Gun Design Ideas...

Discussion in 'Guns, Knives, Tools, Etc.' started by TexDanm, Aug 19, 2019.

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  1. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    What sort of guns would you like to see made that are not made now? If you were designing a series of new weapons where would you go? Jeff Cooper for example worked with designers for years trying to perfect a scout rifle. A short, light but full powered and accurate bolt action rifle. What would you think would be a perfect weapon and for what situations would it be perfect for?

    In recent years the gun manufacturers have seemed to be searching and making some VERY interesting variations on a lot of ideas, The assault lever action rifle with a collapsing stock and rails for accessories, the Mossberg magazine fed pump shotguns and some of the high volume semiautomatic shotguns jump to mind.
     
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  2. TMT Tactical

    TMT Tactical The Great Lizard ! Staff Member
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    I would like to see a bottom fed magazine lever action rifle. I know we have side gate and tube but a removable bottom fed mag would be real cool.
     
  3. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    I personally would like to see them make a carbine that was a bit of a cross between an M1 carbine and a more modern AR. The 30 carbine round has been overhauled and some of the new ammo is seriously effective. The fact is that ALL FMJ ammo is very poor for killing and quickly dropping someone compared to modern jacketed hollow point rounds. Then I would like to see a semiauto handgun made that could handle these same rounds and loads. I would accept a lot less firepower as far as magazine capacity for ammo with 357 mag plus stopping power in an auto pistol.

    To me, a carbine and a handgun are for easy everyday carry. The rifle needs to be light and shorter than a full rifle. It isn't nor does it need to be a sniper level rifle. It is for you to have with you, easily carried and quick to fire, for sudden attacks from near attackers.

    A carbine with a nice accessory rail, flash suppressor and a pistol grip would be advantageous and probably better than the 30 cal Carbine for defense purposes in a modern world. To me for survival purposes having a rifle and handgun shooting the same ammo is a real plus. For me, this would be an upgrade for my Winchester Trapper in 357 mag matched to a Ruger Security 6 357 mag revolver.

    Good article about 30 caliber ballistics...

    https://www.ammoland.com/2018/03/30-carbine-ballistic-gel-test/#axzz5x4kMQKlI
     
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  4. randyt

    randyt Master Survivalist
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    kel tec makes the sub 2000 in 9m and 40 cal. Haven't shot one much though.
     
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  5. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    Savage used to make a gun that I thought a lot of.T he savage 24 V was an over and under with a 357 mag on top and a 20 gauge shotgun on the bottom. I would like to see a lighter and more modern updated version of this with a 357 maximum on top over a 20 ga.

    With the 357 max, you have a very good rifle for feer and hogs then by using 357mag, 38 Special and maybe even throw in some 38 short colt loads for an assortment of smaller game. The 20 gauge is a much more powerful and useful gauge than the 410 while also offering lighter ammo than a 12 ga.

    I have hunted for years with a 20 gauge shotgun and with the lone exception of geese it has served as well as a 12 gauge. I never even went the 3" 12 ga for ducks. I killed all the ducks that I wanted with standard loads. Where I lived we had LOTS of ducks and geese and didn't have to shoot at the high fliers. I even shot a lot of wood ducks with 2 3/4" and 3" 20 gauge shotgun shells.

    I can envision something like this being a good compromise for someone in a one gun situation that planned to hunt for their supper while on the move in a forest area.
     
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  6. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    Back onto the carbine idea; what do y'all think about the bullpup design for this sort of thing?
     
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  7. Dalewick

    Dalewick Master Survivalist
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    AR MK18 with GHB.jpg For years I wanted a rifle that I could have with me anywhere, (in a vehicle, walking in town, in a city)and that would meet a set of "prepper" criteria that I had. The weapon had to be;
    1. Small enough that it was easily concealable
    2. Easy to operate, even for my wife & girls
    3. Easy to maintain (keep it clean and functioning even by the wife or kids)
    4. Easy to acquire ammo (popular caliber, preferably military to ease ammo location in a TEOTWAWKI scenario)
    5. Not a NFA weapon to eliminate big brother oversight.
    6. Magazine feed
    7. Semiautomatic
    8. Accurate to at least 300 yards
    9. Backup sights
    10. Fast to the fight (easy to acquire from it's carrier and make operational in under 2 minutes)

    For years I built or bought many different weapons trying to come up with one that would meet all of these requirements. Legal Carbine AR15's or M4's were too long and cumbersome in there carrier, AK's wouldn't work for the same reasons and weren't accurate enough, not to mention ammo and NFA short barreled rifles SBR's), were a major headache with travel. The advancement of pistol braces made for a break through. I took a hard look at what special operations forces were using (particularly the MK18)and saw a SBR that fit all of my criteria but I added the brace and had a beautiful civilian legal pistol that fit all of my rifle criteria.

    My weapon has a 10.5 inch barrel with a 1 to 7 twist barrel which allows me to use any of the current military grade ammo, especially the heavier rounds (it loves 77gr. HPBT rounds) and I have it suppressed so if I have to use it in a building it won't deafen me and outside it gives a false weapons signature (where your shooting from). It hit's a human torso target 100% of the time at 300 yards and takes game (whitetail deer, ground hogs and coyotes) at similar ranges. I finally have my "Grayman weapon" and it goes everywhere I go in my Karrimor SF Predator 30 bag with at least 4 30 round mags, my med kit, SERE gear and my water bladder and other GHB gear. I'm happy with it.

    Planning on adding a LAW Tactical folding stock adapter to make it even shorter in storage mode.

    Pictured with my AAC 762 SD suppressor. Works great.

    Dale
     
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  8. Snyper

    Snyper Master Survivalist
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  9. TMT Tactical

    TMT Tactical The Great Lizard ! Staff Member
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    Snyper, thanks for the link. I will have to check into these rifles.
     
  10. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    I wonder if they make a 20 round magazine for that BLR? I would love to have a BLR to go with my Winchester, Marlin, Savage and Henry lever-action rifles. I have always loved the look and feel of a lever-action.
     
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  11. Snyper

    Snyper Master Survivalist
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    Ruger also makes a lever action that use detachable magazines.

     
  12. Old Geezer

    Old Geezer Legendary Survivalist
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    I was going to include info on the Browning BLR, but others beat me to it.

    I love Enfields:
    The bolt action is called the British Lee-Enfield (SMLE) and the .303 Brit is a great round. Now Ruger makes a carbine with a 10 rnd mag. Once upon a time decades ago, some truly great military ammo made in Greece for the Gurkha troop in Hong Kong "fell off a truck" and landed in America -- had annealed necks, lacquered primers, and was non-corrosive. I still have some of that ammo.

    Histroy's closest lever action was the Winchester 1895. However, the magazine was not detachable.

    https://winchestercollector.org/models/model-1895/

    Look at these prices:
    https://www.collectorsfirearms.com/winchester-model-1895/
     
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2019
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  13. Old Geezer

    Old Geezer Legendary Survivalist
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    I want a .357 mag. pump carbine. One was designed and built by Israel. I'm now looking for the name ...

    "Timber Wolf", now I remember. Man, I'd love to have one of those. The ones out there offered for sale have prices on them that are up in the stratosphere. I've a .357 lever from Winchester; has a 16.5 inch barrel.



    I've heard they had some problems. Now that they are out of production, you'd have to manufacture your own parts. Online parts ... maybe ... bad odds.

    These "cowboy" pump rifles out of Italy that cost so much, I've heard that they also have failure to feed issues. Could be ammo type (????), which is to say total cartridge length. Pump .44 or .45 Colt nice if in short barrel -- most offerings have rather long barrels.
     
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  14. Old Geezer

    Old Geezer Legendary Survivalist
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  15. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    They made this gun from 1996 through 2007. It just never seemed to catch on. I think that its hammerless look just didn't look "cowboy" enough and was just a bit of an odd duck. Winchester tried a similar look in the 60s and it didn't do well either. Nonetheless, I hoped every year that they would add a 96/357 to the group but alas they never did. The 96/44 only had a 4 round mag. They also made a 44mag semi-auto carbine that was a great hog gun. I always wanted them to make that in 357 mag too. I think Ruger missed out by not going there. A lot more people shoot a 357 mag than a 44 mag and would have liked a rifle companion piece.
     
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  16. Snyper

    Snyper Master Survivalist
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    None of the Ruger lever actions ever really sold well.
    Marlin, Winchester and Henry dominate that market.
    The demand just isn't there.
     
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  17. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    built-in I also own a 250 Winchester 22lr that looks a lot like the Ruger in general shape but is tube fed rather than the magazine. I loved it as a kid, Christmas for my 14th birthday, but it didn't go over real well either.
    5212a53035ae468d41a198b5c26b9946.jpeg

    Of the currently made lever actions in 22lr and pistol calibers, I'm not sure that the new guy on the street, Heney, isn't the best of the lot. their interpretation of the 94 lever action has design features that I like a lot.

    To me, the finest lever-action made was the Savage 99. It was strong, magazine-fed so you used pointed bullets and the 300 savage was ballistically similar to the 308 making it superior for long-distance shooting over the 30-30.

    [​IMG]

    I think that the Winchester and the Ruger both owe a lot in their design to the Savage 99. Mine is a 99F with a built-in rotary magazine and a counter window to tell you how many rounds are loaded in it. I am the third generation to own and hunt with it.
     
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