'survival/off The Grid ' -a Different Perspective..

I want to throw a rock in the pond with a different first hand perspective on this topic-survival.[ Its something I wish will never happen in your country] , but survival and uninhabited areas nowadays are linked with illegal immigrants and politics .
This topic of survival can not realistically been discussed without taking these other factors also into consideration--whether we want to or wish to or like it or not...

Long term secret survival as you guys describe here is today only a dream in most parts of Africa....
Its ironic, but what with nearly all of the African countries currently having poor border control [border post on the road is something else and require a passport and a bribe..]

The NWO ideal of making Africa [+_ 60 different countries] one big country from Cairo to Cape Town without any borders are followed by many countries.
[It's cheaper for the rest of the world to let people here converge illegally like locusts on a country with resources than to try and upheld failing and corrupt governments---sad!.]

Illegal immigrants and cross border crime gangs here destroy many wild places/animals [rural 'off the grit, 'survival' locations] because of the available protected natural resources.
[using Poaching and bushmeat to feed the 'poor', but they still have to pay the illegal supplier!]

Truly wild places [to survive in off the grit] are under private control today and many game ranches here have highly trained armed guards [ex soldiers] patrolling the property and protecting the wild animals.....

The general scenario in Africa of getting yourself lost under the radar on purpose to survive away from everybody is very-very remote !
So sad but true--
That's why I'm reading with interest about your guy's plans for survival/off the grid living as you still have uninhabited wilderness areas.

I really do not want to talk politics, and in this post it is NOT my intention, but sometimes we need to look at the bigger picture and not just the me, myself and my secret survival group [that is the dream and ideal, but not the reality everywhere]

Go for it if you can in your place!

 

We really must and have to learn from each other globally in order to survive.....

 

100%+ to that! It's one of the reasons why I appreciate this forum so much. It has more of an international membership than most boards of this type.

That map really puts things in perspective! I never considered all of the comparisons side by side like this before. It's one thing to think, OK, this country is larger than that country, etc. but your map provides a totally different outlook.

Thank you for posting an eye-opener.

As for the USA's wilderness areas, outside of the most remote regions of Alaska, the seemingly wild areas of America are not as wild as many think. What seems remote is already well known (and loved) by local hunters and outdoor enthusiasts. I think that by the end of the SHTF day, those who bugged out to the so-called wilderness will be paid a surprise visit by the locals who will NOT be happy. As I mentioned in another post, these locals will already be angry because of urbanites and suburbanites trespassing their personal property and hunting grounds.




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Was born in Libya...back when the King was named Idris.

I know how big is Africa. I also know how big is the Atlantic and also the Pacific Oceans...as I've been across both.

I have no problem with learning from each other in survival.



I draw the line in internationalism when one nation is required to support another nation and people in perpetuity..forever on its public breast.

Africa has an abundance of natural resources....more than most nations.

Their problem is management...ie...leadership.

They are long past the time and out of excuses for blaming it on colonialism...


Someone is pulling a similar scam here in America ..the blame game...blaming everything on racism, sexism, LGBT bias, or any other guilt program they can manufacture.

I suspect the same groups blaming Africa's problems on colonialism are the same bunch trying similar blame games or patterns here in America. Same M. O.

My non Ishmaelite .02,

Watcherchris

 

I’ve been watching what is going on in Africa for some time. Rhodesia (Now Zimbabwe), South Africa, and Rwanda show how, even with resources, things can turn south fast. I don’t want to even start talking about the problems on the rest of the continent. Absent rule of law, much of what we see happening in Africa we could see here in the US.

 

Starving nations have one thing in common . Rich corrupt leaders . Looking at Brexit and the corrupt leader they have makes me think they are well down the path of creating a starving nation . Even nations with abundant resources can quickly fall with a corrupt power hungry leader . Look at Brazil and Venezuela . Mexico with their corrupt leaders has turned into a drug empire and a war zone . We have several members on here that can't speak up about some issues in fear their government leader will send thugs to their door .Tyranny is alive and growing .

 

Interesting topic. What I think we are seeing in Africa is the fallout from a continent being split up along colonial lines rather than tribal and ethnic lines. The fall out is obvious. The worry about immigrants is something very different. In Europe there are thousands of African immigrants, most genuine people fleeing in fear of their safety from wars in Syria, Libya, Sudan etc. Amongst those refugees are bound to be some chancers, but most of the refugees we get are just frightened people who want to keep their families safe, actually rather like the topics we discuss on this very forum.

It is worth being mindful that so many of the corrupt regimes of Africa are corrupted by those that were, if not put in place, encouraged or back by "western" powers in the past.

 

Sekelbos: It is very surprising that in a continent that size it would be hard to find a place that would be safe. Maybe it is because the African people are more likely to survive in the bush where Westerners are more likely to head to a city. We have gangs and criminals in the city that probably would not fare well in the country. Your gangs and criminals are already out in the country.

I agree with Brownbear. Borders were set by colonial powers, and tribal lines were mostly ignored. I wonder how peaceful things could be if the borders were returned to tribal lines? Would the tribes be satisfied with what they had, or would the wars continue for other reasons? My African history is not that good. My perception is there have always been warring factions, and there has never been any peace. Is that true?

Just curious, and not trying to be nosy, but if things are really bad and you have to bug out, where will you go?

 

That is the point I wanted to make....most of the times it would be a bad idea to try and bug out as all the likely places with resources would probably already be taken/occupied/ squatted on/invaded.
Its really a dream to have a lot of uninhabited places like you guys have and just be able to 'loose' yourselves in there and 'survive' prep etc.
Bugging in would in general be the safest or best thing to do if possible.
Yea, Africa is huge--and people tend to migrate/stay/ or swarm to the places in the wild where they can survive.
Chances are that the lonely places you have in mind off the beaten track will already have people when you reach it because of the resources.
Different continent,different situation....same dream !

fun by sekelbos posted Apr 1, 2019 at 4:24 PM

 

“Imagine yourself.
Your vehicle overturned by an angry elephant, the tantrum of which you escaped by a hair’s breadth. You are unarmed, with no food and water, and lost in one of the remotest arid valleys of the African wilderness, the Zambezi Valley, where lion and leopard and hyaena stalk their prey…
Hurungwe is a true personal account of survival in wildest Africa during the summer of 1958.”

This is a great little book!

The chances down here of being in a survival situation due to this scenareo is much higher than to bug out.

Fun by sekelbos posted Apr 1, 2019 at 4:43 PM

 

Now that is something with which we have very little experience. Even in a downed aircraft in a remote location, there are few areas here where you have to worry about apex predators, and from most of those you could protect yourself with a spear. I think Africa has cornered the market on apex predators.

 

I remember being on some survival training many years back and the scenario was a crashed aircraft in a mountainous area and was the usual exercise re what items you would utilise and whether you tay or go. After some discussion the groups decided to stay (published flight route on a commercial airway corridor etc) rather than walk out. The day after we completed this theoretical exercise one of the guys came in with that morning's newspaper that had a story of a similar real life situation and the people had walked out, all surviving, and having not done a single thing we had been taught. The irony was not lost on us.

So, my point is, no hard and fast rules, eve if Africa, some get out alive, most don't. There s a degree of luck involved in all scenarios.

 

That of course is the conundrum. The general advice we were given, on the course, was to stay put. That only works if you are where you would be expected to be eg in a plane that came down on its pre arranged flightpath. It also relies n the assumption that someone will come and rescue you, which steps away from the concept of self reliance somewhat.

Your question re having the strength to walk out after period of non rescue is a really interesting one. I guess one would have to be physically fit to start with and uninjured to even consider it. I'm not sure there is a clear answer beyond that though.

 

You're right, I recall less stories of folks actually surviving than perishing.

 

fun by sekelbos posted Apr 17, 2019 at 5:15 AM

The book I referred to

“Imagine yourself. Your vehicle overturned by an angry elephant, the tantrum of which you escaped by a hair’s breadth. You are unarmed, with no food and water, and lost in one of the remotest arid valleys of the African wilderness, the Zambezi Valley, where lion and leopard and hyaena stalk their prey…Hurungwe is a true personal account of survival in wildest Africa during the summer of 1958.”

 

From people, I know that have been to Africa to hunt the elephants are mostly being legally killed because as the people spread into their habitats they aren't good about sharing. The males in musk are especially troublesome. As long as the people keep multiplying like rabbits the problem is going to just get worse.

A friend of mine has taken three elephants. All three were considered rogue and were going to be killed one way or another. wayne said that he saw what elephants can do to a small farm/large garden and when you are talking about people that live hand to mouth that just can't be allowed. Then you have the rogue males that will just randomly kill someone for no apparent reason. He said that every one of his kills was celebrated by the locals. They got all of the meat and were rid of a problem beast. They also get part of the just huge fee he paid for the privilege of hunting on their tribal lands.

It is sad, they are magnificent beasts. Like so many other things though in order for them to live and have enough land to survive on there are going to have to be fewer people. As sad as the hunts are there are also mass killings in the preserves because if there are too many they will starve and leave the preserve. those are a total loss. Ivory is also not a free-flowing thing anymore. Wayne paid over $10.000.00 a pair to get them legally out of Africa and into the US. He can't sell them under any condition and if his future great-grandkids want to get rid of them they will have to turn them over to authorities. If any of the tusks were to just magically disappear the fine would be in 6 figures somewhere.