What Signs Are You Looking Out For

Discussion in 'The Hangout' started by arctic bill, Sep 16, 2018.

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  1. arctic bill

    arctic bill Expert Member
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    1) some country launched a nuclear attack
    2) financial meltdown.
    3) solar flare that takes out the communication satellites.
    4) a very fast spreading virus or disease.
    5) civil unrest leading to a civil war.
    6) a huge volcano that causes solar winter
    7) a large meteor heading to earth that is going to hit it.

    Please add to this list what signs you are waiting for to go to ground.
     
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  2. Keith H.

    Keith H. Moderator Staff Member
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    I think the virus/disease scenario is one to keep track of. Occasionally this gets a mention in the news, & then goes off the radar. Ebola had spread to a city last I heard, & then nothing. One wonders just how much gets kept quiet in the name of avoiding panic.
    Now we have an added risk of virus/disease being released from melting ice, virus/disease that has been buried for thousands of years, ones that we have no protection against.
    Keith.
    8) An increase in earthquake activity.
    I believe West Australia just had tremors!
    9) An increase in cyclone activity.
    These usually only happen in the tropics, but they had one in England some years ago in a small coastal town!
    10) An increase in crop failures due to the changing climate.
    This will effect everyone's food supply, unless of course you are growing your own. The drought here has caused crop failures including no feed in the paddocks for live stock. We had no snow this winter & haven't had any decent snow for the past 30 years!
    Keith.
     
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  3. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    11. A rising cost of energy making it impossible for the food producing countries to produce and ship the food around the world.
    12. Increasing tensions between the races and nationalities that want to come and live in the first world countries but not work or try and fit in.
    13. People are getting stupider. I don't know exactly why but we are approaching the point where our current level of civilization will no longer be supportable.
    14. Population pressures in several countries are nearing a cliff. China is trying to do something but India and most of Africa are not. When people start starving in mass their governments will start a war to take the pressure off of them. North Korea is already hanging there by a thread.
    15. My favorite...Aliens will get tired of watching us mess everything up and move to take us over.
     
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  4. Keith H.

    Keith H. Moderator Staff Member
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    All good points, amazing how many things there are that could go wrong!!!
    Keith.
     
  5. Ystranc

    Ystranc Master Survivalist
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    Pretty much all of these problems listed contain the seeds of their own solution, even the size of populations of bacteria are self regulating, there is no reason why we should be any different. When we can no longer maintain the ability to feed ourselves we die off, this is already happening around the world. Political failure, greed or stupidity only speed up the process. It is a sad inevitability, a process that has been going on since the first slime formed in the ocean and will continue. Those who cannot adapt will not survive.
    My list is nice and short,
    1. Failure to adapt, whether it's physically, mentally or behaviourally. When we stop adapting or evolving we're pretty much screwed as a species.
     
  6. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    I've always said, the human race will breed itself out of existence.
     
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  7. Oldguy

    Oldguy Master Survivalist
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    I see no one problem as being a big problem as most everything can be handled one way or another, proof being we have come this far so far.
    It is the double whammy thing I look for, stuff like a pandemic during a war, famine or other disaster.

    It was the first world war or the end of it that a simple flu virus was able to kill so many, one disaster taking advantage of another.
     
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  8. Old Geezer

    Old Geezer Legendary Survivalist
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    The things spoken of so far are, by definition, foreseeable.

    An unforeseen calamity awaits humankind.

    What is coming will require hearts of steel and souls of rare purity.

    “A calamity that makes you turn to God is better for you than a blessing which makes you forget the remembrance of God.” ― Ibn Taymiyyah
     
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  9. Oldguy

    Oldguy Master Survivalist
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    God/s is one of mankinds worst calamities .:(
     
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  10. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    OK, here is one that I worry about and can see a lot of signs poppin our past you will find that the leading cause for wars all to often comes down to religious differences. Right now Christianity is struggling and it seems that Islam is on the rise. If the Catholic church keeps protecting and more or less encouriging pedifiles to molest the children I can't see it flourishing. I worry a lot about a resurgence in Christianity that might be at least as bad as the radical islamists. Look back in history and you will find that radical Christianity has killed people in mass. The Latter Day Saints were almost wiped out by Christians. The KKK is a very Christian based group. I don't care what your gods name is. When you decide that you need to kill anyone that isn't just like you it is scary as hell. I've never understood how a faith that should be based on love and tolerance can go so wrong but it is just the nature of man.

    I commented that people seem to be getting stupider. I will go a step further. I think that our species is splitting into two or more very different types. Let's, for the sake of discussion, call them homo sapiens minimus and homo sapiens maximus. Minimus breeds like rabbits. They make little effort to insure the survival of their progeny and tent to be violent. Maximus tends to have very few progeny. Seems to be more interesting in talking about problems than doing anything about them and seems to refuse to see the world as it really is. They have a higher intelligence but don't seem to use it for much. When confronted with violence they tend to give in and sue for peace.

    The plain old Homo Sapiens is being replaced. Minimus and Maximus are running our countries and if you have any plain old Sapiens in you it is obvious that we are heading for a HUGE FALL. The only hope that I really have for Mankind is TEOTWAWKI. Every generation from here on will be less and less able to survive. Eventually the Minimus will wipe out the maximus and then starve to death. The falling number of Sapiens will be unable to survive in that world simply because we will have slowly faded away and been absorbed by the other two subspecies. The Maxius's run our educational systems and the Minimus's are taking our children's minds and polluting them with drugs and making the thugs the "coolest" that our kids try to emulate.

    How is that for a massive bit of paranoia????
     
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  11. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    i see technology as being the thing that eventually ends the human race-or most of it anyway, plenty of people know how to use a computer but haven't got a clue how to grow anything from seed or a cutting, it is said most Brits are 4 generations removed from the land.
     
  12. TCinNC

    TCinNC Well-Known Member
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    Old Geezer had it almost correct when he said "The things spoken of so far are, by definition, foreseeable." There are a few that are not reasonably foreseeable (e.g. large magnitude solar flare, massive volcano eruption) because they happen relatively quickly. However, most else is foreseeable and that's the problem. The event that will end it all will be a black swan, totally unforeseen.

    Nobody thought the assassination of Archduke Ferdinand would start a world war. The very events surrounding his assassination are actually a bit comical, making the whole affair so much more pathetic (refused to wait for military/police escort after the first attempt, driver lost sight of the convey and turned down the wrong road after the first attempt, assassins were walking home on that road dejected that the first attempt failed, and the rest is history). And very few anticipated that the Treaty of Versailles would result in the second world war.

    Whatever is coming, 99.99% won't identify it as the end until it's so obvious that it's just plain hindsight. Look at the news stories that have been out for years now about the financial collapse of the U.S. Yes, it will happen (simple math; debt to GDP ration and unfunded liabilities set to explode) but no, none of the financial gurus have any idea when. They only state the obvious (endless spending will cause catastrophe) and then scare-monger to capture headlines.

    And I won't even get into the psychology of how people interpret "signs" of every type throughout life, only to say that the most common theme is misinterpretation! That said, don't focus too heavily on this sign or that sign. Be alert, be prepared, and if you're fortunate enough to survive the first wave of catastrophe, don't be misled into thinking that you must be smarter than everyone else in reading signs.
     
  13. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    as far as the UK goes I think we are seeing the first signs, we have an obesity crisis, a drug epidemic and the gangs are running rife stabbing all and sundry as they please in London and other big cities, a police officer on one of the news reports said "we now have a feral society", so we haven't yet got a societal collapse but the seeds have been sown.
     
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  14. Dalewick

    Dalewick Master Survivalist
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    In the USA, they signs I'm looking for:

    1. Politicians are exempted from the same laws as it's citizens.

    2. Veterans and veteran groups are designated as possible terrorist.

    3. The free press manipulates facts and lies for political purposes.

    4. Infrastructure in disrepair and begins to fail. (bridges falling, routine power failures, failing water systems, etc.)

    5. Disease's begin to reappear that had been wiped out.

    6. Civil unrest becomes routine.

    7. Elected leader negatively manipulate the economy.

    8. Food becomes rationed or supplies limited.

    9. Fuel becomes rationed or supplies limited.

    10. The constitution is eliminated or ignored by all 3 branches of government. (end of the Republic)


    What's it say when your hoping for a world wide TEOTWAWKI to make things better?

    Dale
     
  15. Radar

    Radar Expert Member
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    When the U.S. has not but one to three allied countries left, but probably TEOTW before that for a lot of people.
    Yes, when the constitution is hanging by a thread.
     
  16. Sourdough

    Sourdough "ALASKAN"
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    If they passed any firearms restriction that effects me in any way.

    I closely watch the securities markets as an early warning sign. I have no financial investments.
     
  17. Rebecca

    Rebecca Expert Member
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    Other potential problems to watch include:

    The continuing decline or possible extinction of pollinators especially bees and the impact on global famine.

    The much debated climate change and the many issues that can be attributed to it. These include severe weather conditions that scientists struggle to predict that may happen in places that have not recorded such events before. Melting permafrost and as mentioned above, diseases that may be released. Catastrophic changes to ocean currents such as the Gulfstream or the Benguela Current. Changes to the jet streams. Rising water levels, and so many more.

    The possible problems of GMO seeds and the so called Terminator gene that big companies promise to never use, or release commercially. But who really trusts such massive corporations when it comes to potential profits.
     
  18. randyt

    randyt Master Survivalist
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    we're getting close but that was most likely your point.
     
  19. Pragmatist

    Pragmatist Master Survivalist
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    Good afternoon all,

    https://www.nytimes.com/2019/08/16/world/europe/birthrates-england-wales.html

    Good afternoon all,

    I'm using 3 basic indicators;

    1. the Financial Markets
    2. the Insurance Markets, especially on insurance availability and cost changes.
    3. Birth rates. Above link tells of declining birth rates in areas north of the English Channel. In the US, births are from the new immigrants (documented or undocumented, with extra copies of documents or without extra copies or even any documents).
     
  20. Sourdough

    Sourdough "ALASKAN"
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    My best indicator...........When Ladies-Women truly desire to live in the Alaska wilderness. And enjoy and thrive on the experience.
     
  21. Keith H.

    Keith H. Moderator Staff Member
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    1) Firearms restrictions (already happened).
    2) Firearm confiscations on a national scale (already happened).
    3) No warrant required for entering private homes (already happened).
    4) Ban on other weapons such as slingshots & crossbows (already happened).
    5) Crop failures due to climate change (already happened).
    6) longer term droughts & water shortages (happening now!)
    7) Federal government & local government refusing to act on climate change (already happened).
    8) Federal government cuts to social services & the closing of social help centers (already happened).
    9) Law forbidding the use of firearms for self defence & the defence of family in armed violent home invasions (already happened).
    10) Law forbidding the the possession of any object specifically for the purpose of self-defence, lethal or non-lethal (already happened).
    Keith.
     
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  22. TexDanm

    TexDanm Shadow Dancer
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    I honestly can NOT understand how you as a people allowed this and why you are not in revolt... You are in the same boat as the Chinese people that only have their bodies and bravery to stand against tanks and machine guns. It is just a matter of time before they suspend the pretense of freedom and open up gulags as Stalin did and the little fat boy in North Korea is doing now. I pray that we in America will wake up before we allow ourselves to let our government rot and become a monster.
     
  23. Dalewick

    Dalewick Master Survivalist
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    Brother, I feel bad for the good Aussie's. You got screwed. Hope this isn't illegal.

    Dale
     

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  24. Keith H.

    Keith H. Moderator Staff Member
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    18th Century militia units are allowed ;)
    Keith.
     
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  25. Keith H.

    Keith H. Moderator Staff Member
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    The explanation is easy Tex, Australians on the whole are well known for their apathy. None of the laws were given the opportunity in a referendum. Gun owners are divided, you have the target shooters, the hunters, the modern gun users, the yobboes & poachers & the muzzle-loader users. Muzzle-loader users for the most part will back all the other disciplines (except for yobboes & poachers), but none of the other groups will back muzzleloaders. So, united we stand, divided we fall. We fell!!! As one that is not Australian born, & in a minority, I did my best to rally all groups through my blogs & through popular media, but to no avail. Now I am just trying to look after number one, me. No point in bashing my head against a brick wall any longer.
    Keith.
     
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  26. Sourdough

    Sourdough "ALASKAN"
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    :rolleyes::rolleyes:.....I wonder how many poachers gave up "ALL" of their firearms......?????:rolleyes::rolleyes:
     
  27. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    what ever happens it will affect the cities first merely because of force of numbers.
     
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  28. duke in wales

    duke in wales Expert Member
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    Brexit will cause some issues for the UK population, so I see it as a trigger to possible social unrest. Delays in the ports of Calais and Dover will hit food distribution, with some empty shelves and pissed of people who don't carry a stock of of food at home protesting on the streets.

    Leaving the EU is economic and political suicide for the UK.
     
  29. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    rubbish, typical remainer speak, what we need is another "buy British" policy, all the services, all the schools, all the government departments including the HOC restaurants MUST buy british food.
    any unrest will be the usual anarchy and renta mob.
     
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  30. duke in wales

    duke in wales Expert Member
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    Not rubbish at all, the problem with buying British is that we don't make things anymore.

    We grow about 53% of the food we eat. Having a 'MUST' buy British food is OK if you want a limited diet coming from a dwindling stock pile.

    Our large automotive industry will be all but finished because of Brexit putting tens of thousands out of work when the foreign owners close down the UK plants and ship production to Europe. Its the same story for much of remaining UK industries.

    Look around your home, whats there that was made in the UK? Next to nothing. You could not set up a home solely using items made in the UK, impossible.

    'Buy British' is a nice dream but thats all it is. Much the same in the USA, we're not on our own.

    Renta mob? more a case of people who are frightened.
     
  31. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    actually we are 61% self sufficient in food and that's from the NFU.
    most if not all motor companies are owned by foreign firms.
    a "limited" diet was good enough when I was growing up before we joined the common market, we had what was "in season" and if it wasn't in season we didn't have it to eat, and nobody starved, and we didn't have an obesity crisis either, now its flown in and shipped in from all over the world, people expect it now and that's the problem. and there is now too much choice, its bewildering going into a supermarket sometimes the amount of choice there is.
    the reason stuff isn't made here is not because we cant but that its cheaper to get it from abroad, that's business, puts a lot of people out of work, look at Appledore shipyard down here, loads of expertise gone just because its cheaper to get a ship built abroad.
    people are easily frightened these days, its time they all got a backbone, stopped whining and put their country first.
    now is the right time to get out of the EU, all their economies are suffering and Germany is heading for a deep recession. they need our payments and that's why they don't like Brexit, its not because they love the Brits, far from it.
     
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  32. duke in wales

    duke in wales Expert Member
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    New NFU figures show it down to 60% and remember thats a limited range of produce. A limited range of produce was good enough fifty years ago (maybe), but not now, simply not acceptable. I love cooking and don't want to go back to the days of scragg end of lamb boiled to death with whatever root vegetables are in the shops. What do we grow in the UK during the winter that will feed the population? We rely on imported food, have done for many many decades, yes food will come in from the EU after a while but it won't be as cheap, so the low income families suffer again. The pound is down against the dollar and is near parity with the Euro again forcing prices up. I saw the writing on the wall and have substantial deposits in Europe (in local currency) so to a degree 'I'm alright Jack' as the saying goes, most people can't do that.

    Yes the motor industry is owned by foreign firms, as is a lot of UK industry and they won't stay here.

    Yes its cheaper to import goods, the UK labour force is not cheap so people buy what they can afford from where they can and you can't blame them. Where was your TV/laptop/radio/phone made? Not in the UK thats for sure.

    As for 'backbone' many will have enough of it to protest and really, I can't blame them; A none binding vote has shafted this country for many years to come.
     
  33. poltiregist

    poltiregist Master Survivalist
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    No need for the British to be afraid of freedom . Go for it . If they are real preppers there should be no problem .
     
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  34. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    the population was smaller then, and my father and my friends fathers all grew some of their own food, that dosent happen these days.
    actually food is cheap these days wasn't that way back along, food was dear and housing was cheap, now its the other way around.
    not sure where our TV was made, we got it from a relative when they upgraded theirs so its not new, my mobile is a very old Nokia, laptop is a Toshiba so that could have been made down in the factory in Plymouth not far from my old flat.
    stop going on about a "non binding vote" that's the cry of all remainers, we were told it was a once in a lifetime vote and that the result would be respected, its 3 years ago and people who lost should shut up and get behind the country, i'm fed up of the majority decision being messed about with, if Brexit isn't ratified on October 31st the Tories and Labour parties will all be history in any GE, 17.4 million leave voters will see to that.
    anyway we should get back to the thread topic, this has gone way off subject.
     
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  35. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    exactly, but are the majority of UK preppers "real" preppers? i'm not totally convinced of that.
     
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  36. poltiregist

    poltiregist Master Survivalist
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    This thread " what signs are you looking out for " . I don't expect much in the way of signs . ECONOMIS COLLAPSE would be slow but I am not worried about that because I have already prepared . Like some I don't expect to have to loot , steal or in other words I will not be in a panic after S.H.T.F. trying to gather up what I need . A NUCLEAR ATTACK could happen without any warning or we could have a hour or two , depending if you have a communication devise on and near you . An SOLAR Flare will take from one to three days to reach earth . An E.M.P. depending on the delivery system used could be delivered without any warning or we might have one hour . It takes years to really get properly prepared . Those only half a--ed prepared will probably perish if a truly apocalyptic event occurs .
     
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  37. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    anything that takes out the power grid will finish off 90% of the British population who cant even think about survival without their mobile phones, Facebook and a hot shower twice a day.
     
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  38. Morgan101

    Morgan101 Master Survivalist
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    I guess I am a little more parochial. The things that arctic Bill has on the list in the OP are things I let other people watch for me.

    The things I watch are the creek that runs through my neighborhood; the river that is a mile or so away. If the weather is bad I keep an eye on the sky. If it turns green head for the basement.

    I will look for the other things mentioned, but more through the news rather than personal observation.
     
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  39. Pragmatist

    Pragmatist Master Survivalist
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    Good morning Duke in Wales,

    In your 8:35 AM post above, please clarify / explain why the "UK labour force is not cheap ... ". Can't the UK obtain equilibrium with the labor costs of eg Poland ? What am I missing ? What did you omit ?
     
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  40. poltiregist

    poltiregist Master Survivalist
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    Probably will not happen , but scientist are closely monitoring the sun TODAY " August 20 2019 as intense wind on sun gives possible SOLAR FLARE possibility. You can check it out on SPACE WEATHER NEWS . This is why half a--ed prepping may not cut it . Likely will not happen but if it does we have from one to three days until impact .
     
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  41. duke in wales

    duke in wales Expert Member
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    A lot of Polish workers come to the UK because the pay is better. Rough idea, average polish wage around £10,000 a year, average UK wage over double that. So yes we could get equilibrium with Polish wage costs if UK workers take a 50% pay cut.
     
  42. Pragmatist

    Pragmatist Master Survivalist
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    Good morning Poltiregist,

    You made a clear point: either complete the project or anticipate failure and the related danger.

    For official emergency responses, one of the nationally-required forms/reports is the "Safety Briefing". The amateurs and minimally-experienced will have entries on team briefing on eg blood-borne pathogens and human trafficking indicators.

    The MOST IMPORTANT is the weather briefing.

    I get tailored briefings from the web. Weather monitoring before I leave this shack is the most used material for my response.
     
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  43. Pragmatist

    Pragmatist Master Survivalist
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    Good morning Duke in Wales,

    Of course you know that was my real point.

    It's not really about food costs, banging rivets into sheet steel or flying wide body civil aircraft London to Toronto. These are only the manifestations - the results - of labor costs.

    The EU had a dentist shortage because of a cartel with a voice in Brussels. It's about the same as the rest. I remember "CAP" - Common Agricultural Policy. I love gallows humor !
     
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  44. TMT Tactical

    TMT Tactical The Great Lizard !
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    When you give up your freedom, you become a "Nanny State" boy or girl. The Nanny will tell you what is good for you and also decide if you are worth saving. When you talk about "Free Health Care", what you are really talking about is taxed health care that you have little to no say over. Private health care I get to choose, what best fits my needs. Nanny state, mind set, liberal mind set from living on your knees. Afraid to be free from the E.U.
     
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  45. duke in wales

    duke in wales Expert Member
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    Tactical, you clearly have some issues there with us libertarians LOL Its rather comforting to know that I don't need to pay for treatment regardless of my previous medical history, unlike many insurance companies that won't touch you.

    As to 'getting to choose'? No you don't really get to choose, most health problems need a specific course of treatment, all you may be able to choose (if you insurance allows you to) is pick the hospital you want to receive your treatment from.

    Afraid to leave the EU? I sure am. I'm very proud of my British heritage but have come to think of myself also as a European. Don't forget the USA is a series of States that came together for strength, free trade, personal freedoms and peace the same as the EU. Are you saying your model is a failure? No of course not and neither is the EU. Leaving will cause massive damage to the UK and the knock effect will hit other members of the club...brits who choose not to see this need to wake up and smell the coffee as you guys say.
     
  46. lonewolf

    lonewolf Moderator Staff Member
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    the EU is a failing club, al their economies are slowing down and Germany is heading for a deep recession, if Germany slows down so will the rest of Europe as Germany holds the purse string, once Merkel goes anything could happen.
    all this talk of damage to the UK is just more project fear, sure there will be some alterations to our trade but that is only to be excepted, Europe isn't the only trade deal in town, there is the rest of the world who we already trade with.
    The UK economy is the 5th largest IN THE WORLD, there is no way that is going to alter just because we have decided to leave the EU club.
     
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  47. Pragmatist

    Pragmatist Master Survivalist
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    Good morning Duke in Wales,

    British contributions to the world extend well beyond those who can claim its heritage. From William Harvey to Montague Norman to Benny Hill: they're, well, world-class. (Less Lucas electrical systems for autos)

    Distortions arrive when you add your European focus.

    Recommend review in depth the foundation of the USA. A new state from Utah Territory came into the Union accepting its loss of the personal freedom of polygamy as a condition of membership.

    There is a corpus of political literature saying modern federal systems are failures. Strong central government systems are the new norm.

    Is the EU a failure ? In the last few days, NATO was - NOT - in the news. A well-rehearsed statement by POTUS Trump was posed involving Greenland. Greenland is now a valuable economic target. Hold off on the Spanish villa and contribute to some more EuroCorps snow mobiles and AirBus Industrie aircraft with skies.

    Are you writing from Malmo, Sweden ?

    I, too, am a libertarian and now having coffee (actually espresso). There's no time for me to sleep because of the EU mess. Doesn't the Malmo public library have books on the NordStream 2 pipeline ?

    Join us for some Canadian apple juice that fomented and then distilled. Like my espresso, it is NOT Sharia-compliant.

    A UK with a trade treaty with the US - includes Canada, Mexico - will work because it already is working.

    Forfeit Madrid and the Balearic Islands and with some personal sacrifice, you can struggle with Road Town, British Virgin Islands. It will be a reduced standard of living for the Brits, but "We will never surrender".

    Transmitting from the wilderness of Lord Fairfax's venture.
     
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  48. TMT Tactical

    TMT Tactical The Great Lizard !
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    Since the founding of the federal government, it has been a continuous battle and civil war fought trying to maintain states rights. I understand how personal freedom and liberties can be lost --- What I cannot understand and never will --- is how anybody can celebrate the loss of their personal freedoms. When the government prevents you from being able to defend your self, that is not to be celebrated. When you are a law abiding person, in your right mind, and you have to jump through hoops to even get limited access to firearms, again that is not something to celebrate. The U.K. is a combination of great nations and will once again take it's place in the world, once it leaves the E.U. and regains it's sovereignty. As for your personal freedom, once lost, it is very difficult to regain. That is why so many Americans keep fighting against the governments attempt to disarm us. We do not surrender our freedoms easily and never will.
     
  49. poltiregist

    poltiregist Master Survivalist
      380/460

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    Merkel ruined her country opening its boarders to foreign invaders , that want to change the country into a sh-- hole country like the one they came from . From what I surmise the country has a higher population than it can feed and are not willing to work at a competitive work salary . Worst case scenario , population reset -- city folks will starve to death and rural folks will do fine as they feed themselves . Preppers should have no problem and no worries . Best case scenario , by ushering in the free trade deal with the U.S. the British will prosper . Either way it only makes sense to be a prepper that is prepared to live year around for an indefinite time frame .
     
    Last edited: Aug 21, 2019
    TMT Tactical and randyt like this.
  50. Sonofliberty

    Sonofliberty Master Survivalist
      347/460

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    Going by your list, I would think you would have bugged out already.
     
    TMT Tactical and randyt like this.
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