Distinction Is Key...

Discussion in 'Survival Gear' started by AnarchySurvival, Jan 18, 2019.

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Is being able to make a distinction an important skill in survival?

  1. Yes

    91.7%
  2. No

    8.3%
  1. AnarchySurvival

    AnarchySurvival Active Member
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    When talking to someone about survival gear, I have noticed that I come into contact with many individuals who cannot make distinctions. For example, the gist of a conversation I recently had:
    __________________________________________
    Individual #1: "A hatchet and a tomahawk are the same thing."

    Individual #2: "No there not, a hatchet is better."

    Myself: "Actually they are distinctly different, even though they are classed under the same title of Small Axes. They differ only in how well they perform a given task "

    Individuals #1 & #2: "You're an idiot and don't know what you're talking about!"
    __________________________________________

    These are the same people who state that they have a stockpile of chlorine tabs for purifying their water supply. The same people who state that a .22 caliber rifle is not a viable defense against another human. These people for some reason cannot be deviated from their perspectives. Even when proven wrong.

    Survival calls for a person to be capable of making a distinction between things that will further their chance of survival and things that will get them killed.

    Is it just me, or does this seem like a recurring issue in our community? I mean, everyone is entitled to their opinions obviously. I just don't see the point in not admitting when you're wrong, especially when presented with factual evidence.

    Let me know what you folks think and if you've come across these individuals before yourself.
     
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  2. TMT Tactical

    TMT Tactical The Great Lizard !
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    In a SHTF event, when you stand your ground and are unwilling to adapt or admit a belief is incorrect, then you are not a survivor, just a future statistic. When somebody tells me a 22lr can't kill humans, I always invite them to stand 100 yards down rang and I promise to only use head shots. So far, no takers. Adapt or die, just that simple. No plan stands up to the test of time, without some adaptations.
     
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  3. Keith H.

    Keith H. Moderator Staff Member
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    I think the lack of understanding when it comes to equipment is because they have already made their choice, & 1) they do not like hearing they chose wrong, & 2) this item has cost them money & they don't like to think it was a waste of money.

    Just a point regarding the tomahawk. I will not confuse matters by talking about the history, e.g. a tomahawk was a trade axe, but I will mention the obvious difference between a modern hatchet, & what some of us call the tomahawk. The tomahawk has a round or tear drop eye, this means that the helve/handle is easier to make & fit, especially in a wilderness situation. The handle is tapered as is the eye, so the handle just drops in the same way as a mattock or pickaxe & does not require a wedge to secure the head.
    That is why my preference is for the tomahawk, aside from it being lighter & easier to carry.
    Regards, Keith.
    33f6a52f151fbfaffab8f494c0ff9c27.jpeg
     
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  4. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    Small axes are like hammers. There are a lot of different ones and each has its special strengths and weaknesses. The trick is to know what those strengths and weaknesses are and determine what you want them to do. Even among the small axes we call hatchets there are many different kinds. I have most of them. I would hate to roof with a carpenters hatchet but do roof with a roofers hatchet. A broadside hatchet and a woodsman hatchet are not interchangeable. A sounding hatchet is a must for a forester and a survival hatchet is none of the above. Hawks are a totally different world and there are a lot of different ones in that area too.

    All of the above actually makes very little difference. You need to know what you want your small ax to do and then figure out what best does that thing. Hawks are great but you in general don't want t o split kindling with one. On the other side I wouldn't want to skin a squirrel with a hatchet but have with a hawk.

    People spend a lot of time going over the minutia of our plans and tools. Some of it is wasted BUT a lot of times in the details you will learn something new. Stupidity is incurable. The most insidious form of stupidity is someone that is so sure that they know it all that they never listen or learn anything new. Ignorance is the human condition. Only by exposing yourself to other views and ideas can your terminal state of ignorance be relieved.

    Not only can a 22lr kill; in some cases it is actually the best tool for the job. If you want to assassinate someone up close it does a professional job. If you want to kill something but don't want to have a body to deal with a 22lr or two in the gut is the tool of choice. If it is all you have, if you place your shots carefully, it will stop anything.
     
  5. AnarchySurvival

    AnarchySurvival Active Member
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    I agree on the two points you made above. Nobody likes being told they are wrong, but it happens. As for a tomahawk being a trade axe, it still is in my book. The haft/handle is a minor plus to me as it takes no real skill to make one.

    A tomahawk, regardless of era, is still a tomahawk by design. It is meant to be light, easily packable, and capable of a razor sharp edge for fine tasks such as skinning game and bushcraft. Most hatchets do not fit these three criteria unless you have one that is for a specified purpose such as a Carpenters hatchet.

    My preference has always been the tomahawk just for it's weight and cutting capability when properly sharpened.
     
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  6. watcherchris

    watcherchris Master Survivalist
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    LOL LOL LOL.....

    Good point you have made here...AnarchySurvival.

    However..I would not recommend arguing with someone making those points.

    If the stuff hits the fan...they will have to make up the difference or suffer accordingly....not you unless they are a part of your group.


    I have two tomahawks...and also two camp Axes. The tomahawks I have chosen are called a Trail Hawk..but I chose them because the backside has the hammer tool built into it. This was a feature I judged would come in handy.

    I understood that the tomahawk is not as efficient as is a true axe....at heavier jobs.

    But I agree with Keith ..the tomahawk is lighter and easier to carry.

    The camp axe does not have as long a handle as does my double sided axe..but it is not a hatchet.


    Oh...and I just bought two more 500 count boxes of bulk .22 long rifle ammo and put it away. I will be going back for another two boxes in time...because I don't believe in the .22 long rifle.


    As far as defense ....usually it is going to be whatever you can get to the quickest ...if it is a .22 long rifle ..so be it.

    While I wont go into specifics....many years ago...I built a concealed hiding place...
    In it is a Ithica Model 37 12 gauge police pump shotgun...and a .22 long rifle pump gun...because I don't believe in the power of the .22 long rifle.

    The rough idea for the hiding place came from reading this....

    https://www.amazon.com/Construction-Secret-Hiding-Charles-Robinson/dp/087947436X



    If I want to shoot a lot...I use my 12 gauge and shoot only one to two times...that ought to do it....close up.

    But I also have a 14 inch Thompson Contender single shot in .22 long rifle...with a match barrel. This is a shooter.

    I like accurate guns...in whatever version ..handgun or rifle....not guns which shoot a lot. It is my way.

    There are people out here who know how to very efficiently use a .22 pneumatic rifle....a pellet rifle.

    How about a slingshot?? A bow??? They sure are quiet in the hands of people who know how to use them. So too is a tomahawk.


    But..I don't waste time arguing with people like you are describing. If the SHTF....they will have to make up the difference for any of their mistakes...not you. Same with me here...


    Thanks,
    Watcherchris

    Not an Ishmaelite.
     
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2019
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  7. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    If the stuff hits the fan you won't need to argue with anyone over their choices or opinions about survival. That is the cool thing about survival. It is a test that has only two results...pass or fail. That means live or die.

    The thing is that we will each take a different test and there are as many correct answers as their are incorrect ones. Success means that you chose what worked for YOU and are still here to argue with you. Failure is simple you are not around anymore to argue.

    When I am out woods walking or hunting and such I much prefer a hawk. They are light and razor sharp. If you need a quick fire they are the best tool for the job because they excel at making small cuts and whittling sticks into fuzz sticks for a fast easy fire starter.

    On the other hand if I am camping and planning on doing a lot of wood fires for cooking and camp fires I will want my hatchet. It is heavier and shaped for heavy chopping and then splitting wood. I have hatchets that are specifically for that. I'm not sure exactly where the line is between hatchet and ax. I go from an 8 ounce sounding hatchet through a massive splitting axe and an 8 pound splitting maul.

    A slightly long handled hatchet with a 2 pound head makes a great tool for providing firewood and yet still be portable. The same head on a slightly longer handle is a camp axe. The 1 1/2 pound head Estwing hatchet works well too though I prefer a slightly longer handle.

    I LOVE edged tools and weapons.
     
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  8. watcherchris

    watcherchris Master Survivalist
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    Wow Texdanm....is that ever in the X ring!!!

    Makes me think of some of the dumb things I've done through the years. I'm right lucky to be upright, in one piece today, and speaking.



    You know all this stuff about Trade Axes caused me to look it up and there is some very interesting material on it....

    Here is a link....very interesting and much history to be learned here...

    https://www.furtradetomahawks.com/trade-axes--missouri-war-axes---8.html


    I put this in my bookmarks for future and further reading.



    Thanks,
    Watcherchris
    Not an Ishmaelite.
     
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  9. Morgan101

    Morgan101 Master Survivalist
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    If someone responded to me in that manner I would walk away. They are more than likely, not people with which you could hold an intelligent conversation. To anyone who thinks that a .22 caliber is not a viable defense against a human I would refer them to Robert Kennedy assassination circa 1968.

    At the risk of weighing political, there are a whole bunch of people who completely ignore facts when the facts disagree with their feelings. Facts have nothing to do with how they feel, and if you don't feel that way you don't know what you are talking about.
     
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