Community post SHTF.

Discussion in 'Community Sharing CSA Ideas' started by lonewolf, Aug 4, 2016.

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  1. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    Its all very well talking about community ideas and community sharing, but how do you know there will be any community left after the event is over? maybe if its just one of these temporary, quickly over, sorts of events but what if its something more long term?
    you could find your the only one alive or the only one left in your area, not everyone is going to survive, and the ones that do might decide its better to go and stay with uncle Fred and Aunty Hilda-or whoever- in the next county or up the line somewhere.
    many people will be left on their own, not by bad planning, but just by dumb bad luck.
    what then?
     
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  2. Keith H.

    Keith H. Moderator Staff Member
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    Well as you say, they had better be prepared for that.
    Keith.
     
  3. Arkane

    Arkane Master Survivalist
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    The thing is no one really knows what will happen and what things will be like when
    things settle down again, everyone can make guess's but none will get it exactly right!

    Ones nice little quiet cosy spot might be just a km away from where large hostile group sets up base!
    or maybe where you are becomes a large refugee area
    or a slight sea level rise makes your place a small isolated island
    way too many variables to make any decisions now!
    I am prepared for isolation or community whatever it is!
     
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  4. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    well I always say" prepare for the worst and hope for the best".
     
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  5. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    just because no one knows what might happen is not an excuse not to prep or not to take precautions.
     
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  6. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    I don't expect at this time that the die off will be uniformly spread. There will be huge areas where almost everyone will perish and then other areas will be much less affected and a few may be untouched. Part of this is the luck of the draw but not all of it. In almost every possible scenario the inner cities will suffer an almost total destruction. It is a totally artificial environment that depends on power and endless efforts from people NOT there to provide them with food, water and power. Many cities exist in places that without great effort and cost would not be habitable at all. Las Vegas jumps to mind. Another problem with the inner city is that in such close quarters disease will spread easily and fires will be an almost unstoppable threat.

    I actually find the typical movie view of roving road warriors to be a most unlikely end result of any major catastrophe over the long term. Even a riot ends and when it is over things settle again. The energy expended on violence will be like a raging fire and quickly consume itself. This does not mean that the post apocalyptic world will be a gentle or kind place to live but insane violence just never lasts for long without a stable civilization to support it.

    If left on my own I will seek others. To live totally alone is not survival it is just slow suicide. No matter what if you are alone when you die it is as if you never were.
     
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  7. GS AutoTech

    GS AutoTech Expert Member
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    I was just contemplating making contact with nearby homesteaders in order to create that community. Independent mini farms/homesteads that are self sufficient. But form a loose network of community that could thrive after an event.
    I agree, the early stages of an event would be very difficult depending on the event & your locale. But with any luck, the violence would subside quickly. 3 days without water, 3 weeks without food, lets say 60 days many unprepared people would be wiped out. Then the community that still exists would begin to reform.
     
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  8. Keith H.

    Keith H. Moderator Staff Member
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    Sounds like a good idea to me. Can't hurt to make new contacts & possibly new friends.
    Keith.
     
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  9. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    What you are talking about is reverting to the basic form of civilization that was the rule for most of human history. Until the 1940s most people lived in rural areas with the majority on small one family farms. The farms were all small and you had a family on top of every little hill. They raised a cash crop that they sold and a garden that they ate out of and fed their animals out of. About every 15 to 20 miles you would have a small town that was usually built around mills or cotton gins that bought, processed and then sold the farmers cash crops. There were a couple of stores a couple of churches and it was directed towards supplying the farms and farmers with their needs.

    The farms were each independent but also close enough to aid and assist each other. Your neighbors were important because a lot of the things you needed to do required more muscle power than one man and his sons could provide. These little communities were tight and because they depended on each other you either did your share and kept your word and paid your bills or you were out of luck.

    Some for of this was common world wide for centuries and the "Rules" and "customs" were well understood by all. With the advent of power and machine powered farming this sort of life just melted away in the US and in most industrialized nations. It is not at all surprising to me that tearing down a system that lasted for centuries maybe thousands of years has caused a lot of cultural displacement that we can't and haven't repaired in 75 years. Now Neighbors are just people that live near you. You have very little in common and often don't really know them. Even families are non cohesive now and most kids are raised in day care centers that are little more than warehouses for kids so both parents can work and live "the dream".

    I don't know what is going to cause the end but I think that it won't take much because we are like loose rocks on a hillside and once it all starts falling and sliding down there will be nothing to stop it.
     
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  10. GS AutoTech

    GS AutoTech Expert Member
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    So true on every level.
     
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  11. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    it is said in the UK most people are 4 generations removed from the land, they wouldn't have a clue what to do even if they survived, most don't know where there food comes from or even in some cases what animal, they cant cook even if you gave them the ingredients, most meals are "convenience" and nuked in a microwave, kids aren't allowed to play outside in case there is a pervert around the corner and they aren't allowed to get dirty and spend most if not all of their time looking at a computer screen or a smartphone, when SHTF they will all be dead within a few days never mind weeks!
    community? you gotta be joking! most urban populations are very fluid and people move on because of work commitments or family ones, in some cases 6 to 12 months is the limit of their tenancy and they are gone again to somewhere new .
     
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  12. Keith H.

    Keith H. Moderator Staff Member
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    Sign of the times. One of my daughter-in-laws can't cook on a wood stove, in fact she has trouble cooking as she is unable to look after my grandson & cook at the same time. We had three sons & did not have a problem. Another son has been away from home living in the city. Now he has moved back to the country & we just heard that they have run out of water! Townies use water like it is going out of fashion! I despair, I really do. If they ever have to come back home I can see that I will have to run a tight ship!!! We are still training our other daughter-in-law, it is a slow process because we do not want to be "those sort of in-laws", we will only help when invited to do so.
    Keith.
     
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  13. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    we all know what it will be like, that's why we prepare.
    its the "ordinary" citizen who is in for a shock, but then they probably wont survive for long.
    many people have said to me " I don't want to survive if SHTF", and I expect the suicide rate to sky rocket when they realise how different it will be to their normal lifestyle.
     
  14. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    most people who don't survive will be dead within 3 months, 6 months at the most.
    remember humans can only survive without food for 3 weeks and 3 days without water, add in disease and the population will be decimated very quickly-wherever one lives.
    most people-especially here in the UK- don't have enough food to last a week, once the stores are empty and the water mains go off they are stuffed.
     
  15. Morgan101

    Morgan101 Expert Member
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    IMHO one of the most important things you can have is a mindset to be flexible, adaptable, an open-minded. You have to be able to adapt to whatever is thrown at you.

    I cannot stress enough how quickly your life can be turned upside down by a catastrophic event. You can go from totally normal to completely sideways in a heartbeat. In the immortal words of Colonel Jeff Cooper: " The essential thing to bear always in mind is that trouble can appear at any time. Be aware. Be ready. Be alert. "
     
  16. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    which most people will not be.
     
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  17. Morgan101

    Morgan101 Expert Member
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    Sad but very true.
     
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  18. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    History shows that you never can really know how people, individually, will react to stress and strife. So many, even in the survival type of mindset are so fixated on one single path that their mindset will not let them react to a situation that wasn't what they prepared for. Conversely, there will be people that were not prepared that will adapt fast and actually end up in a better place than those that were prepared.

    One problem that preppers may experience an unwillingness to abandon all of their preparations and run. Someone with less preparation may be faster to move out and adapt. There is safety in numbers. I worry some times that a lot of preppers are going to pull into their little holes to feel safe and then end up an outsider even in their own areas. A single person or very small group may survive but at some point, they will need to return to a new reality and LIVE.

    A community is any group of people that can operate together in a loose form but still depend on each other for help, assistance, and pleasures. I have lived through a small version of TEOTWAWKI. In the 80s when the oil industry was tanked by the federal government unemployment went as high a 35% where I lived. Every place that I had worked for went out of business. There were no jobs of ANY kind to be had. I lived for a little over a year in a hand to mouth fashion doing any kind of jobs that I could find. During that time my most valuable resource was my family and my Church Family.

    They helped in so many ways. Everyone was on the lookout for any sort of job for me. I roofed, did carpenter jobs, painted, mechaniced, cleaned and did janitorial services, delivered circulars... you name it and I would do it and they helped. When times are bad networking may be the only way that you can survive. It was TOUGH but I kept a roof over our head and that was more than a lot of people did. The big roadside parks that had toilets became encampments for entire families that were living in their cars or in tents. There were entire subdivisions with hundreds of homes that were empty. Thousands of people lost everything. In the end, I lost my home but it was a choice. I had to leave that area and didn't have the money to keep it and start over someplace else.

    Without the help of my church family and my parents, I could easily have ended up homeless with a wife and a small child. We were dirt poor but their support and love made it so that I never felt alone like so many others did. When I moved the thing that hurt most was losing this family of friends. The first thing we did when we settled after the move was to make new connections. I had a debt to pay and I did it. I helped others that were in situations like mine had been. This made new friends and connections that are still paying off today.

    In hard times you never know where help may come from. The more people that you know the more likely you will be to find help if you NEED it.
     
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  19. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    the trouble is that the more people you know or rather that know of you in a SHTF situation is more people that could do you harm and steal your supplies.
    it actually depends on how fast or how slow the collapse is and what the die off is, in a remote location with an already low population this probably wont be a problem but i'm very glad I don't live in one of our large multi cultural cities.
     
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  20. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    I'm with you about living in big cities. Honestly, I don't even like going into them NOW. Too many people coming at me from all directions is stressful.

    I think in part the difference in how we see our relationships with other people and stranger danger is in part the difference in where we live. When you have the legal right to protect yourself and are prepared to do so then strangers aren't nearly as scary. Where I live you wave at your neighbors and there is a certain us and them comradery. People that chose to live 15 or 20 miles from the nearest even small city are different in nature from the people that can't imagine living someplace with no street lights, no cops, and no pizza delivery.

    The legal right to use lethal force in defense of yourself and your property makes you feel safer AND let me tell you, the criminal element gets nervous when they are someplace that doesn't offer them the ability to blend into the background. I know everyone that lives on my road. If I see someone that doesn't belong there I watch them. Criminals just don't feel comfortable in the country environs. That is why I don't even have a key for my front door. I NEVER lock it. Criminals know that country people all keep a gun beside their doors and that they won't hesitate t use them. One of my neighbors down the road was shooting all yesterday afternoon. Target shooting is the rural version of bowling.
     
  21. poltiregist

    poltiregist Expert Member
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    I agree with this line of thought . It seems many depend a lot on that there will be a community left . About the only advantage that would effect me is , my younger survivalist in the group "Grandchildren " might be able to find a suitable mate . As for as survivability such as food , water , shelter , fire building or medicine , done got it covered . We could live for decades with zero outside contact .
     
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