Spiking Roads

Discussion in 'Other Useful Objects' started by poltiregist, Aug 3, 2019.

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  1. poltiregist

    poltiregist Master Survivalist
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    Should spiking roads with nail laden boards or those nails with the large heads that will stand in an upright position be part of a preppers defense plan ? In certain situations stopping approaching vehicles many miles from your retreat may be something you want to consider . If so does these items need to be in your stash ?
     
  2. Sourdough

    Sourdough "ALASKAN"
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    Yes.
     
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  3. Sourdough

    Sourdough "ALASKAN"
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    And pre-marked trees to be felled across roads and rivers and runways.
     
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2019
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  4. Sourdough

    Sourdough "ALASKAN"
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    Choke points identified for parking heavy equipment and then disabling.

    Road signs to be I.D. for removal or relocating.
     
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2019
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  5. Sourdough

    Sourdough "ALASKAN"
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    Rural runways to be identified for blocking.
     
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  6. Sourdough

    Sourdough "ALASKAN"
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    We did this subject on another forum. And we were massively "SHOCKED" at the outrage. People had never considered roadways, waterways, runways, being disabled.

    I am constantly wondering exactly which part of serious survival is not comprehendible.

    People seem to think this SHTF survival will be fun.
     
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  7. poltiregist

    poltiregist Master Survivalist
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    With enough spikes even large cities trying to evacuate would be greatly impeded .
     
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  8. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    boards with nails in are called "Hedgehogs" over here, I don't know that there is a need to make them pre SHTF but they should be included in one's plans.
    I identified choke points as long ago as 10 years ago.
    wooden sign posts will be removed for firewood, metal ones will be used to make arrow heads.
    don't forget the trip wires and a few dozen "pungi" sticks too.
     
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  9. randyt

    randyt Master Survivalist
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    get or make some caltrops, they can be scattered about.
     
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  10. Alaskajohn

    Alaskajohn Expert Member
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    Yes, I remember that thread well!

    In addition to what IBME said in previous posts, their are often certain choke points such as narrow canyons, cliffs, bridges, etc that you need to study and develop strategies. The only road within hundreds of miles that goes through my valley has multiple choke points where a landslide would render impassable. The state makes daily runs with plow trucks to push the rocks that fall from the hills on the road. The road would close itself naturally in days if the state ceased to do this. I could easily assist in creating my own landslide. My only neighbor has a bulldozer and we have already discussed how we could close a certain mountain pass in no time.
     
  11. Old Geezer

    Old Geezer Legendary Survivalist
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  12. Pragmatist

    Pragmatist Master Survivalist
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    Good afternoon all,

    Certain roads ... whether public or not ... designated part of US critical infrastructure ... will be protected no less so than critical structure waterways, runways, ...

    To clarify; not the entire nation's transport system but those already designated as "critical infrastructure".

    FWIW, I recommend you think carefully about any private citizen action to close down critical infrastructure.

    Tested plans are already in place. Think about how LOOP and Sub Base, Kings Bay are protected.

    During a declared national emergency, please note that the Federal Rules of Evidence do not apply.

    Nor other rules.

    For advanced-level preppers here, recall the big national change incorporated into US Anti-Terrorism insurance.

    Again, recommend think and reflect carefully on this.
     
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  13. TMT Tactical

    TMT Tactical The Great Lizard !
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    Run flat tires are a problem for the caltrops and hedgehogs Tire wrap does not care, it wraps around the wheel and locks it up. A nice combination of all three works wonders. IBME has mentioned a number of things already on my planning list, so I thought I would share this one.

    Here is a video of the concept. You can buy just the net or build your own setup. Enjoy.

     
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2019
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  14. Keith H.

    Keith H. Moderator Staff Member
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    But what if this simply tells someone that you are there? These raiders are then on foot & you are less likely to see or hear them coming. What if the wrong people fall prey to your nail boards?
    On your own property inside the gate I agree, good idea, but you will know they are there & be prepared. But further away? No, I don't think I will be doing that myself.
    Keith.
     
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  15. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    The small towns will quickly decide to block off the roads off the freeways and major highways. They blocked the bridge where I live during Rita and then only allowed cars to pass in controlled numbers. You have to do this or they will just keep piling up until nobody can move. THEN the idiots sit there with their motor running until it either overheats or runs out of gas. They block in so tight that even the crossroads are blocked. In a long term problem, it will be life or death for the small towns and little rural communities. A little town of 300 can't support several thousand refugees that have NOTHING.
     
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  16. GrizzlyetteAdams

    GrizzlyetteAdams Crap Creek Survivor
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    From a practical standpoint, no.

    Most people that I know avoid (like the plague) driving over boards and similar debris in the road for just that reason: nails. I would assume that the average motorist thinks the same way, especially after natural or man-made SHTF events.

    Caltrops: I would not use caltrops to disable folks trespassing on my property (or even in my area) because I don't want them to be taking their sweet time about leaving because of needing to assess their situation, changing tires, or worse, proceeding on foot. I would be interested in exploring other means of deterring trespassers, rather than making it difficult for them to leave.

    .
     
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  17. TMT Tactical

    TMT Tactical The Great Lizard !
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    Make it difficult for them to arrive.
     
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  18. GrizzlyetteAdams

    GrizzlyetteAdams Crap Creek Survivor
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    Yes, that is the idea, but I don't want to make it difficult for them to leave or keep on going elsewhere. And besides, eventually one can run out of nails/caltrops. Then what?


    .
     
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  19. poltiregist

    poltiregist Master Survivalist
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    Two hundred pounds of nails strewn at two pound per mile equals one hundred miles of spiked road . Even those living in a city may want to be one of the first out and then eliminate many of the other vehicles intending to go to the same place . Most vehicles have only one spare tire .
     
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  20. Sourdough

    Sourdough "ALASKAN"
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    In Alaska there is ONLY one road into the state. Outside of cities like Anchorage, most towns are a fair long ways down a dirt-gravel-or poorly paved one or barely two lane road. Some small towns are 20 to 60 miles down a rough road, often only open in the summer.

    I think you would want to stop or divert road vehicles ten to twenty miles from your residence. In Alaska once the Dept. of Transportation stops snow plowing........it is over.
     
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  21. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    I'm more inclined to block a road than put out nails. Loose nails make the road so I can't use it. It is kind of like burning the bridge behind you. If I block my road and you come anyway I don't want to flatten your tires or mess up your vehicle. I might want to use it after I "dispose" of you.
     
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  22. GrizzlyetteAdams

    GrizzlyetteAdams Crap Creek Survivor
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    LOL, is that really your best plan? What will you do with families, women, children...? (Not being sarcastic, but realistic in asking.)


    .
     
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  23. Bishop

    Bishop Master Survivalist
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    I would tell you how to make a good one but that would put me in a bad spot lol but really not lol
     
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  24. poltiregist

    poltiregist Master Survivalist
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    There are a lot of people that think along these lines . Even if you decline to do such things there might be someone in a fifty mile radius of you that will . Someone planning to use a road may be the victim regardless whether they play nice or not . I am well prepared and don't expect to need to drive anywhere . If someone wants to spike roads I don't have a problem with it .
     
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2019
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  25. Sourdough

    Sourdough "ALASKAN"
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    Just don't do it the end of October. That is my annual supply run.
     
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  26. GrizzlyetteAdams

    GrizzlyetteAdams Crap Creek Survivor
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    Just trying to see the point of this tactic, not debate the "make nice-nice" part of it. I just don't see the practicality of it...but that's just me. Maybe others are seeing something that I haven't.

    Here are the cons that I see:

    1) You end up with a lot of disabled cars, all of them needing new tires. (What? Do you own a tire store? Ok, then there's that, lol.)

    2) You end up with a bunch (maybe a LOT) of people (Tex has a front end loader or maybe a dungeon, idk)

    3) You will run out of the sharp pointy things pretty quick, then what? If you already have plan B and C in mind, why not make them Plan A & B especially considering #1 & #2?




    .
     
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  27. TMT Tactical

    TMT Tactical The Great Lizard !
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    Road spiking, tree dropping, are or should be designed to keep unwanted visitors out----AFTER---- it hits the fan. Posted warnings are for the families and they should heed the warnings. For a family to trespass, they would have had to either damage a gate or a fence, at that time, they became raiders.

    Unfortunately children do suffer for the stupidity of their parents. I cannot see saving the child of somebody I just had to kill. I seriously doubt the child will grow up adoring me or be understanding about the loss of their parents. The child would grow up waiting for it's chance for revenge / justice. Now that is the ugly realities for those that wish it would hit the fan soon. I do not wish for or hope the collapse happens now or even in my life time. I do plan for it but that does not make it any nicer or acceptable. You may be required to make choices that will directly decide if your and your family lives or dies. Some of those choices my be very ugly. Prep for the worst and hope (pray) it never happens.
     
  28. GrizzlyetteAdams

    GrizzlyetteAdams Crap Creek Survivor
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    Yes, barriers make much more sense than collecting cars and people who can't leave, lol.


    .
     
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  29. Sourdough

    Sourdough "ALASKAN"
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    It is the most basic of military strategy. The most vicious fights are over securing a "Bridge" for your use, or destroying the "bridge" to trap or impede the enemy.

    There must be 40 good WW-II war movies about holding or destroying a bridge. And officers in charge who failed were terminated. Entire war campaigns are won or lost on the battle for a bridge.
     
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  30. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    most people will be walking post SHTF anywhere, and not too far, as there wont be any fuel left and most people here drive on empty anywhere.
    i'm not expecting any "visitors" to get this far out, so such plans will be kept in reserve.
    if you want to force people to go another route then a felled tree across the road would do the trick, most sheeple don't carry an axe much less a chainsaw.
     
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  31. poltiregist

    poltiregist Master Survivalist
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    Some seem to have missed the objective of the automotive disabling theory . The point is to disable the vehicle many miles away from your retreat not at your retreat . Another misconception , as lonewolf points out during SOME types of crises such as a power grid destroyed scenario autos likely wouldn't run or have any fuel so this would make this strategy void of much use . An epidemic would be an example of where it would factor in . One danger of doing this , if you drove many miles out to carry out your dirty deed , you might fall victim of someone else that had the same idea you had and beat you to the deed leaving you many miles from your retreat with four flat tires .
     
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2019
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  32. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    I think the best idea is to channel people away from your location, move them away from your area, maybe get them lost further out.
     
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  33. poltiregist

    poltiregist Master Survivalist
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    Actually I agree with Lonewolf . Spiking roads is a step farther than I would be willing to go . I do consider its concept valid but for moral reasons can not see myself doing this . I started this thread with the purpose of wanting to hear from our members on their thoughts on this . I actually expected more outrage , especially from our planning to bug out members .
     
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2019
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  34. Old Geezer

    Old Geezer Legendary Survivalist
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    In the county adjacent to the county in which I was raised, the rednecks (not hillbillies, we're another breed) would call-in the Sheriff's Dept. and deputies would drive up into their hollars. The rednecks would then cut down trees behind them, forcing the lawmen to call in crews to saw-up the downed trees. Sheriff got tired of it. He goes political, gets in surplussed M-14 (7.62 NATO) rifles with full-auto selector switches, distributes said rifles to his men. District attorney has ZERO problems with the sheriff's actions. Message to rednecks, "I do not care if my men cut you in half." The redneck crap stopped rather rapidly.

    Let us never forget that might makes right.

    Let us never forget that it is best in life not to get noticed.

    George Washington won an unwinnable war with the essential aid of spies and saboteurs who kept a very, very, very low profile.

    Keith H. has good eyes! Never, never advertise.
     
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  35. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    When someone comes to attack me I will kill them. When I block MY road it will be like when I close and lock my front door. What would you do if someone kicked in your front door? I wasn't talking about blocking a highway. My road has a gate on it. I will reinforce it if things go bad. In Texas even now I have the right to defend my life and property from attack. I will not surrender and let them kill MY women and kids. If you are not willing to defend yourself then what is the point in preparing to survive if you will allow attackers to just roll in and over you and your place?

    PS: I am a full supporter of women's rights. That means that I will kill a female that attacks me or mine just as fast as I would a male. An 8-year-old with a gun can kill you just as dead as a 21-year-old. Little kids that are not armed or attacking me will be treated differently but even then I will not sacrifice my family to take in every kid that comes my way. Survival isn't going to be about kindness and excessive charity.

    PPS: My wife is NOT going to be very accepting of me taking in a lot of extra ladies. She is MEAN and makes me look like a teddy bear. 25 years working in the Texas prison system made her fully aware of how many people get killed by someone that they tried to help.
     
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2019
  36. GrizzlyetteAdams

    GrizzlyetteAdams Crap Creek Survivor
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    In most locations, this particular point would be an absolute failure on so many levels, including the fact that there will likely be OTHER humans between your point A (the vehicle) and point B (your retreat). Unless you live in a super remote location such as where IBME lives, the likelihood of people living within a few miles of you is pretty good. So what is the point of disabling vehicles many miles away??? Besides that, consider also the fact that your nails/caltrops are pretty much a one-time deal. They do not self-perpetuate. Will you will travel again and again to reset new ones?

    I still don't see this as a good idea for so many reasons (including moral ones). But it's not me that needs convincing, just the folks who may not have taken more things into consideration.

    As for me, personally, I want my blows to count when I strike. But in the process, I don’t want to do anything that will cause me to not like who I see in the mirror. When it’s all said and done, what will I remember about the way I handled things? Regret and remorse over disastrous outcomes because I didn’t think things through better? I hope not.

    On the other hand, I will not hesitate to defend myself with lethal means if needed. But like the saying goes, the best way to win a gunfight is to not be there.

    Rather than knock myself out creating and maintaining problematic barriers / disabling tactics that also announce to the world that there is something worth taking, I will concentrate on evading detection. After all, eventually there will come a group that has the ability to overwhelm me and mine at some point.


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  37. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    Honestly, a flat tire doesn't stop a car if you don't care about damaging it. Cops chase people for miles sometimes AFTER they have run them across spike strips. When you have a flat you stop because you don't want to ruin your tire and wheel. Mostly when cops use the spike strips it is to slow them down and make it easier to then stop them. If they don't slow down then they usually crash because the rims don't make for good control.

    The other problem is that you really don't want to strand a bunch of useless refugees in your area and unless you have a dump truck full of nails you aren't going to be able to spike all the roads 10 or 15 miles away. Any closer than that you are better off hoping that they will just pass through and be gone.
     
  38. GrizzlyetteAdams

    GrizzlyetteAdams Crap Creek Survivor
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    Thank you for taking the time to clarify that your earlier comment was in reference to your private property. That’s a horse of a different color and I am in full agreement with you! I feel the same way. We would be sorry excuses for humanity if we didn’t defend ourselves and loved ones.

    I misunderstood your other post, because I thought the discussion was referencing public roads not private property...

    My apologies, Tex.



    .
     
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2019
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  39. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    In rural Texas, it isn't unusual to have long roads that lead to your house. I lived on a dirt road for many many years. 8 miles of rubboard ruts for 13 years made cars a no go. we were a three-truck family. To me, spiking highways isn't worthwhile. If I blocked any road other then my "driveway" it might be the road into my place. it is a mile to a dead in with no side roads. My neighbors and I might decide to limit travel into our area. If you don't live there you don't need to be there.

    Rural people have different situations from urban, suburban or even small-town residents. This gives us a somewhat different world view even now. City people come out and dump their dogs on us. They dump their trash out in the back road areas. The dope heads cruse the road looking for homes with nobody home because there are no neighbors to call the cops which wouldn't come for a half-hour to an hour anyway. To combat this we tend to be more of the mind to just shoot trespassers than let them wander around on our property and steal from us. When we put up a sign that says NO TRESPASSING they understand that means that trespassers will be shot and survivors will be shot again!!
     
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  40. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    in rural England there are Y forks in the road, cross roads and old pack horse bridges, many roads are not signposted, and it is easy to get lost if you don't know where your going or go in completely the wrong direction to the one you want, especially with high hedges and deep lanes you cant see over.
    post SHTF sat nav's wont be working, so unless someone has a paper map(and knows how to read it).
     
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  41. Pragmatist

    Pragmatist Master Survivalist
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    Good morning Grizz and Tex Dan,

    Public roads and private roads (NOT discussing a home/residence and immediate driveway to home) have DIFFERENT rules governing them during various declarations of emergencies (eg by POTUS, a Governor, a District Health Commissioner, a senior LEO).

    Plus, a private road could still be listed in emergency plans as "critical infrastructure". No longer will worker access to key facilities be neglected. An example: for every hour of delay for an electrical crew to arrive at an airport, the airports experiences a 24 hour delay withing the national scheme.

    Create a barrier on an important road - as deemed important by the area's authorities and special response teams will be dispatched - - - and the cost of their contractors goes to the spiker along with court costs, county penalties, and all the rest already in place on the books.

    The nation has changed and Ozzie and Harriet are R.I.P. I live on a private road 1 km from the nearest state road and the state road floods on both ends and this state road gets priority status because of the residents involvement with the emergency plans. I cannot/not allowed to stop a Gateraide Gocart trespassing on my road if road access is interfered with.

    Thus, the need for prepper orgs.

    Witness the Neighborhood Watch program expanding.
     
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  42. Snyper

    Snyper Expert Member
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    Only if you own the road.
    Otherwise you have no real right to attempt to control anyone else.
     
  43. randyt

    randyt Master Survivalist
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    I noticed you said .....in certain situations.. I took this to mean the end of the world as we know it, a world without law, complete societal breakdown, mad max american style. Probably didn't mean a hurricane warning or some such, That's the way I took it.
     
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  44. TMT Tactical

    TMT Tactical The Great Lizard !
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    During a complete WROL event, only the communities can or should attempt to block public egress roads. It takes a lot of manpower to man security points (roads and bridges). On privates roads / drive ways, the owners should absolutely plan to block access to uninvited vehicles. Vehicles can ram access paths into your compound. It is a lot more difficult for individuals to storm through your fences or gates.
     
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  45. poltiregist

    poltiregist Master Survivalist
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    Randyt your right about what I was refering to . I never said I would actually do such a thing but wanted to shake some members up and hear their response on a serious subject . I take prepping serious and was trying to pull members into a realm of serious thought . If the members here don't focus on what this site is about , then we are in danger of losing it .
     
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  46. randyt

    randyt Master Survivalist
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    I figured as much. In my mind the situations you were referring to, there is no longer a government, no longer law enforcement, no public utilities, no fire department, no ambulance services or a public, nothing but yourself and your wits. I wanted to clarify it for other members.
     
  47. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    usually referred to as W.R.O.L. or without rule of law, your on your own and must survive on your own wits.
     
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  48. Morgan101

    Morgan101 Master Survivalist
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    I have mixed emotions on the whole topic. Maybe I am not thinking of spiking a road in the same way. If you used boards with nails driven through them isn't that kind of a single purpose tool? You might stop one vehicle, but once it is seen or the impact is seen don't the bad guys just move it out of the way and keep coming? I could see how you could dump kegs of nails over a long distance being more effective.

    Let me be the Devil's advocate here, but if you are spiking roads or impeding/stopping traffic or travel to someplace aren't you also impeding/stopping yourself from getting out? I'm thinking you better be darn sure you don't have to leave or travel on those spiked roads.

    Would a better method be a movable (albeit difficult) barricade? I really don't have a strong opinion one way or another. Just a thought.
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2019
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  49. randyt

    randyt Master Survivalist
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    yup, we have a saying in my world, if you are going to burn a bridge you better be a darn good swimmer.
     
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  50. TMT Tactical

    TMT Tactical The Great Lizard !
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    Barriers, spiking, caltrops all have their benefits and draw backs. How they are designed, how used and what is the intended purpose will dictate their usefulness. It is again, a no one size fits all.
     
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