Is body armor part of your preparedness equipment?

The title sort of says it: is body armor part of your preparations? If so, what type and NIJ level? If not, why not?

Thanks for sharing and voting.

 

No, not at the moment. I'm not completely against the idea though and this might get included at some point in the future.

Why not? Well for one, it's expensive. Secondly, a scenario where I would benefit from it is very very unlikely where I live. So I believe my money is better spent in other things right now.

 

It is not part of our equipment at this time, but it is on the list. I hope we are able to get some for everyone in the family before they ban owning body armor by civilians.

 

Do you mean kevlar vests? Not at all. Preppers generally prefer camo clothing instead of being able to withstand more damage.

 

Nope! I wish I had something to use for a SHTF event, but I don't think I can actually afford body armor at the moment. I do think it'd be a boon. Can't really use camo in the city though. Unless I want hide in the park.
Heck, I'd even take a fire resistant Nomex suit for all this heat.

 

If S really HTF, I don't think I would allow my money to restrict my own personal protection. SAPI (Small Arms Protection Inserts) are definitely what you want to look for, especially the high-level-tier ceramics. ESAPI is a new insert that I believe was issued in 2006, and unlike kevlar which is usually revered falsely, it can stop up to 7.62 rounds. The downside is there is less coverage, but I would rather deal with a non-fatal shot than a shot to the core, liver, torso, or what have you. They also break upon being shot, which makes sense, but I would rather have it break once and be able to survive and get on my feet (albeit with broken ribs) than to die with a false sense of security.

 

I feel the same, it is just an expensive piece of equipment. Now although I can afford it, I know that it will also take it's tole while I'm wearing it because I don't want to lurk around in body armor all the time.

Sure it will protect me, but I figure that if I can kill the person before they shoot me, then body armor is a waste.

 

As a soldier following orders armour is worth it!
As a survivalist armour is not worth it!

Soldiers seek out the enemy and destroy them!
Survivalists avoid the enemy and slink away!

 

In my bug out bag, no. But that is something hould go into the bunker. If the guns is In there, body armor should also.

 

A while back I invested in body armour and wore it around to see what it was like!
The soft Kevlar vest was hot but bearable in the winter but spring summer and fall it was just way to hot!
Sitting in a car or just standing around the Kevlar was ok but again any movement or exertion made things bad!

Hard plate armour was about the same but worse, limited mobility, excessive heating were the problems again!

Ditched them way back as not worth it in reality, in reality the only armour worth having as a survivalist is maybe a Kevlar
helmet! although the old steelpot from WWII era is much more useful to a survivalist!

 

If you can afford body armor, then yes, I think it's a great idea. As a LEO, I wore a level 3A vest every day on the job. It was not fun when the temps went over 100 degrees, and is not made for comfort, but knowing it could save my life and having seen one save the lives of fellow Officers made it a no brainer.
If or when society collapses, having a vest could make the difference between life and death. With no medical care, a gunshot will be a death sentence to many.
Even if you do all you can to be a Gray Man, it is no guarantee that someone is watching and waiting for the time to shoot you to take what you have.
When buying soft armor, a Level 3A vest costs little more than a Level 2A, gut the 3A. Soft body armor will only protect you from handgun rounds, not rifle fire.
A hard vest is still not all that expensive and many will stop even .308 rounds from as close as 10 meters. They are heavy, and uncomfortable.
If the balloon goes up, I for one will actively protect myself and my own. I won't go looking for trouble, but you will not be able to hide forever. At some point, you will need to go outside, even if it's just in your yard. A vest could make the difference.
As soon as there is no food, water and other things that people need, even that nice guy down the street may be a threat and you can be sure that there will be many out looking to take anything you have.

 

Checked it out a while back but it was so hard to find since I was in Canada and extremely pricy even for simple civilian body armor. Not to mention the websites I found it on did not look very reputable and you never know if it's a cheap knockoff that won't offer any protection at all until it's tested and you find out that you've wasted a fortune on an imitation.

 

I am a headshot sort of hunter so are many others, I see little value in just torso protection !
Without ambulances and working hospitals to go to whats the point in protecting just a small percentage of your body?
A hit on any part of your body could prove fatal without medical facilities, I will choose mobility over torso protection anyday!

 

I've worn body armour whilst on active duty. It's heavy, hot, reduces your mobility and increases your fatigue level. Every month whilst deployed we had to pass a tactical shooting course whilst wearing full armour ( kevlar helmet and front and back hard plates), which included run 100m, shoot and repeat, repeat, repeat. It wasn't a lot of fun, especially in the hot conditions.

Mr Arkane, body armour is a prohibited weapon in Australia. Are you stretching the truth or breaking the law?

 

Mr Arkane, body armour is a prohibited weapon in Australia. Are you stretching the truth or breaking the law?

Yes it is now and has been for a while ! In most probability My transgressions would have been way before you were even born
when rules were much looser than now!
So I was not stretching the truth or really breaking the law just remembering a time gone by!

I gave armour up as a bad joke mostly due to multiple sweat pimples front and back and the bloody weight!

Back in the day I also had a nifty mini14 with 30rd mags until jackboot johnny made me hand it in! again a time gone by!

The world did not start when you were born, much happened before then and much will happen after you are dead and gone!

There is lots a stuff a can make that is not legal to have now so I do not make them but I could any time I choose but seeing I am getting short
on years I choose not to and just want peace and quiet if I can!

 

Now that i have read this forum.. i will definitely add that to my list.

 

Body armor is an expensive luxury when it comes to prepping, but like everyone says, Kevlar is just an impractical purchase. I think the best alternative is well developed camo or a ghillie suit. How can they shoot ya if they can't see ya?

 

plus one on head shots, our Armed forces are fast losing mobility and that is a huge problem imho, I hated wearing the MTV in Iraq and Afghanistan. Speed mobility ,carry more water and ammo in lieu of Body armor. S/FI

 

Homemade body armor can be made with woven roving sheets of fiberglass held together with structural resin:
http://mindtomachine.blogspot.com/2012/09/homemade-bulletproof-armor-v10.html

https://www.therpf.com/showthread.php?t=97154

https://www.google.com/patents/US3832265

Think shield. Make a shield that will stop the sort of ammo you will be facing, yet is lite enough to carry with your non-shooting arm. SWAT teams carry these. Here's a link for homemade body armor, maybe this idea could be used when making a shield:
http://www.instructables.com/id/Homemade-Body-Armor/

You can pick up a used flack jacket and helmet at an Army surplus store. These will stop shotgun shot and possibly some rounds that have passed through the wall of your house. You can also rig some plates, but then there exists the weight factor.

A police officer or soldier who is hit is going down, armor or not. The concussive force is horrific. Once down, that individual is a sitting duck.

 

Agreed would definitely help in a defensive scenario defending homestead /bunker etc. but not on the move bugging out on foot absolutely not,bugging out by vehicle maybe. jmho

 

Why wouldn't be? I am damned sure not going to help some chud kill me. I have 4 complete sets of armor and chest plate carriers. I went through a lot of dope house doors serving high risk warrants over 30 years. Armor stopped more than a few nasty high speed bits of metal and lead that would have made my day unpleasant. Forgetting a direct hit...you are ALWAYS getting splashed by flying shrapnel. Screw that.

Armor up.
View attachment 1753

 

No, I do not include body armour in my kit. Balanced against stealth and mobility the protection that they offer isn't really worth it to me. It's a personal choice.
Cost is also an issue when you consider that the Kevlar and polycarbonate elements of body armour have a five year useful lifespan as theyre degraded by stickers, paint, impact damage or ultraviolet. Most of the stuff available online is pre issued military surplus, already outdated, scuffed and degraded...only suitable for deluded wannabe paramilitary types.

 

As a cop who's armor has saved my life...I will give your opinion all the credence it deserves...ignore it...and continue to place great value on my body armor.

The relative value of my ass is worth the cost of upgrading my body armor and plate carriers as needed. Body armor is not restrictive, especially if you have worn it for decades. You know what works with your body type, you know how to adjust it. You learn to move with it, and up, over, around, under, and through obstacles. It also has the added value of being a great place for extra magazines for your rifle and pistol along with all other gear that you may need.

I would no more go where there might be a fight without my body armor as I would walk into a room full of gun powder with a lit match.

 

Ken, the point I was making is that I choose not to use the second hand body armour available to civilians that is degraded to the point of worthlessness, yours obviously came to you through the job so you know it's history, it will have replacement date labels inside for when you're due to renew it therefore you feel that you can rely on it to protect your torso. I suspect that even if you bought your own it would have been tax deductible as a legitimate work expense, not so for the rest of us.
I stand by my former statement that second hand body armour, especially military surplus is a waste of money, if it wasn't out of date/degraded they wouldn't be selling it. Its only fit for paint balling wannabes to dress up in (minus the ballistic plates because the weight of those plates really does slow you down.) I live in the hills and I absolutely guarantee you that you could not keep up with me while wearing full armour with all the plates inserted along with any othe kit that you'd need to carry.
Lonewolf makes the point that the UK isn't exactly awash with firearms and we are unlikely to be intentionally getting into a firefight, you've got to admit that's a fair point Ken.
Arkane makes the point that it won't protect against a head shot, I'll go further then that and point out that your armour won't protect the major arteries in your throat, groin or upper thighs either.....
.....still, if it makes you happy it's your personal choice to wear it just as it is my choice not to, like I said in my earlier post.

 

There are alternatives to Kevlar.

 

If I am going into battle or have a job with almost guaranteed violence then I will wear armor. I can't imagine trying to live in it though. Working the garden in East Texas in the summer in body armor is asking for a heat stroke. Just walking around in it in the heat is a miserable experience. I live in a prison town and a lot of people have to wear armor in the segregation halls or if you are on a use of force team and one and all they hate it and shed it the split second that they can. When there is no air conditioning most people will take off the flak jackets. You could make a fortune if you came up with armor that wasn't hot, heavy and restrictive and still would stop a rifle round. It is getting better but it isn't there yet.

PS added later...

Cheap body armor is almost useless and the truey good stuff is out of reach for most people that I know. If you are bugging in and not planning to go out looking for trouble it is an expense most will pass on. I have tires packed with sand that I will be behind and that will be my body armor.

 

I watch the Metatron's channel, and he talks about mail (also known as chainmail). He also has a suit of Samurai armor. He's talked about the fact that he wears some sort of mail constantly, due to the possibility of knife attacks. He wears mail under his shirt.

So, while that might not stop a bullet, it's better than nothing. He also says there are certain kinds of mail that you don't want to get if you want it to be functional. I can't remember which one he said not to get.

But, yeah, eventually I want to get some armor. It's nice for reenacting to, when I have the health to do it.

 

I'm in almost total agreement with you about the absolute need for armour in certain situations and I wasn't trying to belittle Kens choice to wear armour. If you're going into some sort of close combat situation it makes good sense to wear good quality, up to date body armour...... but for me and my situation it simply isn't appropriate.

 

In a LEO or UW setting I am all for body armour but seeing as I will not be out looking for trouble and will be actively avoiding it I see no point in body armour. In Australia heat stroke will kill you long before the bad guy will with body armour.
That said I do think Kevlar helmets are worth it.

 

Flack jackets and helmets = valuable.

What I give thought to is the protection of my vehicle. There are all manner of run-flat tires available nowadays. I envy welders who can rig plating to help protect engine compartments -- trying to get one of my sons back into welding; have offered to buy him needed equipment.

During SHTF days, wear a flack jacket and sit on one. And metal plating ...... And fiberglass layers with ceramic tile layers ........ That stuff around you and passengers. Goggles and gloves are your friends.

Durring WWII my dad hated the narrow slits provided to drive heavy equipment and tanks; but hey, that's what saves lives. His helmet saved him from a crane's hook.

 

My rule has always been: Never Help The Other Sonofabitch Kill You

"I don't wanna wear body armor...it's heavy...it's hot...I can't move in it...blah blah blah"

Cool. Honestly...I don't give a shit if you point your Hi Point pistol or your "badass tactical SKS widda banana clip" at your own head and press the trigger thereby painting the walls with your brain matter (assuming of course either of those pieces of shit actually work). I am not arguing for you to wear good armor...hell, I may have to be the one to shoot you some day, and I'd appreciate any help you will give me.

"It won't stop a rifle bullet!"....yeah...good armor actually will stop an AK round. MAYBE not 100% of the time, but if you play the percentages and realize that your t-shirt will stop an AK round NONE of the time, then any percentage of advantage will be an improvement on your chances of not helping the other sonofabitch kill you.

A level III Kevlar carrier with a level IV plate....will stop an AK round in the extreme majority of instances. I know this because one of my team mates caught a straight-on AK round in his plate carrier. It knocked the wind out of him, bruised the hell out of his chest...but he never leaked. The chud wannabe who shot him didn't fare so well as he got chunks of shit blown off of him and the walls were decorated in red and pink and purple frothy nasty shit. I call that a WIN.

A NIJ Level III rated kevlar vest WILL stop ALL handgun rounds, and even those fired from SBRs and PCCs. So...well...there's that. If you add that the probability is that if you are shot it will most likely be by someone using a handgun, then you can see that maybe....juuuuuust maybe....that heavy armor that you think won't stop a rifle bullet is starting to make a little more sense in a survival situation, especially a survival situation where you have no backup on the way, no EMS medical services, and no other choice but to lie down and bleed out once your meat sack is leaking.

Yes, you may live in an area where the natives are armed with surplus AKs and SKSs rifles, or some other surplus rifles sent when the USSR was still a thing and they were "exporting insurrection" across the Turd World. Sorry. Wait...that means you REALLY would benefit from good armor.

If you "can't move" in body armor...then there are a couple of reasons. Most likely, you have spent too much time at the buffet sucking down carbs and your fat ass can't move very well in a t-shirt and shorts, let alone a piece of equipment that is actually designed for maximum movement AND protection but does have a weight cost. If that's honestly not the case, then you probably bought some knockoff Chi-com shit that adjusts to fit a monkey, and not a higher primate of European descent. Another likely scenario is that you just haven't spent ANY time actually training in the gear you plan to use to save your life (refer back to NOT helping the other sonofabitch kill you).

But let's look at other advantages to good body armor. It is not unlikely at all that improvised explosives might be used against you. I know I will improvise the shit out of some exploding booby traps in the even that the SHTF and there no ROL. Flying shrapnel is a bigger killer in many cases than actual gunshot wounds. Personally...still...not wanting to help some other sonofabitch kill me is going to be high up on my list and if Bubba Gump thinks he's going to take me out with 2700grains of black powder and a can full of nails...I am going to do all I can to screw up his plans.

If you don't want it. Don't buy it. If you don't think it's necessary...then think again...and still, if you don't want it...don't buy it.

 

Only been shot twice, once I shot myself in a freak accident when I was 16yo and the other time I was out looking for trouble in the 80's with 80's body armour, flesh wound on the arm.
Neither time was the body armour any help, by staying out of troublesome situations I have avoided being shot again
Looking at my probabilities I am far more likely to be in a vehicular or similar incident than a gunfight so safety boots and skid lid are far more important to me.
I wore soft Kevlar vests for years gave that up long ago.
I use tactics to avoid trouble

 

Body Armor. Yes I prefer it. There are a number of combinations available these days and can be utilized easily. Since Iraq, Afghanistan there have been quite a few changes in Body Armor and plate carriers.

I used to work in the surplus business. I saw a lot of different combinations of armor that is being utilized by military. I have also seen the steel plates being sold at gun shows today under the brand AR500.

I have worn the IBA with the Level III soft armor and worn it with Esapi plates added which bring it to levelIV. I also have worn the IOTV with the LevelIII soft armor and worn it with all 4 plates added to it as well as the DAPPS and Groin protection. Also Level IV.

I asked an experienced vet how he could run with that rig on because it was so damned heavy and at my age I didn't think I could. His answer: " Believe me, when they start shooting at you, you can run just fine".

I've worn special Ops black armor that was given to me by a guy who just got out and when I checked it out closely all it was was a small black vest with a groin pad slid into it. I know how to pull the escape cord from a set of IOTV which lets the whole rig fall off of you and put it back together in a few minutes. I have worn both the PASGT Helmet and the newest MICH Helmet.

There also is a slimmed down version of soft armor combo with front and back plates that I have seen and worn that came about due to soldiers feeling too encumbered in the mountains of Afghanistan wearing the complete IOTV.
I will post a few videos I have watched on different plates and vests for anyone who is interested to watch below.
Personally I prefer the lighter level III vest used by mountain troops with front and back ESAPI plates and a MICH helmet. At my age I can carry that load and still move around. I do have a black level III police vest to wear under clothing if I need to move around without tipping someone off as to me wearing armor.

Armor is not as expensive as you think and can be attained in many states in the US if you look for it. Considering that so many people will drop $600 for a rifle why not the same for some armor? I'm sure a lot of you have numerous $600 rifles or handguns in your collections.

I will not wear AR500 plates after watching videos of spal that comes off of steel plates. I prefer ceramic.
AR500 Test

USGI ESAPI test

 

The USGI IOTV Level III Vest



ESAPI. You get a bruise but no holes!

 

It's on the list but never makes it into the shopping cart. Cost is part of it, it falls into the "stuff I'd like to have but will probably never need" category of supplies, and that category is always a hard sell to the wife, especially since I'd want a set for each of us.

Last time I looked into it I considered getting a soft level IIIA vest for her (in mens medium, big for her but I can squeeze into it) and plates/plate carrier for me. Would give us both some ballistic protection if needed, or level IV if used together for one of us.

 

Gatecrasher: I am in the same boat. My wife goes along with 99% of the gear; all of which we can use camping; and she can see the practical side. Body armor? Seriously? Not even something I would bring up.

 

So in your case I would suggest a small plate carrier with front and back level 4 ceramic plates with maybe two smaller level 3 pads behind it to soften impact. Something like this should be less cumbersome and protect vital areas.

 

So people aren't going to shoot in the country?

 

I guess in my case I am lucky that my family is 100% on board. In fact it was my gal who woke me up to the need to prepare. It wasn't long into preparedness that she mentioned the need for armor for the kid to protect her if hostilities began. We were living in suburbia at the time.

 

So strange because I think in the USA the numbers that survive will be in the countryside and anyone that survives in the cities or suburbia will be moving towards the countryside shortly after SHTF. That is where they will expect to find food and water. Also are all of your neighbors in the country stocked up on food, have a means to purify water and have needed supplies? Some of them may be moving around after SHTF looking to supply their needs wouldnt they?