When The Power Goes Down.

Discussion in 'Other Not Listed Situations' started by lonewolf, Nov 24, 2018.

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  1. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    As far as I see it, the pivot point is when the electricity supply shuts down.
    most of the population can manage up to that event, but electricity is what makes everything work, without that there is nothing.
    no power means the fuel pumps at the filling station don't work, so no fuel, no fuel means no deliveries to the stores, so no food. no automatic doors, no elevators, no traffic lights, no ATM's so no money and card readers wont work either , fridges and freezers go off so food spoils, no central heating not even gas because the controls are electric, the internet goes down and mobile phones cant be recharged.
    the modern world would cease to function without electricity.
    we can all manage the little events and even some bigger ones but once the power goes down CIVILisation ceases to be.
    which is why we prepare.
     
  2. Old Geezer

    Old Geezer Master Survivalist
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    The power going down is most assuredly at the top of the list of chaos triggers -- especially in major urban areas and especially if the power STAYS off. We here in a small town in the American Southeast / Southern Appalachia had the power go out for a couple of days two weeks ago. This made a lot of folk unhappy, however one could hear people's generators running, see the chimneys sending smoke into the sky. My house was prepped, of course.

    The cities could not endure such for a week or more. Indeed, it doesn't take much. Doesn't take much at all.

    Paris is burning. No I'm not talking about voguing in the 1990s. The streets of the French capital city are filled with protesters and cars are being burned. Why? The price of fuel just went up in France.

    https://duckduckgo.com/?q=paris+rio...+price&t=h_&atb=v140-1__&iax=images&ia=images

    Nationalism vs. open borders, socialism vs. capitalism, one race vs. another, ..., you name it, things are getting ready to blow. No blasting cap is needed, just the flicking of matches.
     
  3. Keith H.

    Keith H. Moderator Staff Member
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    And as if that lot is not enough, the crime rate soars! No lighting in the cities at night makes it a very dangerous place to be! Time to get the hell out of there as soon as you can.
    Keith.
     
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  4. Ystranc

    Ystranc Master Survivalist
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    Thinking back to the 70's and the blackouts and rolling brownouts caused by the unions and socialist government we were far less dependent on the grid then we are now.
     
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  5. Old Geezer

    Old Geezer Master Survivalist
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    In the USA, the suburbs are seeing hyper-violent home invasions by carloads of hoodlums predating out of the inner cities. British cities have more home invasions in that the citizens are disarmed making it possible for large healthy hoodlums to break into the homes of the elderly, single mothers, and the handicapped. Here in the states we often read, "Grandmother, age 83, shoots burglar." True, in England, home-owners get stabbed (ex. George Harrison formerly of the band The Beatles), however there are fewer rape and murder invasions than are being seen here in American megalopolises. Another "however", those recently migrating into England come from countries where hyper-violence is the norm and among these immigrants are gang members, militia members, and the religious zealots.

    Note that we are theoretically in good times. When the power grid goes down and stays down .... When the groceries and little marketplaces are emptied of food .... When it royally hits the fan, what civilization currently exists will fly apart. Break a timing chain on a large engine at high RPM and that's that. Not gonna be pretty.
     
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2018
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  6. Keith H.

    Keith H. Moderator Staff Member
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    Australia now:
    Common assaults are up by 28 per cent, sex offences by 33 per cent while home invasions have soared by 43 per cent. That means a home invasion occurs every two hours, 28 minutes and 37 seconds.

    24th Nov 2018.

    Keith.
     
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  7. Old Geezer

    Old Geezer Master Survivalist
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    Holy crap, Batman! :eek:

    Goes to show that it's all "going to hell in a hand-basket" everywhere. If these aren't the "end days" what is?!

    Within "civilization" there no longer exists any belief that we are possessed of a soul; a soul capable of transcendence and eternal life. People only live to eat, sleep, reproduce, and grunt. People have turned into cattle and cattle are easily stampeded.
     
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  8. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    That is sad! Crime rates in Texas cities are falling. 2016 was an all time low. As the rights t o carry and use guns has been growing and the number of Texas Citizens choosing to carry guns has risen the crime rate has fallen. People here understand that gun control only protects criminals and makes honest people into victims. When they first opened the door to personal concealed and open carry of handguns the liberals predicted that there would be road rage shootings all over the place. As far as I can find there has not been even ONE. Good honest people that take the time to take the classes and act in a responsible manner are just not the kind that are likely to use those weapons indiscriminately. They Have been used to protect and save several people and stop a lot of crimes.

    The power that used to be a convenience has now become almost like air to our culture and lifestyle. Sadly most people now don't know the difference between life STYLE and life itself. We are addicted to our comforts, feasts, cars and fancy things none of which is actually necessary. When the power goes off the world will be ENDED to a lot of people and they will just lay down and die.
     
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2018
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  9. Keith H.

    Keith H. Moderator Staff Member
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    My belief also Tex.
    Keith.
     
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  10. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    anyone who buys a new house in the UK these days its all electric, no fireplace and no chimney, probably got radiators in each room and they shower twice a day, the electric goes off and they are stuffed and I mean really stuffed.
     
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  11. poltiregist

    poltiregist Master Survivalist
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    There has always been wars since people populated the earth . There will be more . Power grid is high on the list for attack regardless if it is cyber ,Electrical magnetic pulse , or bomb . Some folk had just rather to pretend "it will never happen to me " and continue to let the good times roll . The foolish and unprepared will simply die in a all out war .The aggressor will probably want a countries existing population to die so they can remold the conquered nation . I recently watched a documentary where Russia in the past conquered a land then sent in military troops to take away their food so the people would starve to death , millions of women children and men died of starvation .
    Those prepared to survive without electricity for just a few weeks under a similar circumstances , won't survive .
     
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  12. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    any aggressor will probably want the survivors as slaves to work the mines and the ore processing and all the other shitty jobs.
     
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  13. watcherchris

    watcherchris Master Survivalist
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    by Texdanm,


    Pretty much the same here in Virginia Texdanm..NO wild west shootouts by ordinary citizens here. However ...lots of gang type activity....and even spreading out into previously quiet suburbs.



    Though It has been some years back..I had an odd experience in a grocery store. My lady friend called me while I was a the gun club shooting my Taurus Tracker five shot bowling pin .45 ACP Revolver. I carried it on a pancake holster on my right hip to and fro the gun club.

    My lady friend was making spaghetti sauce....she makes great sauce and was short of noodles...could I stop by and pick up a couple of boxes of thin noodles for her. No problem on the way home.

    I went into the grocery store carrying open ..this 6 inch barreled Taurus Tracker...and headed for the aisle wherein are to be found the noodles.

    A couple of people began panicking....and moved off.

    I was soon approached by the security guard. To my surprise...and astonishment ...the guard asked me, upon approach, if I had a concealed carry permit. I replied that I so did and told him I was getting some thin noodles for my lady friend.

    I checked out and nodded at the security guard on the way out.

    I was a bit astonished to realize that not all people understood that this is an open carry state...and some believe you have to be in possession of a concealed carry permit to carry open.

    That was a type of wake up call about the ignorance of many people concerning open carry in this state.

    I usually carry concealed since that experience.

    However...I thoroughly enjoyed her spaghetti later that evening. She does make a great sauce...garlic bread in going with it too!!




    But it is noted that there is more two legged wildlife running about than a few years ago.....and spreading out into the burbs..

    Oh..by the way...this lady friend is an Apartment Manager and has connections with the local constabulary...and they often stop in her office and brief her on the latest trends and or fingerprints of the local to legged wildlife...and thus she fills me in on said wildlife....and it is getting more "Wild" than in years past.



    One of the local city police departments has gone to a digitally encoded/encrypted/trunked/spread spectrum radio system for their officers. It will not be received on a scanner...and the access codes can be changed daily ...in like manner to how the military regularly changes the encryption codes for their IFF transponders. ...Identification Friend or Foe.

    Fire department and or ambulance services are not encoded..but the police in certain cities only.

    A very expensive radio system....hence not all cities can afford it.

    Apparently even the two legged wildlife was getting smart and learning to use scanners.



    Also .....I have thought for some time now...that certain agencies have the ability to monitor all cell phone traffic.
    That the function of some of these towers is as an interface for monitoring ...to certain agencies....and particularly with people who use the computer function of their phones rather than a laptop or desktop.

    I also think that these new generation of cell towers....can pick up the whole radio spectrum...custom automatic frequency tuning in them. They can monitor from below the AM Broadcasting band to high up ...past the cell phone band.
    You can tell them because there is only one straight up shaft ....no triangular High Hat....with short antennas on them.
    No real proof...just my speculation considering the state of the art...
    I suspect that some of this gear is a modern commercial adaptation of older military spying technology.....only more automated.


    Remember what I keep trying to say about never being trusted with a gun....so you will never be trusted with a vote!!??

    Also ...You cannot be trusted with your children...nor your monies.....your opinions....etc etc.

    What......??? Now you cannot also be trusted with your cell phone or computer????

    "Herding???!!"




    by poltiregist

    This is what happened under Joseph Stalin..in the Ukraine.between WW1 and WW2..and few people today seem to know or understand this history. It is as if this history is not intended for people to know or remember it.

    As difficult and or uncomfortable as it can be at times...I am grateful for the Elders to have taught me some of this avoided and overlooked history.

    https://www.rferl.org/a/how-holodomor-famine-was-secretly-documented/29615511.html


    Now......Be Warned....

    This history is repeating itself today.

    One of the indexes or fingerprints of Socialist/Soviet style communism ...is the dislike and distrust of Nationalism....versus internationalism..or if you prefer...Communism.

    Nationalism ....or todays "Deplorables/pro Americans" are disliked by the left/Deep State while they push internationalist positions of the world...not America and Americanism. They are pushing on the left...more and more state control..which in it's ultimate expression is Communism....the Deep State.

    The pre Communist days....the 1840s or so....the groups meeting in Europe to lay the groundwork for Communism...were called "The Internationale"....among who's members were recorded Fredrick Engels and Karl Marx. This so seldom taught to people today in public schools such that we do not recognize history repeating itself right in front of us.

    This is repeating itself today ...right in front of us...but most people do not know this history or have never had good teachers.

    My non Ishmaelite .02,

    Watcherchris
     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2018
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  14. poltiregist

    poltiregist Master Survivalist
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    In past major wars the general population could sustain itself for months if not for years because they were basically self sufficient . Today in case of a major war the general population would brought down to their knees in a matter of hours because of their dependence on electricity . Too late then to start prepping .
     
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  15. Old Geezer

    Old Geezer Master Survivalist
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    WatcherChris: "two-legged wildlife"

    I like this term. I'm stealing it. Gonna use this myself. Sorry about the copyright violation. I'm a thief, so it goes. "Two-legged vermin," I bet somebody used that over a hundred years ago. "Varmint" in place of "vermin". Thing is, when you use a term like this, people instantly know who you are talking about. Everybody knows who the trouble-makers are. Cops go into banks and show the photos of career armed robbers who have just been paroled. The two-legged scum are well known.

    Herein may lie an irony. What if when the SHTF, things get more organized, more peaceful. What?! How?! Things go bad and law enforcement is no longer there to protect the felons (a big part of a cop's job). Oops! So now, the locals themselves "take out the trash". People who act reprehensibly, have a high risk of dropping to ambient temperature under these circumstances. One first thinks of states such as Texas and Tennessee as being where such could occur (many of the founders of Texas were from Tenn, I was raised 20 miles from where Davey Crockett was raised, Crockett family name is still here). But it sure isn't just those two states. Rural Iowa, Kansas, even further north, the locals are NOT going to put up with aggressors. Heartland Americans have a gag-reflex, they are armed, and they are NOT just going to roll over and capitulate. And millions upon millions of them are ex-military.

    https://www.johnsoncitypress.com/law-enforcement/2016/09/07/Crockett-embezzlement

    This latter-day Davey Crockett is one very honorable man. Maybe he's been too nice. The original Davey was done down by Santa Anna. Our Davey (great, great, great, ... grandson of the fellow in Tex History) was done down by his thieving secretary & a credit card. So it goes.
     
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  16. watcherchris

    watcherchris Master Survivalist
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    Olde Geezer....



    Hey Olde Geezer....no problem. I've been using it for so long that I cannot recall from whence it originated...but nonetheless....Bon Appetite as the French say....good appetite!! Share it with others...spread the wealth so to speak.



    Olde Geezer....there are places across this land ...wherein you don't go in there an act stupid or try to break bad ...as some of the city folk say.

    In some of these counties and or parishes...these people are kin...and usually from a handful of family names going way back..and many of them have married into other long standing family names.

    What's more... as I was illustrating to Texdanm..in one post...these people also happen to know all the ways into and out of these counties and parishes.
    These are hard bark people....they can be very friendly ..but don't cross them....best leave them be....

    These people ...many of them..when you are olde enough to let go of the nipple...someone is going to stick a gun or rifle in your hand and if you cannot handle it ...your going back on the nipple until you can handle it...male and female both.

    There are many olde fisherman family names up and down this coast....and been here a long time in the trade...watermen....crabbers.....Clammers....shell fish, and fishermen and the like.

    Don't mess with them....

    And so too is it across this land with certain families and names.

    And many of them ..their kin... are the local constabulary....and they know everyone in the county/parishes.



    Many of these olde guys came to work in this shipyard and were well established when I came along for employment.

    I remember one year I was loaned out to ship repair to work ocean liners to get them ready for the Christmas Season Cruises.

    On my last night of work before the shut down...I thought I would bring in a pint of Canadian Mist and share it with the olde guys. I'd been slowly and stealthily sipping on it for awhile.

    I stood next to one of the olde timers and said...."Hey...you want a drink??" Big....Mistake!!!

    He looked at that bottle and his eyes lit up and he reached for it..."Sure!!"

    He drank that stuff like I drink Iced Tea....I was stunned....and then.......

    He held it out for one of the other olde guys ..and then another and another.

    They all drank with seasons glee!!

    No way I was going to try to keep up with those olde timers from West Virginia and North Carolina.

    I got it back with about three quarters of an inch down in the bottom of the pint.

    I came to understand that a lot of those olde timers were raised on the clear stuff....this Canadian Mist was light weight to them.

    These guys did good work ..hard work....and got these ocean liners, tankers, and freighters out on time .....but they were a hard bark bunch of men...you had to hang with them on the job or they would get rid of you....didn't need or want you. You were just dead weight.

    I never forgot that about those olde timers....they taught me a lot.


    Thanks,
    Watcherchris

    Not an Ishmaelite
     
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  17. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    The problem with people adapting to a power loss now days has a lot to do with the massive change in the demographics of the population. In 1940 the rural versus urban population was near 50/50 for the entire US. In a lot of the South it was more like 80 rural and 20 urban. Now it is 25 Rural and 75 in the urban areas. The biggest change is in the south. All the familly farms are gone. Everyone is dependent on power. My familly when my Dad was a kid didn't get power until he came back from the war in 1946. People in most of the south were just not totally dependent on power as they are now.

    Even in the south in the 1940s people heated their homes with flames. Depending where you were the fuel changed but you didn't need power to stay warm. In the summer you opened the house up and lots of southern homes had sleeping porches for the summer. Your refrigeration in a lot of places was still via ice deliveries for your ICEbox. About all the power was used for was lighting and a very few things like radios and fans. Up until the 60s my wife's grandparents house had gas lighting and even after that they lit their yard with gas lights.

    The farms kept producing food and it got delivered. Now I'm not sure that would be true. At every step things are so dependent on power to get the job done. Back then the fresh food you ate came from local farms and ranches. You bought your meat from a meat market that cut up the meat right there. Now meat is shipped from all over the place and grocery stores don't do much more than put the food on the shelves.

    The "fall" now is so much farther than it was 50 years ago. Without the power to run the computers and cash registers they can't even sell what they have on hand.
     
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  18. Old Geezer

    Old Geezer Master Survivalist
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    I can't tell the whole story. Guy I worked with was factory automation software designer. He and his dairy-farming father-in-law had a lot in common. Wait .... what? .... what did they have in common?! Mr. Dairy-Farmer used a name-brand automation package for his milking machines. The precision of this equipment allowed the highest milk output from the cattle. The fellow worker helped his father-in-law to fine tune his dairy's automation process. He also help fine-tune banking systems which is also related. What?! Banks and barns and burgers and batteries and ...............

    Another angle: An entire section of the ChiCom Army (PLA) is dedicated to computer warfare. Think of them as an army of VERY professional hackers. When they run "little tests", things go wrong in other countries. Banking systems and military systems have serious protection (we have our own military IT to include defense against cyber attacks), however across this nation, the level of vulnerability is downright frightening. One SHTF scenario begins with the Chinese (or fill-in-the-blank enemy) slam-dunking as many servers in the USA as they can. In the resulting chaos, China could then pursue other military objectives or economic warfare objectives. The Achilles Heel of the West is the high level technology to which it has become addicted.

    Everyone thinks of nuclear war as being a starting point for world chaos. Truth be told, it could begin with bits and bytes.
     
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  19. poltiregist

    poltiregist Master Survivalist
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    about six months without electricity I would suspect the big cities would be a vacant and earie place perhaps skeletons laying about , I would suspect anyone there as being a cannibal . personally I will never see it and don't want to . Any one that choose to stay in such a place is probably doomed . I wish I could say something positive and up beat about their survivability but I don,t know anything good to say about it. Those that fled , their chances of surviving aren't that great either unless they have a survival retreat already established before S.H.T.F. and a water and food supply at the retreat . apparently some city dwellers think they can simply go into rural areas and steal their way to survivability. These folks are living in a unrealistic fantasy world .
     
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  20. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    When the power goes off and you know that it isn't coming back on any time soon it is a rather amazing experience. We are all somewhat slaves to the machines and don't know what to do without them at first. I have been through this sort of thing three times twice from hurricanes and once from an ice storm that took down the lines all over the place. South East Texas does not or is not supposed to have ice storms and is ill prepared for it.

    No lights, no AC or Heater, No TV or Computer. Time suddenly seems to slow down to a stand still. All the things that you normally do you suddenly probably can't do. It is QUIET in a way that you don't ever hear in normal times. When night comes it is DARK too and you live in smaller areas than you normally would. The world shrinks down to just you and what you can see. A little battery powered radio is your only contact with the larger world. The radio tells you that it is bad but not being able to see it makes it less real to you.

    Once you get over the initial surprise it is sort of peaceful. You have a lot of time on your hands and not much that you normally do is possible. For some this is going to be where they stop adapting and just get miserable and panicky. For me it became a fun time where we played cards had cook outs and got together with friends for get together and cook up what was in the freezers and have parties. I don't remember a power black out that lasted longer than 5 or 6 days that I didn't feel a little sad when the power came back on.

    I usually fire up the smoker and then the rocket stove and we make huge pots of soup and BBQ a little of everything. If In the summer we go to the lake, river, creek or pool and stay cool in the water fish and picnic. If we catch a good mess of fish I fire up my propane fish fryer and we have a fish fry. At night I light up Coleman lanterns on the porch and we play domino and listen to the radio. We run a generator enough to keep the deep freezer froze solid and maybe charge a few things but in general I keep it to a minimum. When power goes off all over the area where you live gas gets hard to find fast. I have seen times when you had to drive 50 miles to find gas and a place with power.

    In the summer power outs we sort of move outside. We set up several tents and family and friends camp out with us. In the winter we have big fires and I fire up my kerosene heaters and propane heaters. Winter in East Texas means that it is in the 50s or 60s during the day most of the time so we spend a lot of time outdoors even then. If it is after Thanksgiving we probably go hunting.

    I have led lighting and low voltage fans that run on batteries that I can keep charged when the truck is going places or if the generator is running. We love to camp and having the power go off for us is sort of like having a Staycation. (vacation where you stay home and play). I don't think that my family and friends will have much trouble adjusting and adapting if it became a forever thing. We all like to hunt, fish, shoot, garden and camp and are an extremely varied group.
     
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  21. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    I lived for 12 years without electricity of any kind, and it was calm and peaceful, but I don't think many people who are used to all their creature comforts at a click of a button could even think of living like this much less actually do it.
     
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  22. Ystranc

    Ystranc Master Survivalist
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    People say that the world is getting smaller (obviously not literally smaller but figuratively) We can easily just jet off anywhere we wish to. buy out of season food from the other side of the world or receive on demand news to suit our own tastes and preconceptions.
    If the grid went down for good I think what would surprise most people would be the speed at which their world contracted. The loss of electricity would quickly curtail travel, broadcasting of both TV and radio, the Internet, commerce....everything beyond that which is immediately accessible in a local economy might as well be on the dark side of the moon. For me the loss of refrigeration would be the most immediate set back closely followed by a need to get news of what was happening elsewhere.
     
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  23. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    when the grid goes down I think most people will be surprised at how quickly everything stops.
    locally we still have the market and I think that will still function and may even expand after the collapse, cash will be a problem once the ATM's no longer function but some barter may be possible.
     
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  24. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    Without the power and then fuel for your cars and trucks your world shrinks to a little circle about 2 to 5 miles across. It is amazingly peaceful and politics just fade away into the distance. Tending to your immediate needs is pretty simple and at least in my experience you go through a sort of decompression as your worries become more immediate and simple. The time after Rita was actually one of the nicest staycations I ever had. No power ANYWHERE meant nobody could go to work except my wife. She had friends in low places that fired up a generator at five in the morning to sell her gas. She worked at the prison in medical and got to play Doctor for two weeks. I had lots of playmates and we fished camped at home and cooked. The weather as is so common following a late in the year hurricane was glorious.

    I am very well set for at the very least the first year or 18 months. In that time the garden will grow to about an acre and a half and my fishing and hunting will take up the slack. Food won't be an issue so I plan on a LOOONG staycation where I mostly try to not attract attention and get my friends and neighbors organized. I am surrounded by country people with chickens, goats, pigs, cattle and horses. What I can offer to them is a wide battery of manual skills and close family and friends that can provide security. We include one Seal, One Green Beret and two retired military ground pounders all who are battle tested and armed to the max mostly with M14s though there are also a bunch of ARs and AKs and we all hunt so have deer rifles and a lot of shotguns. I can reload for these 308 size weapons for a long time.

    Nearly everything that I do has a nonpowered back up. I have all the power tools but also have a huge collection of the old type manual tools and know how to use and maintain them.
     
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  25. JimLE

    JimLE Expert Member
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    longest I've been without power.is 3 days.even then,that was during the summer.and 6 miles out of town.i did pretty great during that time.id still do pretty great if i was still living there.on account id be using a gas heater. electricity or not.now im in town.due to my financial says so.central heat now.ive checked it out.in which i can hook a gas heater to that gas line.after disconnecting the central heat from it..and stay warm if i need to.but as for the ones that live close by.their up a creek,if they dont have someplace to go.
     
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  26. poltiregist

    poltiregist Master Survivalist
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  27. poltiregist

    poltiregist Master Survivalist
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    Texdamn I am simply curious at what point would they turn those prisoners lose on your area when power is lost? Are would the guard simply walk off with the keys and leave them to starve . The guards pay checks if they got one would be worthless . This scenario would play out not just for your area but wherever prisoners are kept . I am sure they have a backup plan but I suspect that plan is to move them to another facility . If the entire nation or planet is in an apocalyptic situation , what then? No doubt they have electrical generators but they would eventually run out of fuel .
     
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  28. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    Most they would probably release but the ones in the Max and super max places would probably die there. My wife worked in the prison system for 25 years and that was a question that I also had. She asked a warden one time while they were at a unit party and that is what he told her was the plan.

    Understand, 60 percent of the people in the prisons are there for what I consider a treatable illness. Drug addiction is a treatable illness! If nothing else GIVE them their damn drugs so they don't have to rob and deal to support their habit. Another 30 percent are people that made mistakes and bad choices but are not really bad people. That last ten percent though should be put down and even considering turning them out EVER is insanity. They are amoral monsters that kill without remorse for even trivial reasons. It has always bothered me that they will release some of these monsters straight out of the super max. If you can't function in a prison you are never going to be able to deal with the free world.

    Prison is nothing like they show it on TV either the good or the bad. The murder rate in prison is a lot lower than ANY city of a similar population. Almost everybody works and has a job. They eat well and have a lot of things to do in their off time. Mostly if a convict acts like a civilized human being they are treated mostly as one within the boundaries of what security can allow. Thousands live in trustee units that are sort of like dorm living. The 4 strand barbed wire fence in front of one in town only goes across the front and then just stops. You can walk right around the end of it. It is only there to mark a boundary and make the civilians feel better.

    In 25 years my wife never had a single inmate try and hurt her. She never was afraid and actually misses her "guys". She retired from the top max unit in Texas where death row is housed so it wasn't like she was dealing with the most gentle guys. Inmates are classified into 6 or 7 levels of security from the trustees that you couldn't run off if you tried to the super max and death row that only leave their cells in shackles and with two guards. Most units have some of all levels. The inmates keep the grounds and cook and clean and work in all the industries and shops. When an inmate stands in front of you everything you see that isn't skin probably was made from the ground up by the system.

    They raise cotton that is then ginned spun into thread, woven into fabric and sewn into their clothing. At one time the same was true of their leather boots that started out as cattle. They grow all their own food. Mow and maintain the grounds and equipment and they even make their mattresses sheets and blankets. I sleep every night on a king sized mattress made in prison.

    The industries are huge. They make all of the stainless steel stuff for the kitchens in the schools and universities. They repair and rebuild the school buses for the entire state. They make license plates for several states and do most of the printing for the state. They fix cars, trucks, lawn mowers, farm equipment and most anything else that is used by the prison AND will fix your stuff as well for the cost of the parts if you work for or are retired from the system. They do all the wood work for the desks and court room furniture and do amazing work refinishing antique furniture. They build the chairs used in schools and state offices... it is amazing what all they do.

    My best friend runs one of the chair factories. His guys work hard and learn a lot. Several have gone on into the free world and make a good living doing upholstery from the training they got in his factory. All the things that they do except maybe some of the farm work is also job skill training. Even some of the farm stuff is good skill training though because they slaughter and butcher all their own meat and also raise and train hundreds of horses for use by the guards and are trained and sold to police departments all over the US. It you try to pull a rider off a trained horse the horse will stomp you. They will stay under the rider and the harder you pull the more the horse stomps you. You can shoot from their backs and they are not bothered by crowds or much of anything.

    WE are a prison familly. My daughter works for the system. She started on a unit in the commissary and now is an accountant in charge of purchasing and sales. We have no concerns about the prisons. Most if turned loose will leave as fast as they can run. You have to understand, from their point of view nearly everyone in the area is SOME kind of cop!!
     
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  29. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    UK prisons are a lot different, there is a lot of violence in the Category A the top classification prisons and a lot of radicalisation goes on amongst the Moslem convicts, prison dosent make them better people in fact they are worse when they come out and go straight back to crime, mind you you've got to be pretty bad and do lots of crime before you see the inside of a prison the law is so lax in the UK, they get lots of chances before they ever get prison time.
     
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  30. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    The violent inmates are segregated and never in contact with other people without full shackles. 23 hours a day they are in a box with no windows and if they are good once a day they get to go into a box alone where they can see the sky. They all work. If your choice was a box or a job what would you want to do? The majority of them are just people. They get off the drugs and as long as they are in the system they stay mostly clean. They are not worked really hard like the old days. If it is to hot or too cold they bring them in and they chill out. They play a lot of baseball and Basket ball and burn up a lot of energy working out. Their are some fights but no more than any group of men pushed together in close quarters. There is some gang activity but if you are identified or caught doing gang things you get to sit in a box and lose all of your privileges. Amazingly a lot of them learn to live happily in prison. It may be the first time in their lives that they knew that they were going to be fed, clothed and medically cared for.
     
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  31. Old Geezer

    Old Geezer Master Survivalist
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  32. watcherchris

    watcherchris Master Survivalist
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    It is not just the fuel tax...though the fuel tax was the straw breaking the back of the Camel.

    This has been going on in France for some time now...rising costs..ie..inflation...government borrowing ...or printing to meet financial obligations ...and thus buying out of the private economy....leaving less for the working public...and at higher competitive prices.

    The Fuel hidden Carbon Tax is only the opening straw breaking this camels back.

    It is all across the economic spectrum in France.

    I can remember years back when anyone with any economic potential was leaving France to places wherein the cost of living was more stable and taking their property including monies to this new location...anywhere but France. These people were ahead of the curve of what was coming.

    This is also the long term plan for America ....economic collapse....via inflation.

    Though it has been years ago.....I have read an understood certain aspects of John Maynard Keynes book..."The Economic Consequences of the Peace" about what happened in Germany after WW1 leading to the hyper inflation.


    Thanks,
    Watcherchris

    Not an Ishmaelite
     
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  33. poltiregist

    poltiregist Master Survivalist
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    It wasn't that long ago Venezuela's leader was bragging about their great government system and how prosperous they were . They went down fast, people there now eating dogs and cats. I am not making a prediction but see no reason France as well as some other European countries couldn't follow Venezuela's collapse . They could fall like dominoes .
     
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  34. poltiregist

    poltiregist Master Survivalist
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    To be fair we are also seeing the people of south and central America countries besides Venezuela in dire straits . hoards of people in that area of the planet desperately trying to survive by fleeing their countries .
     
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  35. watcherchris

    watcherchris Master Survivalist
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    Was on my ham radio earlier today around 5 pm and speaking with my friend out in Tennessee some 400 miles to the west of me...here on the Chesapeake Bay.

    They are having snow, about 11 inches, out there and the electricity is and has been out for most of the day.



    He has built a new well on his property and enclosed it in a cinderblock housing and with a roof. It is heated to above freezing.

    But in this same cinderblock house he has installed his backup generator...a large one capable of running most of his house...his well pump ...and other needs on his property.

    He was on generated electricity when I spoke to him via two way radio.

    He has prepped well for this. Not only electricity ..but food and water too.

    He is in a hollow...but up on the side of a mountain...and it is a trip in bad weather to get down the mountain.

    Fortunately he has enough supplies for a couple of weeks...without needing to go down the mountain.

    By then the weather should have eased up.


    Most of this weather has gone to the north and east of us here on the Chesapeake bay...fortunately.


    Thanks,

    Watcherhris

    Not an Ishmaelite
     
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  36. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    I paid $1.85 a gallon for gas the other day. Our gas prices are going to have to drop here so that they can empty some tanks to put the home heating fuels. I suspect that our globally warmed winter this year may be a beast! It may be getting warmer some place but it isn't warmer in East Texas for sure.

    We have a price drop every year this time of year. So they can get ahead on the home heating fuel production before winter goes into high gear.

    The government needs to let the power go off a little so that people MIGHT wise up a little and have a few things prepared. I doubt that it would help but even without a world ending catastrophe the systems here in the US are getting old and are going to cause us more trouble in the future. All of our infrastructure is getting a little raggedy. We need to spend more on our infrastructure and a LOT less on providing a high life standard for the Illegal Aliens and the people that are too lazy to work.
     
  37. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    $1.85 a gallon? I pay £1.30 for a LITRE of petrol diesel is a few pence more(5 litres in a gallon).
     
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  38. poltiregist

    poltiregist Master Survivalist
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  39. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    that's "renta mob" at work.
     
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  40. poltiregist

    poltiregist Master Survivalist
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    Days later and it's only getting worse in France .Looks eerily similar to what the world witnessed when Venezuela began it's collapse . Britain set ready to follow the pattern as people become more angry over the Brexit issue .
     
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  41. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    the ones getting angry are the leave voters as they can see a second vote being forced on them, even though they were told this would never happen, it was supposed to be a 1 in a generation vote.
    but that's modern politics for you, got more u turns than a heavy goods drivers route map.
     
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  42. watcherchris

    watcherchris Master Survivalist
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    You could easily see the scam being pulled and maneuvered to get around the Brexit vote...many months back.

    The English Government has sold the soul of the English people...long long ago..and so too and in like manner the French have sold their peoples souls.

    A non representative government.


    There is similar going on here in America with our "Deep State." A government representing someone ..just not the American People.

    Most Americans do not know nor will they ever be taught exactly what the "Deep State " is nor the true history of America and to whom our government owes allegiance...and it is not the American People.

    My non Ishmaelite .02.

    Watcherchris
     
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  43. poltiregist

    poltiregist Master Survivalist
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    French leader Macron just came out of hiding and made a speech . Promised people to give more money at the end of this year . Also promising lower taxes . So either he is lying again or he is going to crank up printing presses to print worthless money . Printing money with no backing is direct inflation. Their economy will almost certainly spiral down into the toilet if he cranks up the printing press . I will sit back and watch to see if the French people are stupid enough to buy into this . There are things that could be done to help their government but throwing printed paper at people isn't one .
     
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  44. poltiregist

    poltiregist Master Survivalist
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    Is this normal price for diesel there ? If so this has got to be putting a tremendous burden on people not only for transportation but trucked in food .
     
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  45. Old Geezer

    Old Geezer Master Survivalist
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    "Whoever owns the guns, makes the rules."
     
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  46. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    yes its the normal price, you pay more if you use a service station on the motorways, but this is normal price where I live. you HAVE to have a vehicle out here in the sticks, most places in rural areas don't have a bus service so a car isn't a luxury its a necessity.
     
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  47. watcherchris

    watcherchris Master Survivalist
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    Excellent point and well stated poltiregist....well said!!!

    Macron is paid for just as was and is Merkel...and so too many of what passes for leadership here in America.

    When Merkel passes the torch ..she will pass it to another bought and paid for puppet.

    Macron's speech is just placating the populace to buy time.

    Macron ..as a bought and paid for puppet has no choice in what he will do...or the road he must be made to take.


    If you do a careful read in the history of the UK..surrounding a fellow named Winston Spencer Churchill...no one particularly wanted him before WW2....but once they realized they had verily messed things up for the UK...someone put him into office.

    And when they had reached their WW2 goals and purposes....you see Winston Spencer Churchill fading into oblivion until his death.

    They used him to reach a goal...then had no use for him.

    This was also the case here in America with Woodrow Wilson..and later...Franklin Delano Roosevelt.

    Abraham...Lincoln ...like Trump, and also like Kennedy, turned out to be a wild card...they could not quite control them.

    Maneuver them on occasion ..yes..but not quite control them.

    Let us see if history repeats itself.


    Watcherchris,

    Not an Ishmaelite
     
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  48. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    nobody has Statesmen or women anymore, nowadays they are merely Politicians, and you cant trust a single one of them.
     
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  49. watcherchris

    watcherchris Master Survivalist
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    I remember many many years ago...being a pirate radio operator ...and bootlegging a call to a fellow in a place called Mol, Belgium. I spoke with a fellow named Rudi....who spoke good English.

    One of the conversations we had was about fuel prices. I thought fuel prices here in America were high. What Rudy did for me was convert the price per gallon in Belgium Francsto Dollars.

    Here in America we were paying a bit over a dollar a gallon for gasoline. When Rudi broke down Belgian Francs to dollars..it worked out that they were paying back then in the late 1970s or early 1980s...some $3.80 per gallon.
    That cured me of complaining about the price of fuel here in America.

    We still have it much better fuel wise than in most nations.


    That was an eye opener for which I will not forget.

    Watcherchris,
    Not an Ishmaelite
     
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  50. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    what I am currently paying for fuel would equate to over $8 per gallon!!!
     
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