My Ghb's Ifak...too Much Or Just Right?

Discussion in 'First Aid Kit' started by Dalewick, Oct 26, 2019.

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  1. Dalewick

    Dalewick Master Survivalist
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    On another thread I listed the contents of my GHB and attached pouches. All of them but my IFAK. I'm wondering if it's more than I should but I like being prepared.
    My IFAK's contents are:

    1. Various band aids
    2. Antiseptic & antibiotic ointment
    3. Alcohol
    4. surgical scissors
    5. clamps
    6. sutures
    7. Butterfly sutures
    8. Gauze
    9. surgical tape
    10. vet rap
    11. EMT shears
    12. Celox granular
    13. QuilClot powder & gauze
    14. Scalpel
    15. Israeli bandages 4"
    16. Provodine
    17. 100 mph tape
    18. Salt pills
    19. Meds
    20. Morphine
    21. Gloves

    Before you ask or complaine, yes I have had advanced medical training and even done some minor field surgery when our medic wasn't able. It all fits in it's pouch (tear away IFAK pouch).

    Thoughts?

    Dale
     
  2. Dalewick

    Dalewick Master Survivalist
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  3. Old Geezer

    Old Geezer Legendary Survivalist
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    29ff13ca3bc87f886a9b5aaa17c35baf.jpeg If the following application photos are wrong, somebody do please correct me.

    29ff13ca3bc87f886a9b5aaa17c35baf.jpeg
     
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  4. Old Geezer

    Old Geezer Legendary Survivalist
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    Kerlix gauze comes in all manner of widths and lengths.

    29ff13ca3bc87f886a9b5aaa17c35baf.jpeg

    The following is NOT an ACE bandage; this wrap is self-adhearing -- I mean it ROYALLY sticks to itself.

    29ff13ca3bc87f886a9b5aaa17c35baf.jpeg

    Get clean 4"x 4"s on wound, wrap with cotton gauze, then elastic self-adhering wrap to hold.
     
    1. Dalewick
      VetRap is the same stuff but cheaper and in more colors. You can have it bright or almost camo.
       

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  5. Old Geezer

    Old Geezer Legendary Survivalist
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    https://www.amazon.com/Catheter-Nee...chest+decompression+kit&qid=1572137188&sr=8-3

    Look into the topic of needle decompression of pneumothorax. Person has an open chest wound. On each breath, air is sucked into the chest through the opened chest wall. On exhalation, the air does NOT get pushed back out, so that side of the chest fills with more and more air. This air will push the heart and its blood vessels (sack is pericardium) to the opposite side. As pericardium twists, the blood vessels get pinched shut. Also, the heart is unable to fill up with blood to squirt the blood out = it can't pump. The person can die in short-order.

    Note that as this is happening, you'll lose lung sounds on that side of the chest. Note that as the pericardium shifts, the trachea often does so also. Look at the neck and you might see the trachea (windpipe & voice box, larynx) start shifting to one side (right or left depending on which side of chest is inflating).

    What to do?! Release the air. How? Stick a large bore catheter through the chest wall. I'm not going to give instructions on this. If interested, read up on this topic. One targets the gap between specific ribs. Read up.

    When you dart the chest, you may be able to hear the air rush out. Blood may also shoot out -- good! Why. Chest filling up with blood is also a very bad thing. This person is in dire straights and must be evacuated to hospital, right now!

    After darting the chest, pull out the needle (VERY IMPORTANT to pull out the needle!), and leave the catheter (outer tube, feels like plastic, it is white in color) inside the chest. The catheter will continue to leak air, therefore it MUST stay in. Don't worry about cleanliness -- let the doctors worry about that later. Without this cath, the patient is dead, D.E.A.D., dead!!!

    29ff13ca3bc87f886a9b5aaa17c35baf.jpeg
     
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    1. Dalewick
      Usually, before they will sell you the needles for Pneumothorax decompression you have to show proof that you have been trained to properly do so. Some places don't ask for it. I would recommend at least getting some training. I have done this and OG gives a good description. Someone drowning in their own lungs sounds horrible and their relieve is almost immediate.
       
      Dalewick, Oct 26, 2019
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  6. Old Geezer

    Old Geezer Legendary Survivalist
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    Dalewick just said something that woke me up a bit.

    If you can make friends with veterinarians, do so. People, animal doctors know their game and are saving animals on a perpetual basis! We too are critters. A practicing large animal vet is far more likely to save a human life in an emergency than 90% of physicians. Over the decades, I have known people effectively treated by veterinarians who could get no help from regular doctors (for humans).

    Legalities, OK, so let's just put that to the side. I've got stories about foreign physicians who'd "seen it all" in their own country, then came to America. One of these doc.s REALLY helped a family member of mine. I'm eternally grateful to him.

    Knew one guy who got back from a combat area where the "United States had no presence." There, where we weren't (go figure), think tropics, this soldier got a skin lesion from hell. No dermatologist state-side could help him one iota. He was always at the large animal vet.'s office anyway; big farm fellow. Showed lesion to that animal-doc. Animal doc treated him and lesion was cured in just a few weeks.
     
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    1. Dalewick
      If you can save a goat, you can save a human.
       
      Dalewick, Oct 26, 2019
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  7. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    i'd rather save a goat.
     
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    1. Dalewick
      LMAO!!!
       
      Dalewick, Oct 27, 2019
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  8. GateCrasher

    GateCrasher Expert Member
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    Our truck GHB FAKs and another I take when fishing/boating/hiking. The truck kits (with just a couple minor exceptions) have identical contents and packed nearly identically in terms of what is where. I got frustrated with having different kits with different (or missing) gear between the vehicles a few years back, whenever I needed something it always seemed to be in the other kit in the other truck.

    These are more geared towards the common boo-boos, with extra consideration for kids/dogs who are my usual patients, and major bleeding in the event of automobile, firearm, or chainsaw accidents. The house kit has more for airway management, fluid resuscitation, and splinting.

    991859fee2c7b866b29ed70834d5bf0c.jpeg

    991859fee2c7b866b29ed70834d5bf0c.jpeg

    Most items should be self-explanatory, a couple maybe less common items I stock:

    -Hydrogen peroxide (3%) and activated charcoal, the H2O2 as an emergency emetic for some poisonings where it's desirable to have them vomit, and the activated charcoal when it's not.
    -Splinter kit in altoids tin. Tweezers, Splinter-Outs, mini-bic lighter, safety pins, razor blades. After band-aids and the liquid skin below, this item gets the most use which is why I put all the splinter items together in the tin.
    -Nasal saline, emergency eye wash.
    -Corn cushions and moleskin, might be a long walk.
    -Liquid Skin. Great for minor wounds on kids (blocks dirt better than band-aid alone) and pets (where their fur doesn't allow tape to stick). I keep two bottles, one for the dogs and one for people.
    -Head lamp/torch, light during exam and treatment, and leaves both hands free.
     
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  9. Pragmatist

    Pragmatist Master Survivalist
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    Good morning Dale,

    Ref list: 20. morphine;

    Re: "Thoughts"; Less a thought and more so a question:

    Since morphine allows for more than 1 delivery system, via mouth and via injection, do you have a preference or not ?

    I ask this because my on-person loadout inventory used to to have both Tylenol 3 (~ 6 hours duration) and Tylenol 4 (~ 12 hours duration). Once, I only estimated a need for ~ 6 hours until reaching safety but took the Tylenol 4. These were pills and I had to ration water. Wasn't in a pure wilderness emergency setting but something like Varuna experienced when he was on television.

    Later, back in safety, the medic folks debated whether having the water was better for me than the pain relief.

    Thus, my overall question re analgesics and a heavy water supply.
     
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  10. Dalewick

    Dalewick Master Survivalist
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    My preference for most medicines in a survival scenario is oral liquid "suspension". My reasoning is that not everyone is trained or even willing to give an injection and they may have no idea how much to give. If it's me giving it, it's all good but I take into consideration I may not be conscious or even alive. Oral liquids can be swallowed by people barely awake or when needed can be given through the nasal cavity (up your nose) with a syringe.

    My oldest daughter has severe allergies to white potatoes, cashews and canola oil and carries a epi pen at all times. She also carries liquid Benadryl since we discovered that when her throat starts to swell she can still swallow the liquid, even when she can't swallow pills. This has saved her from having to use the epi pen on a couple occasions.

    Oral morphine (Pills) can also be crushed fine and mixed in liquid and given as above for fast relief of pain, but I would recommend medical training as morphine does slow the respiratory and circulatory systems enough to be life threatening. Especially if the patient has a low pulse to start with or much blood loss.

    The up the nose method is also a good way to dose children that refuse needed oral dose of medicines. It's not very nice to do but it gives them the meds.

    RE: the water issue. I consider that if I am taking or giving emergency meds, especially meds for severe pain, there is a life threatening issue that is being dealt with and water is probably needed to control shock and replace lost body fluids.

    Hope this made sense.

    Dale
     
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  11. Pragmatist

    Pragmatist Master Survivalist
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    Good afternoon Dale,

    Appreciate detailed reply.

    Yes, all made sense.
     
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  12. Old Geezer

    Old Geezer Legendary Survivalist
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    Some medical supplies are controlled, so you'd have to steal them.

    Controlled items require training to use, thus they are regulated. Can't read in a book. Must read then get person with practice to train you. Thus, such things / practices are for dire emergencies only.

    People with medical supplies and experience will be in demand post-SHTF. Something to think about when sending your kids to university or trade school. Tell young people to get skilled trade background, then pursue their hobbies and further education. If one's hobby is also a skilled trade of survival value, well that's wonderful.
     
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    1. Dalewick
      Oldest daughter is a aerospace engineer (Yes, a rocket scientist) and the youngest daughter is a biomedical engineer. Got that covered. They both grew up learning what skills I could teach them. The youngest is the better shot. LOL!
       

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  13. GateCrasher

    GateCrasher Expert Member
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    Haven't heard of naso- administration for liquid oral meds, but no argument that there are better/faster routes of administration for drugs when the usually fastest route (IV) isn't possible. In emergency room lingo, "get it onboard stat" means getting the drug in the bloodstream as quickly as possible so it starts producing the desired effect. A pill and a glass of water isn't very fast for getting drugs into the bloodstream, and isn't always an option anyway.

    For SHTF use without IV drugs, sublingual (under the tongue) or rectal are other routes of drug administration. Both are often faster than oral administration where the drug is swallowed and absorbed through the GI tract. I try to get the benedryl/diphenhydramine 'liqui-caps' for this reason, bite the capsules to release the liquid but don't swallow, but let the drug get into the blood stream from the blood vessels under the tongue. Faster than waiting for a swallowed capsule to be digested and absorbed through 'first pass' metabolism in the stomach and intestines. Some solid form pills can be chewed and left in the mouth to be absorbed faster this way too, but be careful about delayed release drugs, or any drug labeled as "do not split or crush" however.

    I read a study on low-dose aspirin for unconscious cardiac arrest victims given by EMTs a few years ago, IIRC the study showed that aspirin tablets administered rectally by EMTs in the field to unconscious patients might be beneficial to their outcome, but the researchers stopped short of recommending it's use partly because of the "indignity" of a EMT performing it, especially in the presence of the victims family. If the SHTF and it's life/death, dignity be damned if it stands a chance of saving someone I'd rather not have die. Benedryl liquid can be given rectally as well, and as Burt Gummer said, "just doing what I can with what I got" might apply.
     
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    1. Dalewick
      I learned of nasal administration from an anesthesiologist after he administered liquid valium to my daughter before surgery. She was undergoing chemotherapy for leukemia and taking some thing orally was very hard for her. She didn't like nasal either. I don't blame her.
       
      Dalewick, Oct 27, 2019
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  14. Blitz

    Blitz Well-Known Member
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    What does "GHB" stand for?

    In Aus getting Morphine is about as likely as being able to be armed with a handgun ... it ain't going to happen. Unless you're in the medical profession, but even then it's so strictly controlled it has to be signed for.

    God I wish I lived in America at times ...
     
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