Us Army Seeks To Improve ...

Discussion in 'Sci-Fi, Space Travel, and Future Technologies' started by Pragmatist, Sep 20, 2020.

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  1. Pragmatist

    Pragmatist Master Survivalist
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  2. Dalewick

    Dalewick Master Survivalist
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    The more they take out the "human element" from combat, the more "friendly fire" incidents that will occur.

    Dale
     
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  3. wally

    wally Expert Member
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    did you hear the USA military boot camp training will be "nicer" now? i see a lot of dead and injured troops in our near future...
     
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    1. Dalewick
      LOL! I come from a time when there was still wall to wall counseling.
       
      Dalewick, Sep 20, 2020
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  4. Pragmatist

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    Good morning Dale and Wally,

    Exactly, Dale; "Time on target" will include the wedding reception a couple of towns away.

    Knew about it Wally but didn't hear ... the basic training chorus was just too loud coupled to non-compliant with the facemask requirement.
     
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  5. Max rigger

    Max rigger Expert Member
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    Automation/technology has changed the face of war and will continue to do so; doubt we will have a lot of use for pilots in planes or manned tanks in the next twenty years or so...no need for them to be there in harms way.

    We'll always need LPCs on the ground (Leather Personnel Carriers) but these days you don't have a bunch of conscripts who don't want to be there to train, you have boys and girls who've signed up for the job. I'm a decade or so out of touch but back when I was in the USA had the reputation of still teaching by the book, teaching by numbers and the brits had evolved from that old school of thought and decided motivation was the key to making a good soldier. These days youngsters won't stand for being screamed at by some anal retentive three stripper who's having a bad day; these days its all about teaching the basic skills then encouraging self motivation/team play and development of the individual to not only play their team part but to think for themselves.
     
  6. lonewolf

    lonewolf Legendary Survivalist Staff Member
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    in the future it will be less about "boots on the ground" and more about technology, you will be able to fight a war in future by sitting in front of a computer and not leaving your comfy chair.
    thats if the human race lasts that long that is and we dont all go extinct because some idiot let off a nuclear missile or the planet dosent get hit by some big rock from space.
     
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  7. Pragmatist

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    Good morning Max,

    There are more categories of recruits than just those willing to learn and serve.

    In the last 20 years there have been recruits with children left behind with the grandparents taking care of the new recruits' kids. I know this because one of my vet organizations helps with the paperwork processing.

    Don't omit the extensive use of contractors.

    There are some special recruiting programs for special operations. These orgs have budgets independent of the main DOD budget. Am not current on what's now going on but do remember they tried to copy some British programs. I'm near "Navy Town" - Norfolk-Virginia Beach. Those naval commandos from Little Creek, Virginia Beach loved learning about the Brits' SBS. The candidates are basically physically fit but the public school experience has them nearly blank slates of knowledge for a high school grad.
     
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  8. Max rigger

    Max rigger Expert Member
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    The problem the UK has is that its been cut back to the core, not many actual combat troops really, we'd certainly not be able to field the numbers of personel or the equipment we did in Gulf 1. We seem to have lots of skilled people and not a lot of actual grunts. Years ago a lad could join up knowing he had a job for life, those days are sadly gone; they don't want people they will end up paying a pension to for years. Some of our units like SBS/SAS, paras, Royal Marines, engineers etc are top of the pile, best of the best but we just don't have many of them, the navy is a joke, two aircraft carriers going online when its becoming clear that carrier days are numbered and the RAF has been cut to the core too.

    Combine our vastly reduced military capabilities wotj the economic meltdown bought on by Covid and Brexit and this little crowded island ain't going to be a great place to live. I got my Irish passport two years ago so I can still move freely in the EU after the UK exit but the doors are closing on Britain now.
     
  9. lonewolf

    lonewolf Legendary Survivalist Staff Member
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    anyone who dosent like it here in the UK is free to leave.
     
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  10. varuna

    varuna Tree killer & a cat person
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    Setting up will still take more than 30 sec even with automated system. That still doesn't count flight time. However there is already an entire platform of big gun that could hit target less than 20 sec that has been around for nearly a century and it is called TANK. Which can easily be rebrand as "Direct Fire Support"
     
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  11. Max rigger

    Max rigger Expert Member
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    I'm flying out in the morning mate, now have five properties to look at.
     
  12. Dalewick

    Dalewick Master Survivalist
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    If you can't stand someone screaming and yelling at you, surviving combat, especially close quarters combat, isn't looking good. Not even mentioning surviving capture and interrogation by the enemy. Life is hard and your enemy is training to kill you right now.

    b5a2c791637e43421b4eb1e2b9df929c.jpg

    Dale
     
    1. TMT Tactical
      My thoughts completely. 100 percent. Life is hard, grow a pair.
       
      TMT Tactical, Sep 21, 2020
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  13. Pragmatist

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    Good morning Varuna,

    Of course anything that is "Direct Fire Support" that can't be relocated by foot soldiers while projectile is in air, is also branded a "target".

    Still "concerned" about the 20 (twenty) seconds.
     
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  14. Dalewick

    Dalewick Master Survivalist
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    This is what makes being in an artillery unit on a modern battlefield a death sentence. If you link the info from a anti artillery radar into a fast response artillery battery any battery that can't move from there firing location faster than the response time...dies.

    SLC-2.jpg

    Dale
     
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  15. varuna

    varuna Tree killer & a cat person
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    Norinco suck badly Dale. We here already loss several guys due to malfunctioning brand new Norinco stuff. Failure rate worse than a Russian helicopter
     
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  16. Dalewick

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    Yes, I know. But I didn't want to put an American unit on here. I think the one in the picture is Chinese.

    Dale
     
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  17. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    It takes boot on the ground to "win" any war. The only way to win without physically going in is to SLAG the area with a near 100% mortality rate. We are talking about things like saturation bombing with Nukes or dense and repeated biochemical gassing of the area until NOTHING survives.

    People are like rats and nearly impossible to wipe totally out. If conventional bombs could do the job it would have been Done in WW2 when the allies bombed Dresden Germany for several days. It pretty much destroyed the city but in the end, an amazing number of people survived. Had we not gone in with troops and taken it I have little doubt that the survivors would have rebuilt and continued to fight.

    The real purpose of war is NOT to kill all of the enemy people. It is to force them to capitulate and do what we want. The atomic bombs that we dropped on Japan were and are misunderstood. It was not and never was done or intended to be done to kill all of the Japanese people even in the cities that we hit. The nuclear bombs are weapons of TERROR and not destruction. Those two bombs scared the Japanese people and their leadership so bad that it wiped out their will to continue to fight. They saved possible millions of lives. If we had to just sit off and shell Japan and had bombed Tokyo like we did Dresden the death count would have been unimaginable. Had we not broken the will of the people they might have fought to the last man or as they did on some of the islands committed suicide rather than accept surrender.

    Read the Story of Masada and understand that very easily this could have happened in Japan on a level that is unimaginable. The psychology of the people was very similar in many ways.
     
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  18. Dalewick

    Dalewick Master Survivalist
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    Pretty sure killing Japanese was not the issue for using nukes. Granted, nukes are a weapon of terror. They still are, but we bombed Tokyo on March 9 - 10, 1945 and killed over 100,000 and made over 1 million homeless with the fire bombs that were dropped. I believe the issue was the president and brass knew that to invade Japan would have cost an unreasonable number of Allied (mostly American), soldier lives. The nukes proved to the emperor and Japanese leaders that continuing the war would have permanently crippled Japan, even though the military generals and admirals petitioned the emperor to continue fighting and resisting the allies.

    War is a continuation of politics through aggressive means. As politics have changed, so has the purpose and outcome of wars. Wars used to be fought for resources (land, water, food, slaves, etc.) but those days are gone. That ended with the Korean conflict, where political motives out weighed older motives of resources. I know of no modern war fought by superpowers or there allies for resources, with the possible exception of the Falklands.

    I'm not including smaller countries that are torn apart by civil wars or terrorist actions, such as Rhodesia, South Africa, Borneo, Nigeria, etc, etc.

    Wars may have changed, but the hearts of men have not. Modern politics claim high and lofty ideas but politicians are still driven by the same base desires that have caused every war known. I'm pretty sure everyone here knows the motives I'm talking about and the wars young men and women have for.

    Just my opinion.

    Dale

    8982e0b87ec175990b40d511cc3a8ff2.jpg

    Soldiers pay the price of politicians desires.
     
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  19. Pragmatist

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    Good morning all,

    One additional reason for the 2 atomic attacks was to send a message to the nearby Soviet army and the commissars.

    The US message involved Europe.
     
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  20. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    If we had wanted to kill a lot more people we could have hit Tokyo or several other larger cities. We wanted to break the backs and will of them to fight. At the point where we dropped the bombs, they were preparing for a fight until they died an honorable death and the death toll for them would have been unimaginable. US casualties would have been bad but not even in the close region of the Japanese casualties. We would have probably lost thousands but they would have lost MILLIONS and most of those would have died before we even set foot on the beach in Japan. We would have just sat off and shelled them into oblivion from the East coast and then been saturation bombing them from places on the China mainland.

    We were trying hard also to avoid what we ended up within Germany where it was broken up and for the next 30 years had Russia ruling most of eastern Europe. Had it taken longer the Russians would have wanted in and the Chinese were foaming at the mouth for an opportunity to attack the Japanese mainland. The Chinese hated the Japanese with a passion that westerners have a hard time understanding and it is very mutual. The Chinese would have killed all of the Japanese people, men women, and children if they had been given a chance. Instead, we dropped the two bombs and the war was over and Japan became the American shield and place of power close to both China and the Eastern parts of Russia. We didn't have to share it with anyone. Without our bases in Japan, we would have had to fight the Korean and Vietnam war from Hawaii.

    By the time we dropped the bombs we had won the war. We could have just let them sit and starve to death on their little Island kingdom but had we done that either China or Russia would have eventually grabbed it and that was not something that we could afford. Before the end of WW2 in both the European and the Pacific theater much of what was going on was about us not having to go right back and fo war against either the Russians or the Chinese. Russia especially was strictly an ally in name only. There was a lot of the leadership in the military that wanted to meet the Russians and roll right over them and go all the way to Moscow. Patton was especially in that corner. We did almost immediately go to war with the Chinese and once again the military leaders wanted to roll right over North Korea and take /china down and be done with it but the same leadership that refused to allow it in Europe brought Mc Arthur home and retired him and allowed the Chinese backed North Koreans take back half the country.

    Maybe they were right. but instead of finishing the war we instead fought it in other lands all of my younger years. The cold war wasn't so cold to those that died in Foreign lands in Korea and Vietnam. I wouldn't have had to do atomic bomb drills in elementary school if we had taken Stalin out and just been done with it. This is all history and like history is always when my generation dies all of the lessons learned with die with us.
     
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  21. F22 Simpilot

    F22 Simpilot Master Survivalist
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    I would refrain from using the Internet and satellites as part of my plan. I know it's primarily used now in the military, but backup systems need to be in order if we are to rely on such systems of war effort. The Internet can be taken down very, very easily. Don't believe me? Learn a few things about hacking and then head on over to Shodan where freaking SCADA systems show up ripe for take down. It truly is amazing. Satellites of course can be targeted. That's just a no brainer and I'm sure the DoD thought of it already, but do they have quick and ready satellite backups to go back up in orbit at a moments notice? No? Then we are screwed.


    Now I read that drones used in Afghanistan and maybe during operation Iraqi Freedom were piloted by a guy in Las Vegas. I don't think this should happen. It all should be withen a local Intranet (not Internet, Intranet), and a command and control on ship or land way behind enemy lines. But, I'd have a backup in Vegas or what ever as well.

    Future warfare will indeed be AI driven like it or not. That's just how it's going to work, and perhaps future warfare won't be about how many men you kill, but more about logistics and the military industrial complex that can out produce the enemy. Ever watch the Terminator movies? In the movies Skynet was cranking out all kinds of AI. The first incarnation you see in the first Terminator movie was a walking cybernetic organism series 800, model 101 to be specific. It was a robot but vastly more complex than what we need now unless it's for HUMINT/para military actions. During the series of Terminator movies they introduced more Skynet robotics like an aquabot that patrolled waters, AI tanks and AI air power. This will all come to past in real life, believe me. Not so much just like the movie the Terminator, but in a lot of ways, yes. It will start by being controlled from data centers and then when AI and computing systems get more advanced will be more self-controlled with their own programed commands to do house to house fighting, etc. So when the military recruits "solders," they will be recruiting people that are good at first person shooter games to sit in front of a computer all damn day and night. Remember, there was a time man thought it was nice to fight a war shoulder to shoulder, line by line. Then it was more guerilla tactics we use today. The next evolution will be machine versus machine and the future will be taken aback at how man went against man in the most harshest way with pain and suffering of monumental proportions. One day AI warfare rules will make its way to the Geneva Convention.

    What does this mean in the long run? First, we need a smarter graduating class of youngsters. We need to bring on an effort to really drill in the absolute need for STEM (Science, Technology, Engineering and Mathematics). Future wars will be more of a tech versus tech vs logistics vs industrial capability which will all lead down to financial ability from the state. I don't know if this is good or not, but math is pretty damn sound, so being perhaps our currency should be based on cryptocurrency using many different mathematical hashes. You've heard of the popular Bitcoin? That's one. There's also Bitcoin Cash, Monero, etc, etc. There are many and you can trade them like stocks. However, the major drawback here is that it's all dependent on the Internet and computers and therein lies the possible problem. So knowing this, backup systems upon backup systems MUST, absolutely MUST be deployed. Speaking of which, the same should be true for SCADA right now. It's so damn weak I can't even. We really are at the mercy of Russia, China or Iran to name a few bad actors let me tell you. Though, so are we to make that point fair. The NSA and the U.S. Cybercommand have tricks and have used them already. Of course, I don't think they admitted it though.

    Now since everything is or will be principally electronic, it too must be hardened against an EMP attack. That weapon WILL be used. Not a matter of if but when. And guess what? God has his own EMP called a solar flare that has in fact happened in the 1800s and WILL happen again. We had all better be prepared for the shit storm, especially the military's ability to fight off an aggressor should an EMP or solar flare strike.

    Moving on, I honestly think our superior fighter aircraft the F-22 and F-35 will eventually be unmanned. Not only because these aircraft will carry on for decades into the future, but because the technology going forward will allow it. And let me tell you. The F-22 is capable of all kinds of unbelievable maneuvers, but if conducted by the pilot the G forces would kill him or her. So the computer in the jet prohibits what the pilot can and can't do. Pull the pilot out of the cockpit in an autonomous configuration and you have a plane with muscles like Arnold Schwarzenegger, karate moves like Bruce Lee, and brains like Einstein.

    I'll end with this. If AI reaches what is called the "singularity" without being programed some code called "empathy" withen its non volatile, hard coded firmware, then we will all perish like those in the movie the Matrix where humans had to live underground. Not that we will live underground, (though there was a culture that did many hundreds of years ago due to the enemy). It's just that if AI learns to create its self, self-production (the singularity), we may be dealing with more than what we barged for. Don't believe me? Your neighbor most likely already right now turns his lights on or off by his voice and creates shopping lists with a computer interface built right into the damn refrigerator. We ARE moving forward with AI.
     
    Last edited: Sep 24, 2020
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  22. F22 Simpilot

    F22 Simpilot Master Survivalist
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    Make this skull crusher stealth and unmanned, and now you have your real artillery platform. :D






    ed67aab65057c67dc8bea315a15d2555.jpeg



    Better yet, pack it full of B83's, screw 'em. HAHAHA

    HA! Solar power the sucker. Now it just needs to come down for ammunition. Or you can use a few radioisotope thermoelectric generators like what some satellites use. Though, I know the wattage from those aren't that great and there's a possible issue with downed aircraft being used for dirty bombs or what ever.
     
    Last edited: Sep 24, 2020
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  23. Pragmatist

    Pragmatist Master Survivalist
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    Good morning F22,

    Had a good time reading above long post. My day is made !

    Some early AM rambling ......

    Have you followed the recent Federal drug bust involving the "Tor network" ? The drug dealers got busted thinking theit system was invincible.

    Believe land force expeditionary forces will phase out of US doctrine. Either forces are present or the place is lost as to the use of land forces.

    Don't watch movies but the bif companies here are announcing their contracts to build drone subs for DOD and USN - there's a distinction.

    Yes ! The recent young soldier recruit sought after will be replacing the "wilderness man" - to an extent. A psychiatrist at a meeting break, pre quarantine, told us the guy who can spend hours before the screen and loving it can be diagonised with some "syndrome" involving a love of routine with screens and keyboards.

    Back to grass roots: Better graduating classes of youngsters is too minimal. World class is required. The professors and teachers must be replaced with real professors and real teachers.

    The F22 is $44K per flight hour. It goes drone status or history book status.

    The F35 isn't even stealth with external arms stores.

    Geneva for anything ? "Europe has been conquored. They just don't know it yet." Brig Gen (ret Amnon Sofrin, Israel defense contractor.

    ......

    The pictured aeromachine can be destroyed for under 1% of the cost of the aeromachine. The debris fields will assist inventories in enemy supplies. This will decrease the cost of targeting the aeromachine even more.

    My commentary is not to present a bleak picture; only to say Novenber to January will determine much.

    Again, appreciated reading your material.
     
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  24. Pragmatist

    Pragmatist Master Survivalist
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    https://www.cnet.com/news/aspergers-study-asks-are-hackers-cognitively-different/


    Follow-up;

    Good morning F22,

    It was called "Asperger Syndrome". It's a form of autism.

    I linked above article just to get something here on the thread. I don't know what the current research calls this.

    Actually, still don't know the meaning of autism. Once had someone with autism on one of my Responder teams (all volunteer). Was told they will unpredictably just stop doing everything. This was no different than many of the other members without autism.

    In the above link, I like the concluding line with: "complicated gifts".
     
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  25. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    I have dealt with some people with autism and then also dealt with people that claim autism and just use that to explain their lack of manners and totally spoiled and untrain social skills. My Dad had a cure for that sort of autism. His belt would train you to keep your mouth SHUT and to DO as you were told.

    Real autism is an uncontrolled and uncontrollable series of actions and often an inability to read facial expressions or understand social rules that most of us picked up on when we were small children. I used to have a good friend that was mildly autistic. It was simple, if he did something that annoyed me I told him straight up that that wasn't acceptable. Usually, it was expressed with a "Stop being an asshole Jerry!" He really didn't have a filter on his mouth and would say the things that we ALL think but don't let it out. When he was a kid he got beat up a lot. He even got slapped a lot when he would take one look at a girl and inform her that she had a great set of tits!

    I had a retarded brother and I guess that gave me more patience with people with mental problems than most. I liked him and he was a nice guy but you couldn't take what came out of his mouth to heart all the time. For me it was easy but for most people, he was a hard person to put up with.
     
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  26. F22 Simpilot

    F22 Simpilot Master Survivalist
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    You're welcome. At least someone read my hard work. LOL Sometimes I think I can write books. :D I do this all the time with other forums I'm a member of. Your younger person will post something like, tl;dr, which means, Too Long, Didn't Read. Which to me speaks volumes about that person's IQ or what ever. If you don't read, if you don't listen, you grow stupid. No question about it. It doesn't matter if you like or not like the person's post, you may learn something as I just did now which I'll go on about here latter in this post. Also, never ignore the enemy's mouth. It serves its purpose for two things: HUMINT and a fist target. HAHAHA



    No, but I know enough that the "dark web" (Tor ) isn't all that it's cracked up to be. It was originally thought about I believe by the U.S. Navy. But some smart people got together and created the Tor network free for all to use with the fallacy of hidden and all secret. Nothing could be farther from the truth. I know the NSA has their mitts in it, I know the FBI has their mitts in it, the CIA may, and God only knows how many other foreign intelligence agencies have their mitts in it as well. The other thing is that anyone can create an exit node and sniff all that wonderful "secret" traffic. I can do this right now in a flash at the risk of trashing my current home IP address. So I'd be more apt to fire up an Amazon AWS instance or a Digital Ocean Droplet server instance to do this. Though, I'm not in the mood to monkey and pay for that right now. LOL Wait, EVIL LOL :D Besides, I've seen some pretty damn disgusting shit on there. Wound you believe I ran across a Pedo. website with some 80,000 members? Wanted to report it to the FBI, but they wanted your real name and the whole gamut so I know damn well no good deed goes unpunished so I went to the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children. Not once, but three or four damn times! Finally I see that website is either gone or moved somewhere else. Now I know I shouldn't say this, but it's necessary in an effort as to why I did what I did. Among the vast amounts of child porn crap I saw was a picture of a baby with semen on it. So yeah, that kinda bullshit is not okay in my book. Moving on...


    By real humans, yes, not by machine. Slowly machines will join the ranks of humans as they already are and eventually humans will be phased out of the ground war altogether. It sounds crazy, but if we're all still around in some fifty years from now it'll happen. And a war is chiefly won by land control, occupation. This has been true since man started to fight one another which in all intents and purposes is really quite sad. I mean, we need to get our collective shit in order and if we do there's no telling how far we can achieve things from science, medical science, engineering, space exploration, you name it. By now we should have had a town or a small city on Mars. But nope!

    Now speaking of holding the ground. The upper brass made a massive mistake during Operation Iraqi Freedom. The military would go in and clear out a town of insurgents and then leave allowing the rats to go back to their nests where once again the military had to go back in and clear out the crap yet again. Now I'm not a general, never been to war college, etc. Just a no nothing arm chair warrior, but I know based on my common sense military knowledge and history that if you conquer the ground you keep the ground. And that pisses me off as a citizen of this country. I think the Israelis learned this lesson years before we went over to Iraq. We had better learn this for the future should we ever invade Iran or North Korea. Urban combat house to house fighting requires it. Now that doesn't mean you have some three battalions as occupying forces or what ever. Depending on the size of the town or city probably three 45 troop platoons just to knock out any brush fires should they occur. In my humble opinion anyway.


    You can say that again. Here, I'll say it backwards. LOL .niaga taht yas nac uoY

    Lower and higher education is nothing but a Gestapo of propaganda ministers (teachers & professors) who are hell bent on changing the state of the union no matter what it takes. Even murder if necessary. Just look at this so-called ANTIFA horse shit with their cheap black ninja clothing crap and Nazi-like tactics. It's interesting because Hitler's chief propagandist, Joseph Goebbels once said, and I'll paraphrase, "accuse those of which you are." See how that works with the so-called "anti-fascists (ANTIFA)?


    Now that I did not know.


    Neither is the F-22 if configured with external fuel tanks, but that's just to get to a far away place if need be where refueling is not possible for some reason and by the time the jet gets there the tanks would be jettisoned. The internal bomb bay doors actually open and close withen a split second. Now that's damn impressive. Doors open, missile or bomb comes out, doors close. Just like that.


    Very wise and true words. I often wondered if the U.S. would have to go back to France a third damn time. There are neighborhoods in Paris that not even the police will enter. That's what you call BS and I for one wouldn't allow it. "Get your ass in this bus, you're deported." Don't like it, the guillotine for you, pal. Hasn't been used since circa 1977 and I think it's high time it be used again despite their "religious" protest. They do it to scores of Christians the world over. Screw you! Now I'm not saying all Muslims are terrorists, but they are... When will the so-called "peaceful" bunch come out and condemn these actions by those that pervert their faith? The left-wing knuckle draggers will tell you that Christians commit more murder, never mind the fact to murder in the Christian faith goes against the faith where in Islam its sanctioned. So with that, a double barrel middle finger salute to these idiots.



    I said the following:

    I'm sure they got it at Area-51. I'm what you call an amateur inventor and damn near every cotton picking thing I can think of someone else has beat me or eventually comes out with it. So I know for a fact that if I can think it, it's been done. Now how many knew we had stealth blackhawks? Be honest. LOL


    Thanks again. My grammar is not up to par when it comes to correct writing composition, but I do go back and proof read and make an effort at what I'm trying to convey before I hit the reply button. HAHA.
     
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  27. F22 Simpilot

    F22 Simpilot Master Survivalist
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    Once upon a time there was a drug named Ritalin who married a drug named marijuana. They had a son named introvert who grew up to become a nobody...

    When I was little I was NATURALLY hyper. My mom was told by the "doctor" to put me on Ritalin. Thankfully my mom has a higher degree in education beyond an MD called Common Sense and said no way. Latter on I settled down naturally and now my mind is hyper. HAHAHA :D
     
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2020
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