Why Some People Still Think Climate Change Isn’t Real

Discussion in 'Climate Change' started by Keith H., Oct 9, 2019.

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  1. Pragmatist

    Pragmatist Master Survivalist
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    Good morning Duncan,

    Impressed with Vice Chair Az Libertarians ! Very good.

    ...

    Of course the opposite of Trump & Co. - the real "Eastern Establishment" - is the post WWII follow-on to FDR known as the Rockefeller Republicans. The rest failed; the challengers from "out West" : Goldwater, Nixon, Reagan....the south LBJ, Carter,

    Trump is disestablishing the welfare state. I am sure Social Security will be "means-tested" and fade from the scene. The ERA will pass and young women will be in a draft program to clean up the environment and other matters. The bloated military is already useless for the next confrontation.

    I am impressed with Team Trump challenging the funeral industry and the high cost of dying. Never understood why embalming was needed nor costing so much.

    I am impressed with the Trump admin. seeking to have college/university endowments pay the defaulted student debt. Plus, they want to tax the endowments. The Senator from Massachusetts is lost on this one.

    Our Navy's chief admiral is Pratt and Whitney.

    The Pentagon is run by Rayethon (Trump had to hire him-a political tradeoff).

    Closing the useless WWII era military bases is like closing down a welfare program: difficult. Carter even opened up a new one: Kings Bay, Georgia - just when Cecil Field and Mayport, Jacksonville area were phasing out.

    Who knows what the future holds ?
     
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  2. Duncan

    Duncan Expert Member
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    Here's my suggestion:
    1. Get the hell out of Tidewater with all those communistsliberals;
    2. Move out to southern Idaho where there's only one communistliberal left;
    3. Pick up ten acres down the road; and
    4. Raise goats and chickens!
    We can set up an overlapping field of fire between the properties (pragmatically, of course) and fight off the looters and the gummint.
    --Duncan
     
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  3. Pragmatist

    Pragmatist Master Survivalist
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    Good morning Duncan,

    Tidewater is one big Pentagon check - rapidly shrinking.

    When planning for retirement, one of the places on my list was near your early childhood home. We researched Koror, Palau. Got stuck here because kids working on Capitol Hill, Swamp.

    I have a hunch, less NAVSTA NORVA and a little of the support areas, Tidewater will revert to a federal wilderness preserve.
     
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  4. Caribou

    Caribou Expert Member
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    Why do you despise President Trump?
     
  5. watcherchris

    watcherchris Master Survivalist
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    Climate change..is an attempt to return back to "Absolute Power or sometimes called Divine Right of Kings"

    All this under the guise of an "Emergency."


    What Climate change will become is population Control...cradle to grave....World wide Herding.



    Remember.....this....back when Quintus Fabius Maximus....ran from the battle of Cannae...he declared before the Roman Senate....

    "You must give me all power to save Rome from Hannibal."

    And the Senate did it.

    Hannibal ran around Italy for 20 years looting and pillaging. But they never looted the property of the Senators.

    And the legions did not stop him.

    Hannibal finally got his whole army out of Italy and back to Carthage....and again the Legions did not stop him.


    Remember ….FDR and the Federal Government got our Gold under the guise of an Emergency.


    How many tolls get put up on roads and bridges and never are removed...???



    History tells some interesting tales if you know much of it...




    But how about those Kardashians!!??? NFL....NASCAR...NBA??


    Ever wonder why so few people know much history now days????


    My Non Ishmaelite .02,
    Watcherchris
     
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  6. watcherchris

    watcherchris Master Survivalist
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    Been thinking about this by Pragmatist...on page one of this thread...


    As part of climate change absolute power...divine right of kings....government should have the absolute authority and power to force people to take the flu shot...against their will and over their objections.....Herded.


    Sounds good to me. Logical and reasonable..


    My non Ishmaelite .02,
    Watcherchris
     
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  7. poltiregist

    poltiregist Master Survivalist
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    I to would be interested in knowing the answer to this question .
     
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  8. watcherchris

    watcherchris Master Survivalist
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    I have been watching this Trump business for some time and have formed an opinion...on it.

    The members here do not have to buy into it.



    The give away and or tell tale of what is going on is the labeling and name calling of Trump and anyone who follows and or approves of Trump.

    Standard radical leftist progressive. socialist, communist technique...is...….



    That whenever you cannot keep up with or out perform someone else's accomplishments and or deeds...ridicule them ...criticize them, down play.....label them...with all sorts of derogatory labels...shame them.

    Trump is a racist, a sexist, a homophobe....and this or that or this or that...ad nausea.....over and over and over.

    Hitler...that is the big one and the tell tale. Hitler is a name used'/misused today to prevent thinking for yourself. Whenever someone uses the name/label "Hitler" you are supposed to stop thinking for yourself and automatically cede all your beliefs and get on the bandwagon....and cheer for those using the label "Hitler."

    I have lived long enough to see "Hitler" used/misused all too often whenever politics needs to manufacture the next bad guy.

    After all ...they used the name Hitler...what more can be said...subject closed...no thinking allowed...they used "Hitler!!"

    Be Warned about the label "Hitler."



    People who are easily emoted are all to often put on this blame game template. Thinking people are not.


    This is a very popular technique of people whose standard technique is subversion of that which they cannot overtake by accomplishments.


    The problem with Trump ..in both phony political parties in this country ...is that Trump operates more often as an Independent rather than a Republican. And this is not to be tolerated in a rigged two party system.


    Trump is willing to put America and Americans first ….and not the two party phony system first.


    This is to me what the phony MSM will not tell you ...including and especially the fabled Fox News.


    Trump and company is not the first group for whom I have seen this kind of labeling and or guilt and shame maneuvering...

    Others who have tried to awaken the public have suffered the same modus operande..

    Labeled all kinds of names and brands....and if that is not enough …..question their fitness for their position in public.

    Spread rumors about their marriage et al....go after their kids...



    These are to me the tell tale signs of someone or some group out there who cannot win or overcome by playing by rules...of civility or even their accomplishments...they must needs sneak in the back door.....without being seen or known. They are subversive...in their operations.


    Problem is that today they are getting caught.....they have played this re run too many times .and I believe more and more of the public is catching on to them with disgust....they are turning the public off ...because they cannot get things done...but must subvert the accomplishments of others who can get things done.


    They cannot get things done because the only program they know how to run is of " The Fallen"......Chaos.


    They are "Ishmaelites" whos major M. O. is to put others into bondage and involuntary servitude.


    My non Ishmaelite .02,
    Watcherchris
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2019
    1. Dalewick
      Spot on!
       
      Dalewick, Nov 7, 2019
  9. Pragmatist

    Pragmatist Master Survivalist
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    Good afternoon Watcherchris,

    In contemporary USA, if a family member gets the flu, the children will likely get the flu also. There are implications, complications and costs external to the family.

    It's a current matter similar to Hanson's Disease (Leprosy), TB, ...

    If someone's assigned to watch the drawbridge and passes out from pneumonia, the population will have to defend against the barbarians at the gate.

    Recall that on the historical timeline, the Kings acknowledged that they did not have Divine Rights. They announced that even they were subject to trial by a jury of peers. It was clarified, however, that none of the noblemen with the muddy boots from Runnymede were the peers of the King.

    Meanwhile, back at the House of Parliament...............
     
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  10. Duncan

    Duncan Expert Member
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    Because I believe he's a pathological liar, exhibiting just about every sociopathic symptom mentioned in the handbook of psychopathology.

    As someone whose first 400 million dollars were from his daddy’s gifts, who bankrupted several casinos (how can you bankrupt a casino!!??), and someone who has stiffed hundreds of his subcontractors, he’s a failure as a businessman.

    As a serial polygamist (marry #1, cheat on her with #2, marry #2, cheat on her with #3...you get the picture) who talks about how nice it’d be to screw his own daughter if the weren’t related to him and chasing every skirt available, he’s a failure as a husband.

    He lacks any understanding whatsoever of what morality is equating “good” with whatever he does and “bad” as anyone who doesn’t agree with him.

    He’s unable to differentiate between the Constitution of the United States and a roll of toilet paper, as can be seen by his suggestions to jail people who disagree with him, calling our supposedly free press the “enemies of the people”, and having his actions routinely overruled by the courts as unconstitutional.

    He’s so incredibly insecure that he has to lash out at his betters, including Senators who knew right from wrong and called him on his views, including fellow Republicans.

    He’s a cowardly draft-dodger.

    He has betrayed our faithful allies, such as the Kurds and long-time European allies, in favor of currying favor with anyone who he thinks can fatten his own private fortune or defeat his political opponents.

    He has made himself and our country as a laughing-stock of the civilized world, and should be adjudged by his vice president and cabinet as completely unfit for the presidency and booted out under the rules of the 25th Amendment.

    Other than that, I'm sure he's just a peachy guy.
     
    1. Dalewick
      Did you by chance, miss the Obama years?

      Just from observation. If Trump was as evil and incompetent as claimed by the media, liberals and most democrats, they would love him, instead of hate him. Far as I could tell, that's why they didn't mind George W. Bush.

      Dale
       
      Dalewick, Nov 7, 2019
  11. poltiregist

    poltiregist Master Survivalist
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    I appreciate your honest feedback . We disagree on most everything on this issue . Apparently we are getting our information from different sources .
     
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  12. Pragmatist

    Pragmatist Master Survivalist
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    Good morning Duncan,

    I'm in agreement with much of your Trump basics listed above (but not the adjectives like "pathological" - better word IMO is calculated; Constitution has been in abeyance since the Supremes' Brandeis and Cardozo; "cowardly" draft dodger?? Clinton and B43 were fearless draft-dodgers ?).

    Again, I'm in - BASIC - agreement with the basic facts and believe you're really just describing the post Eisenhower years. The economy-sized aspirin bottle with content consumed by Marilyn Monroe in the JFK White House and the Excelsior Hotel, Little Rock, Arkansas serving as Governor Clinton's supply room brothel must be added to the Trump wife collection. Henry VIII wasn't evil !

    How can a court declare something unconstitutional when the overall judiciary has been converted, de facto, into a legislative body ? Recall the 1973 Roe-Wade abortion legislation. Recall the San Francisco 9th circus court of appeals. I still can't figure out what is and is not "insider trading". Lenin and the Frankfurt school are envious.

    Trump's inherited wealth, JFK's inherited wealth, Carter's welfare checks (USDA peanut subsidies), are merely different sized gifts from the system.

    "Behind every great fortune there is a crime." BALZAC

    Now, one completely different view:

    Trump is really respected - and feared - throughout the "civilized" world. The US is far weaker in military and economic terms than the US knows about. Yet, Trump and his administration have leveraged the US strengths that have placed the US on the top of the pile. I concede that we could get knocked off the top - but it would be from domestic enemies of Trump and not the foreign powers.
     
  13. Caribou

    Caribou Expert Member
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    Boy, I really don't know where to start. He's a liar? I haven't seen anything to suggest that. He has kept more promises than any politician that I'm aware of.

    As for his love life, I couldn't care less. His second wife certainly knew what she was buying, and all subsequent wives. If I want a priest I'll go to church. I want a president that works for America and he does. He has accomplished more for America than any president in my life.

    He doesn't lash out so much as he strikes back. as far as being insecure I doubt that anyone that is insecure could put up with the constant attacks and accomplish all that he has. Many are looking at some serious jail time, or at the very least going down in flames politically. They will fight and lie about him. He promised to drain the swamp and the swamp creatures will do everything they can to prevent that.

    I think he has brought honour back to the White House. He isn't bowing to anyone. barry wasn't met when he landed in China and had to use the built in stairs of Airforce One. President Trump got met with a red carpet an Xi.
     
  14. randyt

    randyt Master Survivalist
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    when it comes to politicians, I don't give a crap. Left right or whatever all they care about is looting the people and lining their pockets. They promise to steal from one and give to another, for votes and in the process skim money off the top. I don't buy into fairy tales.
     
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  15. CountryGuy

    CountryGuy Expert Member
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    so can anyone "precisely" tell me the sea temps and weather patterns, year to year in 200 year blocks, for the following points in history - 5ooo years ago; 10,000 years ago; 50,000 years ago; 500,000 years ago and say 1,000,000 years ago. I'll wait while you put together the info...

    Trying to say what tiny bit of data we have collected in the maybe 2oo years is in any way scientifically significant and viable is absurd when compared to the totality of time this planet has existed. If we think of the history of planet earth in terms of a timeline represented by 1 mile long road, the amount of time "recorded" history goes back is what, at best 3000 years? Modern weather "monitoring" is maybe at best 150 years, I'll give you 200 though it's limited and not global. So on our mile long road that 3000 years maybe is .1mm of distance, so our 200 years is like what .03mm? not much of the picture. guess another analogy would be like trying to put together a 5000 piece puzzle but only having 2 pieces to it.

    Now, do we have an impact on our immediate surroundings, most definitely. Here is a simple question for you. So CO2 is to be the scourge of the planet and we have to figure out ways to reduce it, tax it, sequester it, blah blah blah... OK. What is the solution? OK now what is the simplest solution? Come on now, I bet you all learned this little fact like I did back when you were 6 or 7. What do trees "breath"? I'll wait why you think back... Hmmm.... so the solution might be pretty damn simple. How about instead of everyone having their Trugreen/ Chemlawn yards, we instead cover them with trees. Trees of all kinds but a good chunk in nut and fruit bearing. Those crops could be made to help feed and fuel the world. Much like chestnut trees did just over a 125 years ago before they were wiped out in our infinite "wisdom" to save them. Like the elm, we cut them down, all of them, More ill conceived human intervention. If these trees had been allowed to die off, thru natural selection there would have been ones that survived, that we adapted and resistant. Those surviving trees could have been used to repopulate the populations. But instead we killed all of them... Great well thought out environmental lobby of the day results.

    Think about if only 1% of the world or a nation planted just 10 trees in a year. Take the US, 1% of our population is roughly 3,272,000. So times 10 would be 32,720,000 trees planted a year. Now with world population at 9.9 billion, that same scenario would result in almost 1 billion tress a year being planted, so what if people plant 100 trees? what if instead of 1% it's 5% or 10%. Think that many trees might suck up a lot of CO2? Put out a lot of O2? Would they not "sequester" billions of tons of carbon in the form of wood and leaf litter?
     
  16. poltiregist

    poltiregist Master Survivalist
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    I have wondered why the vast treeless plains area of the U.S. has not been planted in trees . It has been my understanding the plains were created by early Native Americans burning it off in huge wildfires to attract buffalo into their area . Probably at least on occasion was considered good fun to start a wild fire upwind of an rival Indian village and watch them run from the flames . Perhaps there is a reason the plains have not been planted in trees that I am not aware of . I am sure other countries also have similar areas .
     
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  17. CountryGuy

    CountryGuy Expert Member
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    Can't say I ever heard that portion of the story. I always understood them to be naturally occurring and for the most part kept that way for millennia due to the massive herds and migration patterns of the buffalo. I find it funny when the enviros point to cows as the source of unheard of methane "discharges". Really, how much gas would have 100 million buffalo farts produced?

    Honestly we do need those cattle or buffalo roaming all about to help in building soil like only ruminants can do.
     
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  18. watcherchris

    watcherchris Master Survivalist
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    Wow Pragmatist.....Wow!!


    Not sure mamy in America know what came out of the Frankfurt schools...to change America..or what happened in many nations in Europe about 1848 and still felt today.


    Well said...well said!!!


    Watcherchris
    Not an Ishmaelite.
     
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  19. watcherchris

    watcherchris Master Survivalist
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    Dalewick,


    Was thinking the same as I read Duncan's post and would also throw in the Clintons.

    I don't trust the Republicans nor the Democrats. I think they are the same party and get disgusted with the Republicans for their silence on many things when they could be teaching the public what is really going on ...they are all too often silent ...making me think the Republicans are not conservatives.but really Democrat Lite.

    We are being bounced back and forth between two phony political parties designed to look as if it was a real contest.

    And I suspect many Americans are catching on but not finding a voice either in the parties or through the MSM...all of the MSM.

    And these phonies are latching on to Climate Change for the ultimate herding scam...world wide.
    They cannot wait to turn over our form of government to the UN...who cannot even maintain their own building without excessive breast feeding from the public purse.

    They will have us breast feeding the whole world by entitlement ...and coming in last place in our own country.

    Just like Englishmen today...Frenchmen too...last place in their own country. Subjects ..not Citizens...

    My non Ishmaelite .02,
    Watcherchris
     
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  20. Pragmatist

    Pragmatist Master Survivalist
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    Good afternoon Watcherchris,

    Don't know what's most appropriate; "Danka" or "Thank you" or "Speceba".

    America's branch of the Frankfurt School was housed in the New School For Social Research, Greenwich Village, Manhattan, NYC. Circa / after the Vietnam War, they had a name change to "New University".

    To watch the place, "they" planted as the New University's President, retired Nebraska US Senator Bob Kerry - similar name to Massachusetts' US Senator -later US SecState (Think of the Iran nuclear deal) -. Bob Kerry of Nebraska was a USN brown water commando in Vietnam and lost a leg. The Massachusetts Senator probably lost his 8mm movie camera.

    A guarantee: Most Americans.......much more than "many" do not even know the significance of "1848" and what it signifies. They never will know nor care. All they want is brew and chips. Unfortunately for these folks, ......

    the party's over.
     
  21. Dalewick

    Dalewick Master Survivalist
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    CG, actually America plants approximately 1.6 Billion trees per year, with about half of that number being planted by the commercial lumber industries. I did bear and porcupine control out west in areas that companies like Weyerhaeuser replant hundreds of thousands of trees after they have harvested the timber. Much of this is done because the seeds of many conifers require fire to begin there life cycles and burning out west isn't publicly favorable. Most commercial timber farms operate on a 60 to 70 year crop rotation cycle (not your typical corn or soybean rotation. LOL!) and have business plans that are in the hundreds of years.

    That is a big difference in the farming of conifers and eastern hardwoods. Hardwoods stump sprout when harvested and can create there own forest. The American Chestnut also grew this way. I still know where old chestnut stumps are and they still try to grow trees. They grow to about 4 inches in diameter (about 25 to 30 feet tall) and then the blight kills them. It amazes me that even after 100 years, there is still enough life in those stumps to send up sprouts. There is hope for the American chestnut though. They have developed a blight resistant variety and they are doing well. I have one planted in my yard with 3 more planned for in the spring.

    Sorry for rambling on. It's the biologist in me.

    Dale
     
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  22. watcherchris

    watcherchris Master Survivalist
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    Pragmatist,

    Let me see if we are on the same page as concerns the 48ers....

    The term for which I know is concerning the attempted revolution in Europe which took place in 1848 and failed. Many of these revolutionaries had to flee Europe and came to America ...settling in the mid western states.

    These revolutionaries became known here as the 48ers..

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forty-Eighters


    Knowledge of this event in Europe is hardly covered here nor that the survivors of this failed attempted revolution had to flee and many came here to America.


    Also seldom heard or known by most Americans is the Frankfurt School.....

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frankfurt_Schools

    Makes for some interesting reading....and or knowledge of how this country came to be ...the trail of the leftists today.


    Thanks for your reply.


    Dalewick,

    My thanks for an interesting tale of what most of us seldom here about the planting of trees in this country.

    Watcherchris
    NOt an Ishmelite.
     
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  23. randyt

    randyt Master Survivalist
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    American chestnut one of our greatest resources. Somewhere I have a photo from the Unakas of a chestnut stump that is pushing 12 foot in dia.
     
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  24. Dalewick

    Dalewick Master Survivalist
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    Most Americans don't realize that most of the lower 48 states are on our 4th and 5th round of forest growth since the original forest were completely cut down. I've seen the old original pictures from the 1800;s of my home state of West Virginia and everything had been cut. The New River valley, which is now a National Wild and Scenic River had NO forest. The hills were bare and grass covered. Cattle grazed where 100 foot tall red oaks now stand. The old growth chestnuts were originally cut for lumber, for homes, barns, etc. As a kid I worked on a number of old houses that the walls were either old chestnut log construction or hand milled chestnut studs. My wife's family homestead had the original house, barn and cellar that were built from chestnut before the railroad came through. The National Park Service bulldozed and burned it up when they acquired the property for the park.

    Areas like Dolly Sods and Spruce Knob have what is today considered, unique habitat. It was actually created after the original red spruce forest had been cut and numerous wild fires had burned off all remaining vegetation and allowed severe erosion. Which exposed all of the current rock formations. The areas are once again forested in red spruce and are tourist attractions for there natural beauty. There is one area of old growth red spruce ( Gaudineer Scenic Forest, WV) still left. I believe (not positive) that it is the last original stand of Appalachian spruce forest left. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaudineer_Scenic_Area It is really something to see. To me, it even smells different than most forest.
    k31wqubeaxz4gyo0ini2.jpg
    Dolly Sods

    Our history can teach us much, if were open to it.
    hist_14log.jpg
    WV logging late 1800's


    Dale
     
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  25. Pragmatist

    Pragmatist Master Survivalist
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    Good morning Watcherchris,

    Yes, we're discussing the same material.

    The "Revolution of 1848" ... actually a series of "mini-revolutions" from the Baltic to the Med - France to the border of Russia, challenged the Metternich work products addressing the Napoleonic era. These consolidated uprisings were the Revolution of 1848 - the most widespread of uprisings until 1914.

    A key name, eclipsed by the more famous name of Metternich, was the Prussian Carl Schurz. He emigrated to the US.

    The results of the Revolution of 1848 were, superficially speaking, "minor". However, both Sardinia and Prussia got constitutions. In substance, the old order of absolutism started to change.

    I haven't heard the term "48'ers" but it could surely be a term in the history books. I'm guessing I never heard term because it could have been submerged in the California Gold Rush "49'ers" term.

    My conclusion;

    The Emperor and skilled general, Napoleon, was defeated. Yet, "Napoleon" is now an era of history. and he changed the map of Europe. The current era that the French Revolution, Napoleon and the Revolution of 1848 generated is now occurring globally.
     
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  26. watcherchris

    watcherchris Master Survivalist
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    Pragmatist....

    As far as I am concerned....the French Revolution and whomever planned and carried it out....is sometimes called "The First Scientific Revolution."

    This is a huge gaslighting deception as the French Revolution wound up killing about 20 % of the French population....which I believe was it's goal.

    This program never stopped unto today ..right now....today. It wound up in the Revolution of 1848....in Europe of which I mentioned...and many of them fled here to the USA to spread their man made crisis politic...revolution ….socialist anti American positions and many of them are operating today in our colleges and public schools.

    The failed Revolutions of 1848 wound up in Russia and was successful by October of 1917. This wound up in the killing of millions of Russians in the Civil War that follows between the whites and other factions including the Reds...'

    It also wound up eventually in the Ukraine slaughter by the 1930s....starvation...."The Holodomor."

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor


    Very few Americans know anything at all about this history ….behind socialist/Humanist revolutions.....what intelligent, educated, enlightened men do when they get power.

    And our Snowflakes are no different today.


    And I think someone is trying do this here in America...and hiding it behind their positions of entitlement...even Emergency crisis management religion.




    Climate Change Emergency and or Crisis Management Doomsday....religion has morphed out of Environmentalism….of the 1970s and 1980s...into the Emergency Herding devout Religion of today.

    What it is and is going to morph into is a return to Absolute Power or Divine Right of Kings to control and regulate every aspect of our lives...

    To override ...as planned for years...our very form of government and be substituted with a modern version of Absolute Power and or Divine Right of Kings....under the guise of this Climate Change Emergency....

    In short....Internationalism...in place of our Constitution and it's protection of our liberties and freedoms..


    Ishmaelites run wild....


    My non Ishmaelite .02,
    Watcherchris
     
  27. Pragmatist

    Pragmatist Master Survivalist
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    Good morning Watcherchris,

    It all depends on the assigned definition to "scientific". As the first, I use Martin Luther's confrontation.

    Place the "big events" on a briefing paper flip chart and then add the small events, pre,during and post the big events. Our species has always been in lethal conflict - even during "peaceful times".

    The word "socialist" changed definitions over the years and eras. With exceptions, American colleges and schools are just holding tanks for the unemployable. Other nations educate and train their populations better and at much less cost.

    NOT the Revolution of 1848 primarily influencing Russia. It was the lead-up to America's Civil War and the related smaller conflicts on the European continent west of Russia. It was the result of rapid industrialization - most especially the building of railroads. Czar Alexandria ("Czar Emancipator") freed ALL the serfs ~ 22 months prior to Lincoln's Emancipation Proclamation freeing SOME escaped slaved. Inefficient agricultural business and their labor had to give way to economic development especially with railroad building. Canals were also on the list. The Suez Canal first opened in 1869 and the Panama Canal in 1914.

    Note that Dostoyevsky's character Rastoinikov clearly presents the pending "Commissar" only 3 generations later.

    One of the "other factions" in the post Oct '17 Russian Civil War was the US Army. President Wilson sent General Graves to Vladovostok to "guard warehouses". The Secretary of War briefed Gen Graves at Kansas City. A famous line from the briefing: "You will be walking on eggshells filled with dynamite". America's Siberian Expeditionary Force would be deemed a defeat if anyone here knew about it.

    What's so important about the Holodomer is that Ukraine's nickname had been "The breadbasket of Europe".

    Yes, emergency management with the climate focus is a form of religion.

    We really don't have " Absolute Power" here in the US because of our geographic size. It's a compromise balancing act. Our Constitution is inspirational but, in reality, it's like Magna Carta: a historical document.
     
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  28. poltiregist

    poltiregist Master Survivalist
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    Different tree's have different requirements . I own seventy something acres of a lobloly pine plantation in southern Mississippi . I am presently waiting on a timber buyers offer about cutting it .I also retired from working with the Mississippi forestry Commission . I planted , marked trees for harvesting conducted control burns for the benefit of trees and tree harvesters amongst other assigned tasks such as fighting wild fires . I certainly am not an expert or even very knowledgeable on tree species that might grow on the barren plains . I just think there would be some species that would grow there . As someone else mentioned if that species was a tree that would provide human food it would be a big plus .
     
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  29. watcherchris

    watcherchris Master Survivalist
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    Wow Pragmatist,


    Science....measurement, Observation, repeatability...proven over and over by demonstration.


    Agree the word and concept has been changed for the purpose of making it more and more acceptable to overly emotional and unthinking Americans raised on a steady diet of television and movies.

    What is known and understood....proven...but totally avoided by a socialist education...is that whenever a people can keep more of what they produce...their production goes up rapidly.

    This is diametrically opposed to Socialist Wealth Redistribution and also explains why Trumps "Make America Great Again" is not liked at all by Socialist Wealth Redistributors....educated in public schools.

    I suspect that someone in Trumps group knows this about production....and keeping more of what you produce.




    Sorry Pragmatist...this is laughable...because Russia ...the great "Internationalist" social experiment went tits up...in inefficiency ….even though they were bailed out extensively by the west...over and over and over....

    For all their "Internationalist....social planning.....the Communists and or Socialists have it backwards....simply because of what I stated...

    Now contrast this with Communist/Socialist studies...

    Wealth Redistribution is not Risk Redistribution. That is the joke on publicly educated snowflakes trying to survive the next commercial break.


    [/quote][/quote]
     
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  30. Pragmatist

    Pragmatist Master Survivalist
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    Good morning Watcherchris,

    In 1901, Russia was one of the world's 5 richest nations. Starting from 1922 to 1945 / 1953 (Korea flareup), from the Baltic to the Pacific, there were Communist forms of government in place ruling a huge landmass and millions.

    Even the word "religion" has changed definitions over the decades and eras. King Saul, King David, King Solomon, King Jesus were not running a "religion". They were running a government.

    Humanism, atheism, agnosticism, Wicca, astrology, science, are all various belief systems. Some of this traces back to the availability of food supplies.

    Yes, of course, the "challenge" to our contemporary US society is the "Frankfurt School". Give a fair reading to Senator D.N.A. Pocahontas' Medicare For All proposal. It requires heavy reliance on the criminal code.

    We have less of a threat of a US version of Divine Rights of Kings and more so of our version of primogeniture. I LOL in disgust when the current Governor of New York dedicated a new bridge named after his father, the late Governor of New York.

    Yes, Trump is an Independent. The GOP is just the vehicle. Climate change is merely the current version of the 1906 Pure Food and Drug Act. It's something good for the children and the overall society and it only costs less than one tenth of a trolley car ride to and from downtown.

    "Paris is worth a Mass."
     
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  31. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    Climate change is REAL. It just isn't caused by people as much as it is just a natural if at times brutal part of a natural world. We are well past due for a major drought. We can prepare and deal with it or we can sacrifice our kids trying to appease the gods as the Myans did but in the end, it is GOING to happen. Pointing fingers and blaming people for somehow making nature mad as us is crazy.

    dea9957a25e2e942aafdd1324357d9b4.jpeg

    z7bBu8EtxJquUSglP2jH3FNNDClkfAsH.jpeg
     
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2019 at 10:44 AM
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    1. Dalewick
      YES!
       
      Dalewick, Nov 11, 2019 at 2:07 PM
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  32. poltiregist

    poltiregist Master Survivalist
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    As for as some areas of where land is sinking , has anyone considered taking into consideration centrifugal force of the earth spinning creating gravity . It could possibly be drawing solid matter " dirt " into a more compact form where as liquid matter "water " would not be drawn into a more compact form . That would explain why in some areas people claim sea levels are rising and some areas there is no reported change .
     
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  33. Pragmatist

    Pragmatist Master Survivalist
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    Good afternoon TexDanm,

    Yes, we're pending a major drought.

    My initial question is what constitutes "we" ? It's surely not the representatives of the US electorate. The nation is divided on just about all aspects of our society.

    Will California's Imperial Valley be closed to agriculture so as to save aquifers ? Will fracking ... - if - fracking is stopped, will OPEC nations increase petroleum production ?

    Global warming is a natural occurrence and human activity has some involvement - don't know how much but it's a sliver - ...... We're discussing the globe and there's more than one society on the planet. OPEC Vienna won't take vows of poverty and Moscow could not even consider slowing down Rosneft and Gazprom.

    My basic question is: Is there a basic solution at all ? On 1 January 2020, all merchant vessels must use non-polluting fuel. This is not even a molecule of help to the situation. It is a wealth transfer to the carrier industry.

    Back to the agriculture irrigation programs ........
     
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  34. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    Who constitutes we? We are the people of the USA and it is a little like that old saying, "We will either hang together or we will surely hang individually." At some point, we will probably come together to deal with things as a nation. California is going to have to either wake up and start dealing with REALITY or they will end up as refugees.

    The ecology of a lot of California is based on periotic burn offs. Some of the plants there have evolved such that those burn-offs are a part of their reproductive process. This is a fact. People have built all over those places. The decision that they have to make is to either leave that area or change the ecology of that area. That would mean regular controlled burns and even eradication of the brush that they have built them homes among. they want to believe in the Rainbow Unicorn and live happy happy joy joy with nature and then not accept that it is going to burn. Where I live they regularly in years that are not so dry burn the forests here. when the trees are healthy and not bone dry they are not bothered by this. They are just burning the brush that allows a flash fire to spread out of control in the dry years.

    The fact is that both the East and West coasts have built up to the point way past the ability of their environment to support. they have sucked the areas dry and are reaching further and further in order to keep their megacities alive. when you live on the edge you can so easily fall. Building in many of the places that people chose to build as a city spreads often ends up JUST LIKE people that build on the slopes of a volcano that is alive and occasionally smoking. If we as a nation experience a severe drought we will have to make some tough decisions and unfortunately, people don't like to do that. Places like Las Vegas could become uninhabitable. Lake Mead is the lifeblood that provides water and power to that city and the water level is way down.

    What we are experiencing right now is scattered warming. I know that it is averaging out to global warming but it is sort of like the drought. Texas is experiencing the worst of the current drought.

    c3f884a27ad72caa9fb88bb73b85c4b9.png

    The fact is that while much of texas is suffering from drought some of us are experiencing floods year after year. After 3 century floods in 18 months, they stopped using that expression. A few years ago it was East Texas hat was dry and burning. The one thing that you might try to note is that droughts in Texas don't become national news. Our fires are not allowed to spread like they are in California. Right now we are wet so guess what? We are burning the brush in the National Forests. We don't build homes in the brush and then refuse to allow people to clear that brush. We modify our environment because we KNOW that Mother Nature can be a psychotic bitch at times.

    We will either deal with what nature is GOING to throw at us or nature is going to DEAL with US!
     
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  35. Pragmatist

    Pragmatist Master Survivalist
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    Good afternoon TexDanm,

    I basically agree with you.

    My personal belief is that California's middle class will be priced out of the market for single family houses. I anticipate skyrocketing insurance rates along with electric costs that are very high.

    My only disagreement is in the phrases [If] "we as a nation ... will have to make some tough decisions..." So far, the record shows the can is still getting kicked down the road. There are some efforts to correct the situation but they are small as compared to what really needs to be done;

    - Virginia is building the nation's largest offshore wind farm
    - Flood plain houses are being priced out of the marketplace. Individuals will soon have no insurance and thus the property has little value.

    Still, the big ticket items are agriculture and overall coastal living.

    The California almond crop exists because of publicly-funded water projects. All the rest are about the same racket. Can't comment yet on the California marijuana crop. They still do not have USDA crop insurance !
     
  36. Dalewick

    Dalewick Master Survivalist
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    Another thing that has to be considered by the "the sky is falling crowd" is that 50,000 years ago the northern hemisphere was mostly covered in sheets of ice "glaciers" and as of 10,000 years ago, those glaciers are mostly gone. The planet, in response to this event is now having the continental plates that were being pushed down by the ice are now rising. The sea levels in all areas are going to alter (rise or sink) due to this change. The earth is a highly complex place and trying to blame one thing (people) for a complex issue, is just a scam.

    The earth is as complex as a living lifeform and we still don't understand all of that, and that's nowhere near as hard to study as the planet is.

    Humans won't control the things we can control (pollution, birth rate, war, prejudice, etc.) so why should anyone believe people that say the can control things they don't even understand.

    Dale
     
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