Question(s) On Diy Hand Sanitizer

https://www.cdc.gov/handhygiene/campaign/provider-infographic-3.html


Good morning all,

Requesting guidance on DIY prep of hand sanitizer.

Above link and nearby related CDC links clouds rather than clarifies to me.

Do I, as a private citizen doing routine required errands, need any concern if eg Walmart or Bass Pro Shop is experiencing a - C. difficitl - outbreak ?

CDC says an alcohol based hand sanitizer is less danaging to your hands than soap and water. Since an alcohol-based hand sanitizer is part soap and part alcohol, is CDC saying that water is harmful to one's hands ? I'm less confused than annoyed that too many Federal civil Serviants are overpaid sinecures. I just want to know how to make hand sanitizer for private citizen use.

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Not directly related but is anyone familiar and conversant with benefits of an atomizer mist sprayer compared to my planned plastic bottle with sturd pump that deposits a glob of glob on my hand ?

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Is 91% alcohol better or just "overkill" to use ?
Is there a good ratio of soap to alcohol ?

Any and all guidance appreciated. Thanks in advance.

 

91% alcohol isn't overkill, but USELESS! Anything higher than 70% ish will evaporate too quick before it get the chance to kill the germs. While below 70% will not be strong enough to kill most of the germ unless there is another mix such as soap in the form of gel.

I personally use 2 kind of hand sanitizer. Gel for desktop, while liquid spray in my pocket (when away)

 

Good morning Varuna,

Do you know the time needed on hands for the alcohol to kill the germs ?

If matter is a function of time, would not the higher-rated COH work better/faster in the same allocated time ?

I'm still wondering about a mist being better than a spray. Any views will help.

 

My best guess (non scientific) would be under a minute. Higher alcohol (over 70% ish) evaporate too fast. Imagine of it as taking high g-force load between sustained vs being slapped. Taking a slapped on the face induce very large g-force but it's only an instance not sustained. Same principle with how alcohol kill germs.

 

Good afternoon Varuna,

Had initially mentioned a prep of hand sanitizer. This would include the soap ingredient.

"Gel" is just the medium of the prep just like tinture means an alcohol base. What is the gel ingredient in your sanitizer ?

Would the COH evaporation rate change based on the type of soap in the gel ?

I want to make something that's most effective. Cost between 70% alcohol and 91% alcohol is nominal here. It's the antibacterial soaps that are overpriced and hard to identify. A product here - it's RX - requiring a prescription - is Psisoderm (spelling?) and would spending the extra time to get a prescription if of value to overall D-I-Y effort.

As an aside, I'm still wondering if the 91% COH kills more germs in same exposure time than a 70% product.

 

Why don't you test it yourselves? Just use any of those simulated germs on your hands and see how each alcohol will fare against them. I don't think there is such thing as hard cap in alcohol effectiveness as hand sanitizer, because each individual human skin are different.

 

Good morning Varuna,

How could I - any individual - work up a test ?

The numerous variables cannot be tested by an individual.

I know prescription RX PhysoHex surgial soap kills more germs than over the counter PhysoDerm soap because of national studies that were non-peer reviewed and accepted.

 

An addendum:

https://www.healthline.com/health/how-to-make-hand-sanitizer#bottom-line


Good morning all,

Above Healthline link to add to info on DIY prep.

Not familiar with the term "a clean space".

From what I glean from the link:

1. the homemade sanitizer must be at least 60% alcohol.....and this alcohol must be (should be?) 99% isopropyl alcohol.

Not clear on alcohol formulary - Walmart, Rite Aide and CVS sells max 91% alcohol on the shelf.

2. aloe vera gel.

This has got to be the goo section of the D-I-Y efforts.

3. An essential oil.

Link lists some. Am wondering if the lemon oil sold in the squeeze container that looks like a lemon qualifies. Wouldn't be surprised if it's 99.5% water and pulverized lemon rind.

..........

I do want to have something that works and is carry-able. I've worked large emergency health care field sites with "hand washing stations". My experiences were that they were all empty of soap and water. Blue paper towels from gas station are part of my loadout.

 

If possible wash your hands with soap under clean running water, soap destroys the fatty outer covering of virus and actually 'cleans' your skin of dirt and grime.

If you use alcohol spray for surfaces spray and let it sit a couple of minutes to do its thing and wipe down with clean wipes.

At home I use a bleach solution on surfaces where I can, its cheap and extremely effective.

Look on hand sanatizer/acohol gel as a quick fix until you can really clean your hands.

Alcohol needs to be over 70 to be on the safe side.

 

Good morning Max,

I'm also a bleach user - but only at home.

The question: What's better, ie what's your view; bleach or alcohol solutions for on the go outside of house applications ?

I'm neutral re bleach and alcohol. I just don't like aloe vera and get annoyed when having to read national web sites mentioning DIY hand sanitizer with essential oil. Is it necessary to have a few drops of lemon or clove ?

 

Bleach works, alcohol works use one or the other or both, there's a place for both, I use both.

https://www.amazon.com/Pears-Natura...+Transparent+Amber+Soap&qid=1602425505&sr=8-4

https://www.amazon.com/Wrights-Coal...&keywords=coal+tar+soap&qid=1602425548&sr=8-2

My favorite soaps.

 

Good morning Max,

With me prefering bleach over alcohol, would you consider it OK to place only bleach in a pump bottle so as to "field wash" one's hands ... or should about a third of the pump bottle be some liquid or gel type of soap ? After a minute, the rinse would be a small bottle of water.

I'm setting this up for field use without access to place to wash hands in sink.

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I think Madam Prag has some Pears glycerine soap here. Like link, it's a bar and not a goo in container.

Glanced at second link re the coal tar soap. The logo/label's line "with coal tar fragrance"......admittedly, I'm "dated". The label line got memories started of the old smudge pots used around road construction and repair. Asphalt fragrance will keep much away from me ! My social life !!

Appreciate info provided.

 

The soaps I use are 'old peoples' soap but I like the smell and when lockdown kicked off you could'nt find it in the shops, everybody wanted 'proper' soap LOL.

I remember reading a book about the Vietnam war years ago now, and it said the VC started washing in palmolive soap to put American tracker dogs off their scent.

 

https://www.myneworleans.com/diy-cd... Tablespoons (1/3,into spray bottle as needed.


Good afternoon all,

Just received above link from a colleague who is an EMT.

My headache riddles are getting solved.

Link leads with EDITOR'S NOTE. This solves my first riddle.

There's no need to add a goo soap. The bleach (instead of alcohol) kills the virus (virus-i [plural ?]). Then rinse with water from plastic bottle. Dry on jeans and blue paper towels. Then apply petrolatum (spell?) for skin conditioner. Friend mentioned we're already carrying a vertical tube of white petrolatum USP so weight load is saved.

Other riddle solved. Essential oil not needed. Plus ylang ylang isn't something I'd find at a CVS, Rite Aide or Walmart.

The comments end my other riddles. Commentator Linda Peterses' question on the ratio had been one of my headaches to figure out.

Much of all this is about poor-quality writing at the national level. Rest assurred it's not only a problem in the med-pharma community.

 

Forget all the government crap. The Founding Fathers warned you about this. Ask a good, reputable doctor or nurse and they'll tell you that washing your hands with soap and water for at least 20-30 seconds or singing happy birthday to yourself twice will erase the evil China flu from your hands. Now they say this works better than hand sanitizer and here's why. One is because when you are lathering up your hands and scrubbing ALL of your fingers including thumbs, you cause the 3 micron in size virus to sluff off your hands. Where's with an alcohol based hand sanitizer you kill the virus, and all bacteria including good bacteria from your hands. But your hands won't be sanitized for at least one minute using a hand sanitizer. Now note hand sanitizer does not kill all viruses. So know that.

You should use hand sanitizer when you don't have access to soap and water.

At any rate, if you want to make your own, I saved an HTML copy of an article to do this myself. I bought ten little bottles for the stuff to do it, but it's been at least five months now and I never had to make it. And today on the store shelves there's plenty of hand sanitizer and alcohol. So far that is, you never know what the future holds.

Here's the HTML file. Just download the zip and extract. Double click on the HTML file and it'll open in your browser. No Internet access required. The accompanying folder is the associated java script, images and what not so don't delete it. https://app.box.com/s/vd0tclstv8uhclp8oan1bxba0us5b5op

 

In a nutshell, don't waste money on expensive hand sanitizer, buy gallons of soap instead! No, it doesn't have to be antibacterial.

 

Good morning F22,

Good info......

My planned / new arrangements re being away from a sink ie field work or at a place where I wouldn't go near the sink is to have a mist spraying nozzle on a plastic bottle in a belt pouch.

Will be using bleach in the plastic mist spray bottle; no goo, no aroma ingredients.

I don't even like that Happy Birthday song. I hum tunes from Jerry Garcia's Grateful Dead group or something from Maryann Faithful.

Independent of above mist spray bottle, after 1 -2 minutes for bleach to work, will dry paws on pants / paper towels and then apply some white petrolatum USP. I routinely carry a tube of this grease for multiple purposes such as chapped lip prevention. I get vertical axis squeeze tube so easy to carry in my kit arrangements combined with my shirt and jacket pockets.

Less emphasis to thumbs and much to under nails via mist.

 

I was in Tesco this morning, moutains of Carex at 99p, 2kg packs of plain or self raising flour reduced to 40p, 1kg packs of pasta 30p. I'd guess sales are down because panic buying has not kicked in this time round because people have cupboards full of sanitizer, pasta and flour.

 

Good afternoon Lonewolf,

Bleach is a corrosive and recognize this.

Yet, both bleach and alcohol are skin irritants.

It's just my preference involving the tradeoff of virus versus disinfected hands.

For me, alcohol is just too aramatic.

Had been advised if for 1 -2 minutes, then washed off and lanolin type product applied, the bleach is OK. It won't be a frequent daily application nor for long calender events.

 

LMAO! That's good. But I don't know which is worse, being tortured at hearing this tune constantly, or having to paddle as fast as your paddling ability allows upstream because you hear banjo music. LOL!

You know, I gotta tell you. When I was a kid in preschool and in kindergarten going forward, I don't recall any of this soft ass shit to my reconciliation. Is it any wonder kids now a days are the way they are? Now I don't mean to sound -- mean, but stuff like this or the fact parents actually buy ear muffs (for lack of the right term) for their kids because 4th of July fireworks are too "loud" makes me eerily suspicious we are raising a pack of wussies.

Now I know it's a video for kids and what not, but do they honestly have to add all that stupid fluff to it all and make it all "fun" or what ever? I don't know, maybe it's just me. When I was little I hatted Sesame Street and when Mr. Rogers came on I'd fire my dart gun at the TV where the dart looked like it stuck to Mr. Roger's head. LOL Back in my day GI Joe, Thundercats and The real Ghostbusters were my shows. Yes, I also watched my fair share of Popeye, Loony Tunes, Hanna Barbera and all the rest. You simply don't see these cartoon anymore. Now it's utter stupid crap like We Bear Bears or something and Teen Titans Go. Da hell?! LOL I hope one day I can introduce my own kids to the fine cartoons I used to watch like the aforementioned Loony Tunes, Popeye, Hanna Barbera, etc. But if they are attracted to the likes of Teen Titans Go then so be it. I just don't know. LOL

PS: I turned 40 last week, and not one person sung Happy Birthday to me. LOL! Come to think of it, the last time I heard Happy Birthday was probably when I turned 12 or 13. This was back when another great cartoon aired on MTV, Beavis and Butthead. LOL! And no, my kids wouldn't be watching that unless they reached at least 16.

At any rate, your Sig reminds me of this Family Guy clip.




Edit-

One day the great "justice warriors" of our day will have that episode or clip burned from existence because Nazis and stuff like that...


Edit 2-

I have DVDs of old classic cartoons and they actually give you a warning about this crap that the cartoon may seem racist and stuff. Yes, it may seem racist, but from the warning should note something about thee historical context or something and not just blanket say racist and what not. I mean, are people really this stupid that we need a warning, or is the company trying to save their rich ass from stupid people and their sue happy crap? "Oh, my kid watched this and it's racist this and that and Felix the cat represents racism because he's black and has a black magic bag! Oh the humanity!"

 

Good grief. Watching the rest of that video makes me want to actually drink hand sanitizer in hopes that I get drunk. There's no damn way on this planet that me as a kid back then would enjoy watching that ridiculous crap. Not only did I hate Sesame Street and Mr. Rogers, I hated clowns as well and wanted to stomp on their oversized shoes and punch their bright red noses'. When I saw a picture of a clown for the first time back in preschool I was like, "the hell is that?" I thought he or she looked absolutely ridiculous.

Did I mention that video was ridiculous? LOL

 

Yeah, bleach is a corrosive and shouldn't be used on hands unless it's cut down with dihydrogen monoxide, i.e water. Even then you shouldn't use it on your hands even if you get the formula right. Bleach is good with water to clean up barf, blood and all the rest.

Off hand I can't really think of anything that's a disinfectant and portable other then alcohol based hand sanitizer. You can make it by the gallon though, and I gave instructions on how to do it. So make a ton of it and put it in little bottles you can buy on eBay to carry around with you. That's what I did. I bought a bunch of really good high content aloe vera gel and little bottles all on eBay.

And I shouldn't have to say this. But never, ever mix bleach and ammonia. The result is hydrochloric acid and the fumes will kick your lungs' ass in more ways than one let me tell you. That goes without saying you shouldn't mix anything with anything unless you know what you're doing. I actually saw a kid make a batch of RDX (yes, the explosive) on YouTube and he made enough of it right there in his kitchen to not only blow his ass away, but the mail man's ass from three blocks away. I was like, you can't be this stupid. I know he got it right based on what I read years ago. I'm sure the ATF loves people like this that willy nilly make these videos. This was years ago and I'm sure Google has since pulled the video. There's something called a Darwin award? Is that still given out today?

 

Good morning F22,

Of course, ... my discussions here loaded with comments from professional medical personnel. I work with them in my volunteer role......

Using bleach isn't straight from the Great Value 2 gallon jug - although this has been done before by medics in adverse field conditions.

Bleach is / can be a substitute for alcohol. Again, of course, help from the medics. Every time out inthe Appalachians around Wise County, there's an "Appalachian School of Pharamacy". My questions are already prepared on index cards and I ask my pharma volunteer counterparts questions and get great answers.

Believe bleach and ammonia forms chlorine gas. Lt Harry Truman can explain the danger. His artillery battery used some gas projectiles just like the enemy battery during WWI in Europe.

Anyone who had a Gilbert chemistry set learned to make dangerous stuff better and faster than the Viet Cong.

"Better Living through chemistry."

Foot Note:

Had once asked the Appalachia pharma pros about the scary don't let RX pharma product get stored over some X temperature. I asked about RX medical stuff left in hot pickup truck and pharmacist professor told me not to worry about loss of ingredients effectiveness for short times. The caution labels required on RX pharma - can't write everything here.

 

Yeah, bleach is great if that's all you got, but I'd refrain from using the stuff as my constant go to source of hand sanitizer. Just my two cents. If you ever applied bleach to your hands it literally seems to take the oils right out of your hands and my hands feel like crap after words. Even if mixed with water I'm sure you'd experience the same result.

Where bleach really shines is using the proper water to bleach mixture to wash down hand rails, banisters, door knobs, etc. The thing with it though is that you can only, ONLY use that bleach and water mixture once. Once your down using it you flush it down the toilet or the drain. The bleach and water mixture over time loses its effectiveness. So just to let you know, if you're thinking about carrying a bleach/water solution on your person, just know it probably becomes less effective over time. And the aforementioned heat about a pharmaceutical product probably applies to a bleach/water solution as well.

Something else. Many people don't realize this, but hand sanitizer actually contains something called alcohol! Well, don't make the massive mistake of keeping it in your car. If it's hot outside it WILL catch fire or explode.

 

Good afternoon F22,

One of the reasons I don't like alcohol is that it's flammable.

Both alcohol and bleach require an after treatment of some ointment. I use white petrolatum USP.

An important point: "it probably becomes less effective over time";

Whenever leaving my "base" - my shack, my truck, the emergency shelter to do something else asked of me, ... I ALWAYS check my loadout, eg batteries OK ?, paper towels resupplied?, 2 Cadbury large chocolate bars in field jacket pocket?, 2-4 small bottles of water?, hand cleaner /disinfectant?

 

I take it some of you guys don't have children then.

 

Good afternoon Max,

I admit to not understanding why you're asking the children question.

Can you add something here to clarify ?

 

Woman who does purchasing for us got hand sanitizer from a distiller. She said that it smelled like whiskey to her, so she bought no more from them.

"Complete List of Distilleries (Including Anheuser-Busch) Making Hand Sanitizers Instead of Spirits"

https://parade.com/1011922/jerylbrunner/distilleries-making-hand-sanitizer/
.

 

Same link; "Parade"; above post's link https://parade.com/1011922/jerylbrunner/distilleries-making-hand-sanitizer/

"According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, the best way to clean your hands is to wash with soap and water for at least 20 seconds. If that option is not available, they suggest using an alcohol-based hand sanitizer that has at least 60 percent alcohol. The rush to stockpile sanitizer has caused a national shortage."

Seventy percent, 70% alcohol is best for killing bacteria. Your alcohol unfolds proteins in the cell wall (death to bacteria), but then you need put the protein parts in solution, thus the need for the H2O component. Pure alcohol is good for cleaning some electronic components (not all).

Being a lipivore, here is a section of cell wall from one of my liver cells:

 

You can use vegetable glycerin instead of aloe vera gel in your DIY hand sanitizer.

https://www.panoleo.com/can-you-use...-aloe-vera-gel-for-a-homemade-hand-sanitizer/

● "When vegetable glycerol is used to make homemade sanitizers, it gives the skin ability to lock in moisture, thus softening and soothing the skin’s complexion while still cleansing it. This is because the pH level of the glycerol is quite close to that of the skin. This particular property also makes vegetable glycerol ideal for baby skincare or people living with skin complications. Therefore, while making homemade sanitizer, vegetable glycerin is a suitable alternative to aloe vera."

●" Vegetable glycerin is suitable for making homemade sanitizer because it does not clog the skin’s pores.This ensures that the skin absorbs active and beneficial ingredients from the glycerol. Moreover, these active ingredients help to regenerate the skin and improve the skin tone. Unwanted marks and spots are also diminished by vegetable glycerol. Hence, a homemade sanitizer made with vegetable glycerin is very beneficial to the skin, among many other uses."

● "Vegetable glycerol is ideal for hand sanitizer because it eliminates congestion in skin pores, maintains skin’s elasticity, soothes itching and dryness, regulates the skin’s oil production, and protects the skin from harmful bacteria."

Vegetable glycerin is available from many distributers.
https://duckduckgo.com/?q=vegetable+glycerin&atb=v140-1&iax=images&ia=images

Me, I have dry skin to begin with. Alcohol destroys my skin. During winter, if I don't oil my hands, the skin cracks and bleeds. And that is true even if NOT using alcohol hand cleaners (but I have to use the stuff year round, covid or no covid).
.

 

About USP. You may be interested in knowing that USP signed a series of Memoranda of Understanding with China's Pharmacopeia. Not sure if that means our USP standards go the China way or not, but there'd be no way I'd sign shit like that with China at all.

 

Am I now more than one person?

No kids that I have myself presently. Long story, but my first was placed in adoption. I guess when you do have kids you're exposed to this stuff all the time. But it's like I wrote above. I don't recall seeing this kind of "fluff" when I was y0ung. At least not to by recollection.

He's referring to my two posts on my disdain to a very over done video on trying too hard at getting kids to wash their hands saying happy birthday to themselves twice.

 

Yeah, I knew they were making it months ago and often wondered where it was in the store since I heard they were making hand sanitizer.

I think the smell would be the least of someone's problems when it came to a massive upper respiratory infection or not. People... I suppose they also wear a mask in a car too. LMAO!

 

That's some impressive Photoshop skills...

Fun fact: China flu loves fat.

 

My parents use this stuff and swear by it. I personally can't stand its smell. It's like too lotion smelling or something. I'd rather use non-scented products and that goes for dryer sheets. Why do I want to smell like a fuzzy bear called Snuggle?

Now that I think about it, the aforementioned vegetable glycerin is probably the chief ingredient in Corn Huskers.

 

Good morning Old Geezer,

Same here; my paws' epidermis and alcohol don't work well together. Also same problem with winter weather. Must use lotions, balms, ointments or problems.

I think my EMT colleague used vegetable glycerin in my pharma level dilluted bleach hand sanitizer.

My supply has no pleasing aroma nor do I care.

 

Good afternoon F22,

Appreciate the info re Max and kids comment.

Now I comprehende.