half can see that there is a logic...a rationale to them.

    The Dollar newly minted condition is the same weight as two half dollars...four quarters, Ten Dimes, twenty half dimes...

    It makes sense...and so too does it in gold...a rationale to it.

    And pennies were denominated in measures to the penny weight.

    Now today, because we have educated sophisticated intelligent people running things, we have now in circulation a Susan B. Anthony dollar which is smaller than a fifty cent piece and claims to be worth twice as much.

    We have gone from a Biblical Standard of linear weights and measures to a non Biblical standard of non linear weights and measures.

    To put it in short form...we have gone to a counterfeit system of weights and measures in our coinage...and away from a Biblical standard.

    What happens as the governments tend to counterfeit the moneys ..and the economic system fails....historically that these governments tend to outlaw the use of gold and silver....and demand by law that everyone conform to their phony counterfeit system which caused the economic problems in the first place.

    That is what people need to know historically ....that governments will tend to outlaw any economic competition which they do not control....including any competing money and silver.

    But people are not stupid.....they will create a working economy if the official economy no longer works. They will create a working money keep commerce working.

    Governments tend to and towards cheating in the money systems and counterfeiting the money system ..whether in coinage or in electronic digits...government will always corrupt/counterfeit.

    This is one of the dirty little secrets that government does not want anyone to know...and will go to great lengths to never let anyone in public schooling through college levels ...ever get a hint it is going on.

    What is going on in Venezuela is a textbook example of government spending going on an the counterfeiting of a money supply. It happened in Mexico in the late 1970s leading to runaway...hyperinflation...and is happening in Venezuela today. It happened in many other countries in the 20th century. But much of this is omitted from our history books...and replaced to day with such nonsense as sports or the Kardashians.

    People need a diversified portfolio.....Gold , Silver, Copper, Brass, Lead...all precious metals.

    Think it makes sense.


    Not an Ishmaelite
    Lee CT NE likes this.
  10. lonewolf

    lonewolf Legendary Survivalist Staff Member

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    a lot of the British currency, coins and paper money, has been replaced in recent years, anything that went before is not legal currency and cannot be used in shops and other places, whether any of it has any value to a collector or dealer is another matter and one which I have no knowledge of.
  11. watcherchris

    watcherchris Legendary Survivalist

    Blog Posts:
    Collectors and dealers do not keep an economy going.

    All your government is doing by changing the phony coins and paper money is "herding" people in a direction they want...and steering the economy for Government ends...such that they /Government can outspend the people and perpetuate their tenure in office at public expense.

    This is the same phony tactic our own government is doing here in the states.

    If they outlaw the previous paper monies and or means that in a crunch ...they will outlaw gold and silver too. One need not be rocket material to come to this conclusion.

    All previous paper monies and coins are still legal tender here in the States. and silver coinage are also under a status of which most Americans have not a clue.

    This status is called "Lawful Tender".... not Legal Tender.

    And I believe this kind of knowledge is deliberately missing from the minds of many Englishmen educated in public schools as it is so with Americans educated in the same or similar schools.

    This knowledge too...will never be covered on the History Channel or on the National Geographic Channel ....or in the news media which claims here to be looking out for us.
    Mostly older people know this about money and what it is supposed to be...a system of just weights and measures in metals....not the younger generations. The younger generations haven't a clue...most of them.
    And I don't believe this is accidental but deliberately manufactured.

    There exists here...Lawful Money and also Legal Tender...two distinctly different those who known and have educated themselves.

    There was one preacher here many many years ago who had a television program and he was about to teach this about money ...a just weight and measure Biblically Speaking.

    He was shut down and audited by the Government for trying to take his television program there and expose the counterfeit money system going on here in America.

    This happened back with the Ronald Reagan Administration and I remember this and the preacher.

    This is what happens when you get Ishmaelites in public offices. And England is rife with Ishmaelites. So too is our government here...patterned after the Crown's economic and social policies.

    My non Ishmaelite .02,

    Lee CT NE likes this.
  12. TCinNC

    TCinNC Well-Known Member

    Blog Posts:
    I'm still wrestling with the simplicity of economics behind a catastrophic event (SHTF) regarding the benefit of having gold/silver. The U.S. is the world's largest economy, at an annual GDP of just under $20T. China is listed as second at 60 - 70% of the U.S., but I would argue that it's a house of cards and is both significantly smaller than stated and immensely more unstable. After that, in rough numbers relative to US GDP, comes Japan (40%), Germany (30%), England (25%), France (25%). It takes the second, third, and fourth largest economies combined, assuming that I'm right about China being grossly overstated, to equal the U.S. and it takes the four largest non-Chinese economies to exceed the U.S.

    Problem: If the dollar fails, the China house of cards will collapse overnight as well (we're their largest debtor and they are our largest creditor, as indicated by the trade imbalance). Greece (about 50th on the GDP list) almost brought down Europe except for two bailouts from Germany. Puerto Rico may still bring down the U.S. because of the money squandered there by Congress over the decades ($70B) and they are only about 60th on the GDP list. It's easy to see that small problems in such a complex global financial system can create enormous ripple effects.

    Therefore, a dollar collapse will essentially mean the end of every economy, everywhere. If no economy exists anywhere on the planet, then at what value are gold/silver assessed? These metals have no intrinsic value, any more than diamonds. They are only "valuable" because global economies exists. In the current market they can act as an inflation hedge. If there is no market, a complete global economic vacuum, please tell me how to determine the amount of your shiny metal that I should accept in exchange for harvesting my crops.

    I have never been able to reconcile basic economic theory with the proposition of gold/silver being substitute currencies after SHTF and makes the dollar worthless. Everyone betting on bitcoin will wake up to the same reality, because after the dollar dies, there's nothing but grief! Admitted, the dollar is a fiat currency (as is everything printed today), but faith in gold/silver leaves me as cold as the metals themselves.

    Side note: I believe that one of the signs of corruption in the Roman Empire that presaged it's fall was the practice of shaving slivers off of gold coins. This eventually allowed the accumulation of enough gold shavings to make a new gold coin, which was technically a devaluation of Roman coinage and a driver of inflation. So even when gold was mandated as the coin of the realm by the emperor, it didn't solve any problems or stabilize the empire!
  13. watcherchris

    watcherchris Legendary Survivalist

    Blog Posts:
    Excellent post TCinNC and also excellent questions.

    The functions of a good money that it first is valuable demand...and also has the ability to store hold value or if you prefer ...purchasing power over time...

    While anywhere you read in human History ...what you find is that gold, silver and to a lesser extent ..copper has functioned in this capacity as a money holding value ...long term. It becomes in essence ..a common dominator to facilitate trade or barter.

    Historically when a money no longer holds ceases to function as a money or storehouse of value.

    If money no longer works...people resort to barter....a much cruder form of money.

    Problem ....20 chickens gained in barter are much more difficult to keep track of/store than gold and or silver and or copper.

    You see???

    And you are quite correct in that governments tend to shave the coins. This is supposed to be taken care of by our coinage having on the edges those vertical reeds formed into the edge of the coin.
    This did not stop the government from totally counterfeiting the money from gold or silver to copper/nickel counterfeit token coinage.
    The copper/nickel token coinage of today is just another way of shaving the coins. They have replaced all the metal in the coin with lesser value metals and made to look like the older coinage.
    Cash means coin...of a specified weight and fineness....usually outlined in a coinage act or law.

    In case you did not know....the leader of Taiwan ...Chang Kai Shek....created a money based on a rice economy.

    You could take the paper notes or demand the rice. This gave stability to the money...and held the government accountable to it's spending.

    There is nothing saying you have to use gold, silver , or copper. It is just historically that these have been the biggest storehouses of value among the records of men.

    About China.....

    It is my belief that America and whoever really runs America ...rebuilt Germany and Japan after WW2. If we rebuilt them....someone not wanting to be seen or known..runs them..for profit. Oh they take out the olde generals and admirals and put them in charge of the factories because they are really people managers.

    But the real owners are the people with money who rebuilt these factories from the ground up after the war.
    What are the chances that these big moneyed people were running the war all along behind the scenes to buy up these countries for pennies on the dollar to get these factory properties at very favorable rates...and locations???
    Also a very skilled and determined work force of worker bees or ants???

    Germany and Japan were rebuilt between WW1 and WW2 by foreign money powers. They have also been rebuilt after WW2 at taxpayers expense. We built our competitors...and also protect these investments for the hidden owners...many of whom are not even Americans.

    How did Japan go from a brown water Navy to a blue water navy with aircraft carriers and submarines when at that time only a handful of nations could even afford that many submarines and aircraft carriers or even had the ability to build them. These ships are extremely expensive even back then to operate and build.
    They learned this to build these ships from someone!! Did we build our own enemy??? On purpose???
    It has to look like a real war...right???

    Was South Korea built by those soldiers running up and down Pork Chop Hill or by very moneyed investors buying up the country after the Korean War and at depression prices??

    So who built China....??? Who invested in China after the famous Nixon Ping Pong Diplomacy???

    Are we still building our next enemy????

    These wars look to me more like an urban renewal project for someone.

    Why were US Navy warships pulling into ports run by the North Vietnamese and taking on supplies to go back out to sea....and do missions after the Vietnam war was officially ended and we pulled out of Vietnam.

    I got this story from several Navy people who had gotten out of the Navy and worked in this shipyard.

    We build nuclear submarines and Nuclear Aircraft carriers at this shipyard...that is how I know what these vessels well as what is in them. That is also now I know Japan did not build aircraft carriers without outside help. Submarines too.
    Airplanes too.
    All the Nimitz class carriers have been born here.

    Who gave China all this technology they have today...since the famous Nixon ping pong diplomacy???

    This world and economics are not quite what we have been misled to believe they are .
    What they often are is a hidden arrangement/arrangements not for the ordinary person to fathom or understand.

    Remember this when your children and grandchildren are required to go off and fight the next war.

    Even our wars are often not what they seem....but are a continuation of economics by another means. The propaganda tends to hide this truth from us.

    My non Ishmaelite .02,

    Last edited: Sep 25, 2018
    Lee CT NE likes this.
  14. TCinNC

    TCinNC Well-Known Member

    Blog Posts:
    Re: Watcherchris (Parts I & II)

    Part I: We're on the same page about currency, and the reason behind why it supplanted barter (you can't keep 20 chickens in your wallet). I believe that barter will again eventually win out, and for the exact reasons that you define - lack of trust in fiat currencies. I wasn't aware of Chiang Kai Shek's rice based economy, but as such it was an indicator of his leadership and brilliance to create something based on an asset that is highly recognizable and valued within their society (because they eat it every day).

    This is analogous to the gold based U.S. economy before the termination of the Bretton Woods agreement by Nixon in the early 70s. Tying a currency value to an asset that can't be artificially manipulated is a sound policy. And just like Taiwan, the paper currency of the U.S. could in fact be exchanged for gold on demand (no, not by the 70s, but earlier in our history). But circling back to my point, that system can't be restored so don't count on having value in gold/silver after SHTF.

    I had a spirited discussion many years ago with a young buck who tried "educating" me about Friedrich Hayek and the value of the gold standard. Beautiful economic theory (vs Keynesian ignorance), but the conversation went south when I informed him that even Hayek admitted that post-Bretton Woods, the gold standard could not be restored because the damage was already baked in.

    In short, to create value in a new currency after SHTF, we'll first a return to the barter system which will erase all present day currencies, then (not in my lifetime) a government will suggest a new currency and tie it to a real asset. After a few centuries, politicians will destroy that value by uncoupling the currency from the asset in order to meet their agendas of giving away things to be re-elected, and a future Watcherchris and TC will be discussing how it all went wrong!!

    Part II: You lay out the intricacies of Germany's and Japan's post-war restorations, to which I'm unable to contribute anything of substance. However, your general assumption that war looks to be a control mechanism for those with heavily vested interests and hidden agendas is a point not lost on me. While I try hard to believe that the U.S. has fought it's wars from a moral ground, this is most probably true only from the troops, who I greatly respect. But the puppet-masters clearly have other designs, and I think this becomes more evident every day as the chasm between the rich and the rest of us widens. Unfortunately for all, the destructive power now held globally (a crap-hole like N. Korea has nukes!) has likely outstripped the puppet-master's control of the situation. It was a good ride for them while it lasted, but a tech billionaire (the new age robber baron) isn't likely to be the last man standing after SHTF.
    Lee CT NE likes this.
  15. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer

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    Gold is too expensive to be useful. Who wants a BB of gold in a trade for a hog or a dozen chickens? Silver is about right I just wish they would make fractional coins in silver as they do gold. Right now I buy what they call junk silver coins. They are 90% silver American coins that are worn to the point of only being valued as silver weight.

    Beware of silver coins that are too cheap. China makes copy coins that are so good that you have to know what you are looking at to spot the difference. I have some of them in my type sets for the coins that I just can't afford in the quality that I want. They are not in any way marked as fake.

    I also like the regular dollar coins. They are only worth a dollar but I suspect that they will have more worth than paper money later on.

    As long as you know what you are seeing and what it is truly worth gold and silver jewelry is a pretty good investment. Lets face it gold and silver in today's world only have value because we imagine that it does. Stainless steel is just as shiny as silver and lasts longer. If I'm trading for food I will want something that has more REAL use and value than gold, silver or gems. For a hungry man a small box of hooks and line is worth a lot more than a piece of silver or gold. If your kids are starving how much is a canned ham worth in precious metals.

    For my uses the money is for the immediate use if things go down. The precious metals and gems will last a little longer. After that people are going to get REAL. Food and things that will help provide food will just get more and more valuable. True luxuries like booze, tobacco, and things along that line will hold value. Medicines will be worth their weight in gold after about a year or so. Warm clothes and blankets when it gets cold becomes money in the bank.

    Ammo and guns will be problematic. Do you really want to arm someone that didn't have enough sense to arm themselves before things went bad??? I might deal a little in and among neighbors and such but not much.
    Lee CT NE likes this.
  16. watcherchris

    watcherchris Legendary Survivalist

    Blog Posts:
    Many years ago......I had a paper from the Treasury department showing people how to, back then, accommodate the new Susan B. Anthony dollar coin which was just coming out to the marketplace. How to rearrange your cash register to utilize the new coin.

    In this pamphlet back in the 1980s...the made a point to show why they wanted to come out with this new Susan B. Anthony dollar coin.

    The point they were making...was that the one dollar bill back then cost some 2 cents to produce and put into circulation and lasted on the average some six months..

    The Eisenhower copper nickel coin cost 8 cents to produce and put in circulation...and would last much longer than six months.

    And the Susan B. Anthony dollar coin costs some 3 cents to produce and put in circulation and also would last longer than 6 months.

    Now here is the very interesting thing about this admission from the Treasury Department.

    At 2 cents per one dollar paper note....this represents a 5,000 per cent mark up since we give up 100 cents of our labor to get one.

    But the real key is that they get 100 dollar bills for the same price.....there is no more paper and no more ink in a 100 dollar bill than there is in a 1 dollar bill.
    They are not going to give you a 100 dollar weight of silver or gold for them....but they get them for 2 cents.

    And we give up 100 dollars of our labor to get one of them. This represents a 500,000 per cent mark up on a 100 dollar bill.

    " There is no possible way any government making 500,000 percent profit on a 100 dollar bill could possibly be interested in balancing a budget."

    And I came to understand this way back in the 1980s and this also clued me into the true nature of the two phony political parties.

    I knew with the Clinton administration and the talk of balanced budget that it was all a scam...and so continues today.

    I wonder how much Trump and Company knows about this???

    They don't even talk about balancing a budget any more...and definitely not during the Obama Administration. Someone is hoping that it slides by the Attention span of the Average American.

    But how about those Redskins....Dallas...NASCAR....etc. etc...etc...and don't forget the Kardashians!!!

    Ishmaelites at work.

    My non Ishmaelte .02,

    Lee CT NE likes this.
  17. Lee CT NE

    Lee CT NE Expert Member

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    There are fractional silver bars and rounds available. But first, let’s review some basics regarding the Troy ounce. It is equal to 31.1034768 grams, 31 grams for our calculations, or 480 grains. This is extremely important to remember, because fractional weight silver bars and rounds are sometimes listed by grains, rather than grams.

    Since most fractional weight silver bars come in either 1 gram or 5 grams, that would equal 15.5 grains or 1/31 of a Troy ounce for 1 gram, and 5 grams is equivalent to 77 grains or 5/31 of a Troy ounce. Other common fractional weight silver rounds are 1/10 of a Troy ounce (3.3 grams or 48 grains) and 1/4 of a Troy ounce (7.75 grams or 120 grains)

    Size-wise, a fractional weight silver bar is usually 10x15mm (millimeters), while a fractional weight silver round is about the size of a dime, or 17.9mm in diameter.

    Hope this helps.
  18. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer

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    I would like to see the government do silver just like they do gold and have 1/10 oz, 1/4 oz and 1/2 oz. The thing about the fractional bars is that most people are less likely to accept them as "money" than if it is offered in a more familiar form. My copper coin state that they are each 1/4 oz pure copper.

    There are some silver rounds in fractional sizes that I am thinking about buying. They make them in walking liberty in all three fractional sizes and even a Mercury 1/10 oz that looks like the old dime. They are running about 4 dollars an oz above spot but that is about standard for coinage. The smaller rounds cost a little more. I probably will only buy 1/4 oz and 1/2 oz though the 1/10 oz are really pretty.
  19. watcherchris

    watcherchris Legendary Survivalist

    Blog Posts:
    Have right now ..and every the coin pocked of my Levi's a 1925 and a 1926 .9 fine silver Peace dollar coins.

    Also in the same pocked is a one troy ounce silver .999 Englehard Prospector coin..

    Non Ishmaelite money. Not interest bearing.



    Not an Ishmaelite.
  20. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer

    Blog Posts:
    I carried a silver dollar that my Dad gave me for about 40 years until it was just a slick bare silver disk. I still have it but replaced it with a silver Eagle in 1999.
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